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[R&F] Rise and Fall General Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by bite, Nov 28, 2017.

  1. kzcosme

    kzcosme Chieftain

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    Two games so far. Really enjoyed playing the Cree and Mapuche and the IA is significantly better.

    The Cree scouts were very useful and got upgraded to powerful Spec Ops, that were useful to strike Cleo - she backstabbed me and triggered an emergency at another continent; the parachute ability did the trick in a few turns. France didn´t want my SV and sent waves of spies to disrupt my projects.

    With the Mapuche, I built lots of their UI to get a CV and played the loyalty game with Arabia. Two wars and two cities flipped to me without any siege. The spies were very useful too.
    Alexander tried to get one of mine CS and I decided to declare a Protectorate War. I levied some close CS army and beat Alexander badly just for the fun. The time I got the CV he had only 2 cities (roughly 25% of his original cities).
     
  2. pgm123

    pgm123 Emperor

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    How is there an emergency triggered by killing a barbarian?
     
  3. Mojo85

    Mojo85 Warlord

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    How strong are city states in combating flipping? Reason I ask is I’ve surroudned Vilnius on 3 sides with 3 ten pop cities and put Amani in there and their loyalty hasn’t budged.
     
  4. leandrombraz

    leandrombraz Emperor

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    It's possible to flip but they are strong. I had a CS surrounded by highly populated cities too, it never had loyalty issues. They get a loyalty bonus, you can see it in the loyalty lens. I don't remember if it's +10 or +20.
     
  5. sonicmyst

    sonicmyst Emperor

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    I think as a CS it is +20, on top of the other modifiers.
     
  6. miaasma

    miaasma Prince

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    does anybody else feel like most governor promotions aren't very good?

    aside from magnus and maybe one or two others
     
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  7. Zenstrive

    Zenstrive Ocean King

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    So how do you actually reduce your neighbour's loyalty?
     
  8. sonicmyst

    sonicmyst Emperor

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    Place Amani with Prestige and Emissary promotions to the nearest city state of your target neighbor.
    Place all possible governors in boundary cities.
    Place all policies with loyalty boost and amenity boost.
    Target civs in Dark age while you are in Golden age.
    Use spies with reduced mission time promotion.
    Use policies that boosts spies.
    Refuse trade of luxuries to the target civ.
     
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  9. Mr Jon of Cheam

    Mr Jon of Cheam Prince

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    Run Bread and Circuses.
    Pillage their luxury tiles.

    I think them being in a dark age is the biggest factor, at least it has been for me so far.
     
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  10. Leyrann

    Leyrann Deity

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    Not seen this one, very important, assassinate their governors before running the reduce loyalty mission, except if they're already losing loyalty even with governor.

    If you're at war, you can also conquer a city further back to move their defensive pressure and then give it back (erasing warmonger penalties) after their cities on your border flip to free cities.
     
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  11. Disgustipated

    Disgustipated Deity

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    I always forget about this one, but I still have the bad habit of not building entertainment districts until late.

    I flipped several cities in my peaceful Cree game (peaceful except me participating in an emergency that is) without bread and circuses. It helped I was in a golden age and the Mongols was in a normal age. I did use Armani with only the +2 loyalty towards your cities promotion. Other cities I wanted to flip I couldn't. I did get a former city state to flip to me, but I couldn't liberate it unfortunately.
     
  12. Lord Lakely

    Lord Lakely Idea Fountain

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    Also, all of these at once if your target isn't in a worse age.

    There really isn't an efficient way to flip Cities peacefully without investing in a lot of resources. Not like it matters much though. Loyalty's utility lies in curbing runaway warmonger AI's and forward-settling, which it does efficiently.
     
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  13. Leyrann

    Leyrann Deity

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    I just want to say, if the Olympics ever get added in any way, the Netherlands need to get a powerful boost for all Winter Olympics.
     
  14. God of Kings

    God of Kings Ruler of all heads of state

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    Oh, and either the Cree or Scotland needs to be able to construct curling rinks.
     
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  15. leandrombraz

    leandrombraz Emperor

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    Correct me if I'm wrong but governors (aside from Amani) and happiness only help to keep your city loyal, it won't affect other civs, so placing governors in boundary cities is only necessary if your cities have loyalty issues, same for happiness. Only loyalty from population affect other Civs cities and from other sources that specifically say it does.
     
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  16. Leyrann

    Leyrann Deity

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    @Browd Should the Patch Notes thread be updated with the hotfix notes?
     
  17. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    NOTE: Governors do not appear to exert external pressure beyond Amani's 2 promotions. I have tested lots and seached for any hints they do in texts... nada
    Space projects have changed hugely, please do not double them.
    Korolevs huge production bonus can only now be used for one project. Chopping is nerfed in this way
    The Royal Society tier 3 govt building allows you to expend one builder per turn toward a project in that city. The whole builder is expended and each charge is worth 3% (modifiable by the likes of Hong Kong)
    No longer can you finish all science projects in one turn unless you had a max size city of trees and stone.
    Science city states now give their science to buildings, library at 3 and uninat 6, quite a change.
    Higher population... more cities in range appear to be more powerful than more pop but both are valid.
    Bread and Circus is twice as strong and a dark/golden era but you do need an entertainment district
    Create starvation in the city by looting
    Remove as many amenities from the target civ
    Use a spy to temp reduce loyalty (poor choice unless its very weak), Create rebels (not bad), nullify governor (powerful)
    Reduce pop or raze cities around the target that are of the same Civ
    Use Amani's Emissary promotion
    As per the top, does not appear to have been designed this way
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2018
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  18. Giskler

    Giskler +1 Sleuthing

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    This is honestly something Norway should get considering we've won the most medals combined in all Winter Olympics games held :p
     
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  19. leandrombraz

    leandrombraz Emperor

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    Did you teste Bread and Circus? I was using it but I wasn't a 100% sure about exactly what it was doing. It only increase the population loyalty, so it only affect that -20/+20 population range, right? It won't add loyalty on top of that 20. Also you get +20 once the project is finished, how does it works? It fix the population loyalty to +20? How much time the effect last?
     
  20. Alexander's Hetaroi

    Alexander's Hetaroi Deity

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    Good way to add in canals to the game as well.
     

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