RFC:Antiquity

[Fierabras]

kravixon, TAM has exactly that map you show in your screenshot. You can actually pick from the small, standard, or huge version. There is also a standard size map of the middle east. TAM does use a lot of modded resources on those maps, so you have to remove/replace those first for a clean version that you could test with BTS vanilla.

 

[kravixon]

Hmm.

The "Standard" size map from TAM is a little bit smaller than we'd need for the modmod, and doesn't include Iran.
The "Huge", however, is massive. It even includes Arabia, Nubia, and to the borders of India. It's actually a really well made and beautiful map. Crete is even large enough to warrant the addition of the Minoans, and there is enough room for Sicily to actually be disconnected from Italy. Greece is rather poorly done and really small, so that would have to be redone, as would Egypt. Other than that, though, there is a huge, well made map that is already made that contains all the things that would be needed in the scenario. And modifying an existing map would save a lot of trouble.

My only problem with it is that it has large areas, such as the top of the Sahara and North of the Black Sea which will be unpopulated for our purposes, but I'm not sure if that will actually slow down the game or not.

Any thoughts?

 

[Fierabras]

Unless you go with a tilted map that contains the Mediterranean and Arabia, you will always end up with a big Sahara and a big Europe. The Huge TAM map will probably hurt most computers in the endgame.

 

[JediClemente]

Absolutely LOVE the idea. I've been waiting for something like that since I first knew of RFC.

There are many problems though. Any Antiquity mod is doomed for me if it can get past 1 AD without the romans and persians ruling most of the map. In regular RFC for example, ancient civilizations are SUPPOSED to get overrun by the later ones, and Europeans are most of the times far ahead in techs and score.

Also, in RFC big empires occupying another civ's core areas are very short-lived, and it should not be the case here.

I think it would be interesting for the map to include part of India and Central Asia (at least to the extent of the limits of classic Persia and Alexander's Empire), restrict the Sahara and Eastern Europe to a mininum, even leaving out most of Brittania.

 

[JediClemente]

Another possibility is to make a map with just the Eastern Mediterranean, Middle East and Persia and let it run for the period 3000 - 300 BC...

 

[The Q-Meister]

Many people have talked about a classical era based RFC previously and I personally think it would be amazing.

Though it's not absolutely necessary, I think it would be nice to have at least some part of India represented in the game considering how important the trade route was for many Near East economies as well as being historically relevant to conquerers such as Alexander.

But with or without India it would be truly fascinating. While not a modder myself would be willing to help research wise anyway I could.

 

[The Q-Meister]

Also 'vassals' and defensive pacts must come in much earlier than in regular RFC (obviously) it's shame that there are such few diplomatic features in the ancient era in regular CIV as the great classical powers like Rome and Persia frequently had client states or vassals, allies, diplomatic agreements and what not.

Places that were never fully conquered in the classical era such as Germany and Scotland should be uber-barb land; with incredibly fierce warriors becoming more and more aggressive as time goes on if their power remains checked....

 

[War Bear]

I agree with barbs being tougher in Germania. Perhaps they should recieve free woodsman promotions? (Teutoberg Wald, anybody?)

 

[JediClemente]

So is this in progress or what?

 

[kravixon]

I guess so, but don't expect any real progress for a little bit. I just had my audition for my college's school of music so I have a lot more free time. I'll probably start on the map in a day or so.

 

[JediClemente]

OK, just telling as I'm willing to help. No experience with XML or Python though, but with C++ or anything else.

 

[Ambassador]

I'd recommend to you a slightly altered map. As to now, most of Sahara and Russian mainland would be just useless. So you could 'turn' the map a little bit. Like this:

(there was actually a map like this used in Civ2)

 

[PPQ_Purple]

I would love to see this happen.
I am a total noob when it comes to moding, but I am offering your help if you need any with the developement of concepts and ideas for this mod (U. Victory conditions, U. units, U. structures... features)

 

[JediClemente]

kravixon, are you still working on this?

I was having an idea.

UP- Pax Romana: while at peace, Rome has no stability penalty for number of cities and controlling another civ's core areas.

 

[kravixon]

I'm on spring break, so I don't have my computer with me, but so far I haven't really gotten anything done. I invested a few hours working on bmp mapping, which I just couldn't get to work right.

After RFCEurope is released as a Beta, some of the people working on it had expressed interest on helping with this. Until that point comes or we can find a mapper, the project won't begin to materialize. I've started a map, similar to Ambassador's slanted one, but it's manually edited and I don't really have much done on it at all.

Until more help can be found or I at least come out with a really rough map, all that can be really done is come up with civs, powers, unique units, a tech tree, wonders, and maybe a list of events to happen (like maybe the Olympics during the Classical age).

 

[kravixon]

Also, my ideas for civs and their unique units. We could make two unique units for each civ, but I don't know enough about each civilization to come up with a second one for each one.

Athens= Some kind of Trireme, the current Phalanx replacing spearmen
Sparta= Spartan Hoplites (stronger phalanx, replacing axemen), current Phalanxes replacing spears
Macedon= Companion Cavalry, Piked Phalanx (The varietas D. mod's greek pikemen come to mind)
Rome= Praetorians, some kind of earlier legionary
Carthage= Numidian Cav, War elephants
Phoenicia= Some kind of Galley, some kind of Trireme
Persia= Immortals, War Elephants
Egypt= War Chariot, no idea
Bablyon= Their current bowmen, the Sumerian vultures
Hittites= Bronze chariots, no idea
Assyria= I don't know enough about them
Celts/Gauls= either woad raiders or some sort of Gallic warrior, or both

 

[mike6426]

Any Israel/Judea for that list?

 

[micbic]

Athens AND Sparta? These civs will either have to colonize or play an OCC.

 

[BurnEmDown]

If there is going to be Judea, then one UU is kinda written into it: The Maccabi.

 

[ZachScape]

Also, my ideas for civs and their unique units. We could make two unique units for each civ, but I don't know enough about each civilization to come up with a second one for each one.

Athens= Some kind of Trireme, the current Phalanx replacing spearmen
Sparta= Spartan Hoplites (stronger phalanx, replacing axemen), current Phalanxes replacing spears
Macedon= Companion Cavalry, Piked Phalanx (The varietas D. mod's greek pikemen come to mind)
Rome= Praetorians, some kind of earlier legionary
Carthage= Numidian Cav, War elephants
Phoenicia= Some kind of Galley, some kind of Trireme
Persia= Immortals, War Elephants
Egypt= War Chariot, no idea
Bablyon= Their current bowmen, the Sumerian vultures
Hittites= Bronze chariots, no idea
Assyria= I don't know enough about them
Celts/Gauls= either woad raiders or some sort of Gallic warrior, or both

Rome= How about a Legionary?

Phoenecia= UU both ships, probably not. A replacement for a galley-type is a must, but the 2nd could be a form of scout or settler.

Babylon= Information About military:

Spoiler :

Military
Little is known of the Babylonian military from either the Old or New Empires, although Hammurabi’s army of the Old Empire may have made important use of chariots when these were first coming into use.The New Empire armies probably copied much from the Assyrians. This would suggest that Babylonians made extensive use of cavalry, especially mounted bowmen. Foot troops probably used iron weapons and wore iron helmets and some chain mail armor. The Babylonians and their less advanced allies, the Medes, took three heavily fortified Assyrian cities in short succession, suggesting they had mastered the Assyrian techniques for storming cities.
-http://www.angelfire.com/empire2/unkemptgoose/Babylonian.html

Hittites= Instead of bronze, it should be iron. They were know for their advances in iron.

Assyria= Form of Horse Archers/Lancer:

Spoiler :

The Assyrians would experience fewer problems with Cavalry when they were deployed as Lancers; under Tiglath Pileser III, the Assyrian Cavalry continued to be paired of but this time each warrior holds his own lance and controls their own horse. By the 7th century B.C., mounted Assyrian warriors were well armed with a bow and a lance, armored with lamellar armor and their mounts equipped with fabric armor, providing limited yet useful protection in close combat and against missiles. Cavalry would form the core of the later Assyrian armies.
-http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_history_of_the_Assyrian_Empire#Weapons

Battering Ram: Quite a lot of information could be seen here:

Spoiler :

The Battering ram appears to be one of the best Assyrian contributions to siege warfare... They consisted of a tank-like wooden frame on four wheels. There was a small tower on top for archers to provide covering fire as the engine moved forward. When it had reached its destination, its primary weapon, a large spear, was used to batter away and chip pieces of the enemy wall. Whilst this would have been almost useless against stone walls, one must keep in mind that mud and not stone was used to build walls... Walls were strengthened with time and the Assyrians responded by building larger engines with bigger "spears". In time, they closely resembled a large and long log with a metal tip at the end. Even stone would not withstand pounding by a larger weapon. Larger engines accommodated greater numbers of archers. To protect against fire (which was used by both sides at the Siege of Lachish) the battering ram would be covered in wet skins
-http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_history_of_the_Assyrian_Empire#Weapons

-This also gives me an idea for three new buildings: Variations of walls; Mud, Wood, Stone.

Edit:
Also there needs to be Etruscan and Hebrew UUs.

Spoiler :

BTW... This may not be appropriate to ask but nobody commented on Post #11. Can someone just say if they would/ would not like to see any of my ideas implemented. Also if they are possible or not.