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Rhye's and Fall of Asia - Version 0.8

Discussion in 'Rhye's and Fall Modmods' started by civ-addicted, Sep 4, 2011.

  1. civ-addicted

    civ-addicted Chieftain

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    I just read Brunei was much bigger once than today, but their peak was just at the end of the timeline, so they doesn't qualify. They better be represented by an indie city.

    As it turns out, after cleaning up the LH switch mechanism, i didn't live through any CTDs in the few games i played :whew: I'm crossing fingers that it stays that way.
     
  2. Songkok

    Songkok Chieftain

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  3. civ-addicted

    civ-addicted Chieftain

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    The Ainu are a great idea. I always liked the civs that didn't do that well in history (Tocharians in here, Makuria in SoI etc.), so it's up to you to turn them into something powerful.
    Unfortunately, i'm really close to beta, and yet another civ, including balance it out because it's an early one, would throw back my schedule. I think if we manage to have more of a balanced beta and i'm bored again, i'll release a modmodmod a la RFCE++, adding a whole bunch of more civs. I have even more in mind: Xiongnu, Hephtalites, Pala, Gujarat, Funan, Champa; Brunei could be in too.
     
  4. The Turk

    The Turk Chieftain

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    Wow! :eek:
    I remember when RFC Asia first came out, and now a couple years later, I cannot believe the improvement, and I'm sure it will only get better! Good job civ-addicted on this excellent mod, and I'll continue to support this mod into the future! Also would you please consider adding an SVN link, so people, such as myself can keep updated on the work of this mod. It helps others, to help you improve the mod, by seeing what goes on in between stages.


    PS. What is the music module? Do I need to download it?
     
  5. civ-addicted

    civ-addicted Chieftain

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    Well, thanks!:D Thinking of SoI, the two years it's alive to be where it is now is a long time...:p
    There is a SVN link, it's just not up-to-date. The computer i play the game on isn't the same i work on, and it's a bit more complicated to upload revisions.
    I think that when the Beta is out the revisions will come more frequently. That is possible next week, but maybe i have to delay it by a week because i reworked the MoH mechanic and it's sort of half baked right now.
    The music module are a list of additional tracks, but you don't need it to play the mod. It's pretty big (i think half the size of the mod itself), so i thought it to be better to have it as an additional download. There is some Asian music in the original download, but it's only 10ish tracks for the whole game.
    I'm also about to change it because i can't stand Indian music in such an overdose the music module offers it.
     
  6. The Turk

    The Turk Chieftain

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    Also Civ-Addicted may I recommend creating a user manual (like the one is SoI) for Beta version. Also can you please change the background, to something a little bit nicer to look at. Currently the font and the image are quite bad. I'd recommend a Chinese/Japanese painting and then for the loading screen perhaps a South Asian one (Indian battle or something..)
     
  7. civ-addicted

    civ-addicted Chieftain

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    It's somewhere in the back of my mind that the main menu needs an overhaul. Feel free to propose a picture and/or a track to play.
     
  8. Linkman226

    Linkman226 #anarchy

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  9. The Turk

    The Turk Chieftain

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    Here are my suggestions:

    Main Background:
    This
    OR
    This
    OR
    This

    Loading Screen Background:
    This
    OR
    This
    OR
    This

    @Linkman, your second one is nice, although it shows the rest of the world, that is not included, but I'm not much in favor of your first one...
    Also the first one made me realize how cool it would be if you could make RFC Europe, Sword of Islam and RFC Asia into one large mod, that would be AMAZING.....

    Also what historical Empire is the Indo-Greek one supposed to represent, as I've never heard of them.. for me its always skipped from Alexander's conquests, to the formation of the Mauryan Empire, right after the Greek collapse. Also can you please reduce/remove the animal barbarians. I can't take this mod seriously, when I'm fighting jaguars, I mean this was never a problem for Kingdoms, if there was a jaguar or lion near their borders. In my opinion the whole barb.py file should be changed so it symbolized ACTUAL historical invasions by different groups that can be characterized as barbarians in this mod, much like how SoI organizes the various barbarian invasions, whether they be Bulgarian barbarians or Turkic Barbarians.
     
  10. Linkman226

    Linkman226 #anarchy

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    RFC Old World?

    But it would have either:

    1) 60+ civs

    2) The low detail of regular RFC
     
  11. The Turk

    The Turk Chieftain

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    (lol, Linkman I was just kidding, I really don't think its possible, in the same in detail capacity that each mod offers...)
     
  12. Optical

    Optical The Fall of the Eleventh

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    Help me. I don't know where I am.
    It could work, if you pared the number of civs down to about 50, used one of those big 50civ DLL mods as the base and used the mapsize of GEM...

    I might have to try this mod again, it looks like it's progressed a lot since I last played it :)
     
  13. Leoreth

    Leoreth 心の怪盗団 Moderator

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    I don't like historical depictions of scenes for the title screen, it's too distracting imo. Then I'd still prefer the current one, or the first Linkman linked. Linkman's second is quite apt for the loading screen imo, to keep with RFC's theme of using maps there.
     
  14. merijn_v1

    merijn_v1 Black Belt

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    No one likes my background?:(:cry:

    I'm, just kidding. I someone of you said, but a bit difficult to look at. (Although I still think it's a nice picture) It should indeed be "softer" in the eye. I think the last one of the ones that The Turk suggested a loading screen (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/26/MongolArcher.jpg) is nice for the Background, and the loading screen stays as it is now.
     
  15. civ-addicted

    civ-addicted Chieftain

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    I thought of it as the Macedons (who founded Kandhara), the Seleucids, the Graeco-Bactrians and the actual Indo-Greek Kingdom. First, i wasn't sure if i should name them Greeks, and they were ethnical Greeks, but their culture which involved a lot of Buddhism diverse them from the Greeks itself; i think it can be compared to England-USA or Dutch-Boer relations. So don't necessarily think of it just as the Indo-Greeks, hence the capital which is the first Greek city in Asia, not Sialkot.
    I didn't know about them at all, and it's always nice to learn some historical facts:) That always makes me want to learn more, although is so far from the scientific field i'm working on.
    I think the animals are an essential part of CIV; no animals at all wouldn't be historical either. Your workers outside of your borders (connecting 2 cities f.e.) needs protection, and i can't imagine that prioneer-like workers who buildt Qin Shi Huangdi's Great Wall didn't have any soldiers with them. That's the whole point of animals.
    They are no real threat for soldiers, but they fill up the void space, putting life on the map and make the whole game more pleasant to look at imo.

    Oh, and thanks for the suggestions. I think can make multipe designs, which everyone can choose from whatever one likes best (@merijn: i'll keep the current one as RFCA-classic;))
     
  16. The Turk

    The Turk Chieftain

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    Thats interesting that you added them, I would have seen them more as a minor faction, that you could have added, rather than a full out civilization. The very fact that they did not exist for very long (only 190 years), plus the fact that they were overshadowed by the Sassanid Persians and Mauryan Indians further makes them insignificant in the overall scope of things. I would therefore instead replace them with the far more significant Kushan Empire and Gupta Empire, especially the Gupta's who persided over an Indian Golden Age of scientific advancement and cultural affluence and a recall to Hinduism, as the Mauryans had been Buddhist. Not to mention both these states survived FAR longer than the Indo-Greeks did. It should be remembered for example that it was the Kushans would build the Bamiyan Buddhas, and become very rich due to the silk road. Overall there are a lot more ways to integrate these two great Empires then the vaguely mentioned Yuezhi and Indo-Greeks, who seem to have play little to no role in shaping the area, while the two largest Empires of the time the Kushans and the Guptas are left out.

    PS. Also the Yuezhi it seems were a nomadic people who migrated around Central Asia for some 54 years only, I mean really civ-addicted, don't you think the Kushans who were great patrons of the arts and trade who lasted hundreds of years should be represented rather than the Yuezhi who at best can be represented by a minor state or barbarian cities. In my opinion they are not important enough either (along with the Indo-Greeks) to warrant having a place in this mod, which focuses on such a wide timeframe.


    Another aspect I wanted to talk to you about was Japan. To make Japan more interesting, I would recommend having an independent Kyoto, or whatever the Capital is, and have an Emperor who resides there. You could then have different minor Japanese states, that pop up ever once in a while, to break up Japan, forcing the player to reunite Japan, and recapture the Emperor unit, who must stay where ever the capital is. Currently it seems that Japan is too passive sitting on its own island, with little competition over the grand scheme of time.

    Although I still disagree with animals, its your mod, so if you feel its necessary then fine, but I would like to stress the inclusion of historically accurate barbarian movements and invasions, rather than random invasions. You should name barbarians, so their called Yuezhi Horsearcher or Jurchen Rider, or whatever. Following on this, the inclusion of province system, might be in order, as it has a lot of benefits when it comes to creating a historical mod. Creating provinces would have the added affect of making UHV's more interesting, it would make mercenaries easier to implement (restrict them to certain provinces), city placement, conquering whatever would all be more simplified if you had border provinces and core provinces. Overall this would create a lot funner game to play, if you had such dynamic regions that would change between Empires and Kingdoms.

    As for the background, you are free to pick whichever one you would like. I mean no offense to Merjin, they were nice placeholders, but they are kind of hard to look at. Also the loading screen one is ok-ok, it could be better, and I would recommend the Indian (South Asian) one or the one of the Chinese army charging, both of them in my opinion make good loading screens, while the Nomadic Horse Archer would make a good background. Overall just look for something professional looking, without too glitzy font, thats easy to read. Even Embryodead's minimalist background for SoI, with just a desert was quite amazing, considering that it was just an image of a desert. So thats my two-cents on it.

    Tell me what you think of my suggestions.

    PPS. Please upgrade the detail of the map/terrain and the resources, including camels, as they look quite bad overall. There are several modcomps which make terrain look a LOT nicer. Here is one that I have implemented into RFC and vanilla BtS that makes the terrain and water a lot nicer to look at:

    (I can't find it -___-) -- I'll find it for you tonight...
     
  17. Leoreth

    Leoreth 心の怪盗団 Moderator

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    I rarely hit into the same mould as The Turk regarding civs that (capital letters) HAVE to be in for historical reasons, but I agree on the Guptas as a proper civ for the reasons already mentioned, golden age of India and whatnot.
     
  18. merijn_v1

    merijn_v1 Black Belt

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    Don't worry. I also think it's quite hard to look at. When I picked it, I just thought it was a nice picture. I didn't take in mind that it's hard to look at it. The background should be changed indeed.
     
  19. Leoreth

    Leoreth 心の怪盗団 Moderator

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    That said, in my opinion one of the battle depictions are even harder to look at than the current title screen.

    I think the title screen should be something that's not too complex but conveys the general topic of the mod, while the loading screen can be a historical depiction.
     
  20. civ-addicted

    civ-addicted Chieftain

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    First of all, i mentioned some days ago that those civs that didn't do well in history are the most interesting for me, and thinking of how the Yuezhi kept my interest from day one there is really no way ever that i will remove them.
    I made resurrections to work again, and some civs get a special respawn; one of the is the Tocharians to respawn as Kushana, so they will be represented in the future. They won't be playable though; Leoroth scared the poop out of me as he told me that the Italian respawn took immense effort to work:lol: Maybe someday there will be a modmod that adds more civs, but i didn't plan that in the near future. I usually try to favor personal life, and there is about to happen a lot in the next year for me.
    Black Whole introduced the Greeks, and he had them planned as unplayable Seleucids; i found it unbearable unsatisfying that the game didn't allow me to play them, so i gave them everything they needed, and, step by step, they accidentally became what they are now. Not to mention that i'm trying to make a LH for them is showing that they have a sincere place in my heart:) On the global context, they do have a minor place, but, well, they are fun to have, and of course to play.
    So summarized, i won't delete an interesting civ, but i also won't add a boring civ out of pure historicity.
    I'm still figuring out how i should add Gupta. There are three options:
    - Maurya to changing to Gupta when they adopt Hinduism
    - scripted collapse of Maurya, scripted respawn as Gupta.
    - Full blown civ.
    Adding them would gnaw at my conscience because i told other requesters that i won't adding any more civs. But having them would result in a possibly more balanced and historical Northern India, adding some challenge for the civs around that area. There is some art flowing around...
    ...
    I'd have to delay the Beta...and i also didn't want to spend that much time anymore...i just don't know...
    Can everyone live with a delayed Beta which is possibly buggier and more unbalanced than expected?
    That seems like a lot of work to make a civ that doesn't totally suck more interesting. Sorry, but no.
    Don't you know that there are millions of things out there that's trying to kill you that aren't human?

    I already said that i'm not trying to make provinces; it's a great concept that caused a revolution in RFC modding, as i see. I simply say that it's a way too huge effort now. Not on my watch, sorry.
    Mercenaries have been here, but they have been removed by request (i think it was me, and merijn backed me up), and there wasn't any complaints so far. Except for Turkish mercenaries by Tang (Battle of Talas) and the Ghulam (who are the Ghaznavid UU), they wasn't that important either.
    I love SoI's main screen, because it manages to be excellent in all it's simplicity. A desert and letters. Genius. I doubt that i can come up with something like that without actually copying it.
    I'm trying to have multiple designs for every culture so as few people as possible are unhappy;) If someone could find a good painting from SE Asia, that'd be great. Also, does anyone know a font that looks like Mongol script?
    I thought the Terrain graphics are the same as in SoI?
    I'll try something about the camel graphics; it shouldn't be too hard to give them some motion, and even if i have to use the ones the horse uses.
    Well, pretty much this.
     

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