RevolutionDCM for BTS

Hey, I never said DCM wasn't unbalanced. :p

But hell it's fun! :D
 
@Dale
What I really like about stack attack in theory, is your idea of creating a distinction between the tactics of a single unit attack stream verses a simultaneous unit attack. This adds a layer of tactics to a battle which is very nice and a lot of fun. Like you say, you can attack unit by unit for a certain objective, or send in a simultaneous wave of seige or arrows for another slightly different objective.

The part I can't get my head around as it stands now, is what is actually going on with ranged seige during a stack attack. I've turned off "opportunity fire" to try and understand it a bit better. The post battle reports come in with huge lists of the damage seige have done, but could they really have done that much damage?

I tried commenting out the section of the code in CivSelectionGroup: groupStackAttack where the bombardment routines fire. That seems to get rid of the disproportionate damage that seige *appear* to be doing during a stack attack. However with that commented out, ranged seige still seem able to contribute to an attack with no moves left during a single unit to unit contest. There appears to be an opportunity fire routine that is executing, but like I said, I've turned that off. :crazyeye:

Anyway, stack attack is potentially one of the greatest ideas and additions to this very beautiful game and like you say, it still is fun so long as you don't think about it too much.

Cheers.
 
@PreLynMax
The link you supplied does begin downloading this mod for me. Can you download anything else on the CivFanatics site? Is it possible that you have some kind of blocking software on your computer that prevents you downloading from CivFanatics? Can you download from other sites?
Cheers.
 
glider1 said:
@PreLynMax
The link you supplied does begin downloading this mod for me. Can you download anything else on the CivFanatics site? Is it possible that you have some kind of blocking software on your computer that prevents you downloading from CivFanatics? Can you download from other sites?
Cheers.
Click to expand...

Enclosed is the link I get when I download ANY file from CivFanatics. No, I don't have a blocker, else I wouldn't be able to download anything anywhere. This problem is limited to this site alone, and not mirrors like FileFront, ect..
 
@anyone
Does anyone have an opinion about whether it is ok that spies get experience points from barracks and great generals like any other military unit?

I don't personally think it's all that great but then again, in vanilla BTS, spies start out with one promotion (the ability to move 2 turns on roads) and in super spies, they don't start out with any unless there are barracks, intelligence agencies etc. Without any promotions at all, they move so slowly that they can be detected more readily.

@PreLynMax
I wish I could help right now but my upload volume is too small for the rest of this month, in order that I can transfer this mod into a location that you can download from. Maybe someone else can help in the short term.

Cheers.
 
I don't know if anyone else has noticed, and this is more of a complaint of the revolution aspect of this mod, but the "distant location" negative for cities effects every city except the capital. Even if a city is only 3 tiles away, it is still affected by this. Shouldn't there be a tile radius from the palace (say like 10 tiles) that don't get affected by this. And also, Shouldn't the forbidden palace and Versailles wonder do the same thing, maybe just not as large of an effect? (say 7 tiles.)
 
@Afforess
Distance location is measured from your capital so the capital won't be included. The effect scales rapidly with distance and so three tiles will have little if any distance effect at all. Ten tiles begins to show some effect.

As for the effect of Forbidden Palace and Versailles, check it out again but definetly if you have an issue, head the "complaint" in the direction of the Revolution mod forums. Jdog is a legend on the mod and will also listen.

If you are still not getting any joy, there are other ways to study the Revolutions mod like using chipotle and the ctrl key.

Cheers.
 
@Cripp
Well you obviously put in a lot of work reinstalling BTS on that computer. At least the other PC has it working. The crash happens during loading of the RevolutionDCM mod but not during loading of the Super-Spies mod. Is that correct? Assuming that is correct, try loading in RevolutionDCM without the Super-Spies addon. If that works, then there is something wrong with the way you are installing Super Spies into RevolutionDCM.

Cheers.
 
Great job on the current build. I merged it with the Wofenshanze mod for the better unit progression in it, and had total stability. Fixing the start as minor tribes -colony issue was crucial. Minor Tribes is definatly the way to go. All in all, I think the mod as set up now is perfect for my tastes. Alot of people will want to play with the ranged bombardment and stack attack though, so I can see why you want to work on those some more, but I'm loving the current setup.

Gotta chime in though and say merging with BUG would be well worth it. You'll be happy you did if you do. Also what's the plans with Inquisitions? I'm under the impression it's on hold indefinatly, no big loss but would be a nice option to have.

You might also consider adding Wolfenshanze as a custom add on like super spies, it's a great mod, and would be in the spirit of the whole thing. It's easy enough to merge yourself though, but hey it's always nice to have more options. If you're interested, but don't want to do the work I can make a compressed file (with a few tweaks) that would add on like the super spies add on for you.

Thanks for all the work, you've really improved my game.

One more quick note. In regards to the City Distance penalty in the Civ Rev mod, I've found it completely non sensical and downright annoying. So I altered it. I'm uploading the revelant files for anyone interested. It's 2 python files (utils goes in .../python/Revolution and revolution goes in ...python/Revolution/gameready), with a few dozen lines of code that changes it so it's far more intuitive (I've based it on distance to capital and communication techs/improvements, the default is based on an arbitrarily complex equation). I uploaded these code changes for jdog, but got no responce, he may like the default equation better, but I simply can find no logic to it in all the playtesting I've done with it (1000s of turns to be honest).
 
Just for the record, I've tried about 10 times to merge RevDCM with BUG and failed each and every time, I need someone with more python knowledge to take a stab at it. As bug and REV have heavy heavy python, and its a bit more complex than a simple merge.

Trying to do a mod based on both BUG and RevDCM as its base so the going is slow.
 
Phungus 420,
could you upload your merged mod of revdcm and wolfhanze anywhere ?

It looks a nice combination
 
@Phungus420 and Ket
Yep ok, enough people reckon Bug is good, so I'll upload Bug on the 28th and do a permanent merge of it into RevDCM. With regard to the Wolfenshanze mod yeah please send me your merged files as a zip and I can try and adjust it to become a permanent addon for RevDCM if you have not already done so. I have no idea about the mod and what it does, but if it is an addon, it really doesn't matter to me.

@Gekko and Phungus
Your distance-from-the-capital-thoughts are definetly something to raise with Jdog. You will get a hearing and Jdog will consider new ideas. Jdog is great like that. It certainly is an interesting idea to modify the distance from the capital according to technologies and improvements. It's very fundamental to Revolutions and altering it will change the balance in Revolutions big time. I wouldn't be surprised if Jdog is working on a master plan for it with the overhaul of Revolutions he is currently working on. I'll keep an eye on your ideas as well. I see your point about the distance-from-the-capital modifier in terms of it not being flexible enough. However on the other hand it has to be included as an important modifier as I think you would agree because there is a loyalty effect with distance in reality (even if it is not modelled perfectly in Rev). Once you get used to it, the annoyance diminishes quickly and it becomes a challenge because there are already things you can do about it. The AI is not half bad at dealing with it either these days.

Cheers.
 
Wolfshaze is a good mod, the problem is it adds a lot of new things into the game, I think it may distract to far from what REVDCM is.....

Thanks for taking a stab at BUG, it kicked my ass....
RevDCM would the the perfect SDK base for my mod.
 
@Ket
Well if Phungus can upload Wolfshaze and it is easy enough to convert as an addon, that'll leave RevDCM intact and give people the option. I agree with you that base RevDCM is cool and should be left pretty much alone EXCEPT for interface improvements like the whole heartedly supported BUG mod. Personally there is already plenty of brilliant game play in base RevDCM anyway. However I am biased towards the super spies addon myself.....:rolleyes:

Cheers
 
@Phungus
Took a look at your suggested code for the distance-from-the-capital modifier. Nice job on doing a bit of creative programming yet still keeping it concise. If I'm not wrong, here is the meat of your idea:

Code: 
1) Calculate your own custom distance modifier
2) If city not connected to capital multiply modifier by 2.5 and end
3) Else if civ has jet capability and at least one airport multiply modifier by 0.1 and end
4) Else if civ has Radio multiply modifier by 0.25 and end
5) Else if civ has Rail multiply modifier by 0.5 and end
6) Else if civ has Astronomy and at least one harbour, multiply modifier by 0.5 and end
7) Else if civ has Engineering and Horseback, multiply modifier by 0.7 and end
8) Else If civ has harbours, multiply modifier by 0.7 and end
9) Else if civ has the wheel multiply modifier by 1.2 else if not then 1.5 and end

The concept I think is to tie in the distance modifier not just with civics but also tech's and improvements. I'm no expert on sociology (can't even spell it) but from my perspective here is the good things about that:

1) You can plan forward technologically on how you want the distance modifier to effect (though the AI will be dumb to it).

2) There is a weak link between technology and distance loyalty that could and should possibly be considered (however technology seems to be paradoxical in effect because radio can be used to spread Elvis songs which passify or motherland propaganda that incites. Sometimes airports bring regions closer together because families can reunite, and sometimes airports can be seen as infiltration sources).

Here are the bad things:

1) There is not necessarily a strong link between technology and loyalty I don't think. It's more about what type of society you are (Jdog's civic's influence on distance), what culture you can transmit (Jdog's culture compensator's) plus generalised logistical penalties associated with distance (Jdog's equation distance equations), that don't necessarily change much with technology because of basic human nature to be specific to themselves (unless they can be rewarded or compensated).

2) It makes the game play a bit more techno-mechanical in thought.

That of course is only my opinion and excellent effort on tweaking Revolutions. The only real issue I have is that I would have preferred taking Jdog's base distance modifier calculation and then modifying that with coefficients and conditions as you have done. That way, you could get a more grass roots comparison between before and after. The way it stands now, not only is the distance modifier being factorised, it is also different to begin with. However, you might have done a lot of number crunching and worked out what the span of numbers actually is and then covered that in your own equation. :goodjob:

Cheers.
 
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