Santorum or Khameini? Can you tell the difference?

[JollyRoger]

The bigger freaks are those howling about a community center at an abandoned Burlington Coat Factory.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

No, the ones who consistently go out of their way to attack... the people who freak out about a cross on public land, that is actually a soldier's memorial, etc.

Not sure I'd label that atheist extremism, since I am not aware of some atheist rulebook that demands the removal of all religious symbols.

Intolerance extremists maybe. I can't think of a catchy title at the moment.

I don't judge if you don't believe. That's your choice. I do feel some sadness for you, and hope that things will change, but that's well out of my arena.

Aw shucks, don't be sad. My choice is not one of sadness. There's a lot of joy to be gotten out of atheism.

 

[Antilogic]

Does anyone really feel like the US government forces them to be Christian?

As far as US society goes, definitely yes. The government is more ambiguous.

 

[MobBoss]

As far as US society goes, definitely yes.

I'd argue against that. A lot.

 

[Traitorfish]

Not sure I'd label that atheist extremism, since I am not aware of some atheist rulebook that demands the removal of all religious symbols.

There's probably some old Jacobin pamphlets to that effect, but unless somebody happen to identify as a Hébertist as well as an atheist, I can't see why they should feel obliged to follow through with it.

 

[del62]

What is the point of this post? There are big differences between the two except in the minds of the simplistic.

Its like saying Hitler and Merkel are the same because they both led Germany and shat on Greece.

 

[kochman]

Not sure I'd label that atheist extremism, since I am not aware of some atheist rulebook that demands the removal of all religious symbols.

Intolerance extremists maybe. I can't think of a catchy title at the moment.

You don't need a rule book to exercise similar actions...
Anyhow, most atheists are fine with me being Christian, and vice versa... the crusading atheists... blah...

As far as US society goes, definitely yes. The government is more ambiguous.

Give me one example of how the US government has pushed Christianity on you in the last year?

Our society is Christian, but our state is secular... a good combo.

 

[Cutlass]

No, the ones who consistently go out of their way to attack... the people who freak out about a cross on public land, that is actually a soldier's memorial, etc.
Does anyone really feel like the US government forces them to be Christian?
I don't judge if you don't believe. That's your choice. I do feel some sadness for you, and hope that things will change, but that's well out of my arena.

If you want a successful career in the Air Force it does. Or in politics.

 

[kochman]

If you want a successful career in the Air Force it does. Or in politics.

Nonsense.
I knew many atheist officers, quite successful, in the Army and Air Force, including family members... nice try.

As for as politics, this is also nonsense, atheists have been elected... as well as those who just pay lip service to religion.

Not true, please provide some anecdotal evidence though.

The bottom line is, I have never felt one bit of pressure, from the government, on what to worship or not worship... even satanic churches get tax exemptions...

 

[Cutlass]

Nonsense.
I knew many atheist officers, quite successful, in the Army and Air Force, including family members... nice try.

As for as politics, this is also nonsense, atheists have been elected... as well as those who just pay lip service to religion.

Not true, please provide some anecdotal evidence though.

The bottom line is, I have never felt one bit of pressure, from the government, on what to worship or not worship... even satanic churches get tax exemptions...

Posted at 07:17 PM ET, 02/08/2012
Religious intolerance is rampant in today’s Army, Air Force and Navy
By Michael L. ‘Mikey’ Weinstein


...


At the Military Religious Freedom Foundation, we know of an altogether different reality. For the past seven years our list of persecuted clients within the American armed forces has grown to “biblical” proportions.

We now have 26,300-plus clients (96% of whom are Christian and hundreds more streaming in monthly). This stands as a shameful testament to the fact that the military ranks have been inundated by dangerous, fundamentalist, evangelical Christian fanaticism.

This irrefutable sickness portends only the gravest consequences for troop morale, national security, and the civil rights standards which we've grown to appreciate over 223 years since the adoption of the U.S. Constitution

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...orce-and-navy/2012/02/08/gIQAAwAxzQ_blog.html

 

[caketastydelish]

By definition, most single line quotes are out of context... unless he just went up to the podium, made some statement and said, "that is all" (then walks away happy with himself).


Anything he says NOW, yes, they are still going through the archives of stupid things he has said over his long career, and since there are so many things, you can't bring it all out at once... you know?
We've had years of national scrutiny on Obama now... most of his more wacky things are out there (my personal favorite was when he talked about how bitter people cling to their guns and religion, something that if paraphrased could easily sound like a potential Hitlerian thing to say).

When Obama said "people cling to their guns and religion" he was practically making an anti-gun and anti-religious point.

his "cling to the guns" quote was:
"And it's not surprising then that they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations,"

Oh yeah, this really sounds like something Hitler would say. Anyway Obama has been the President for nearly 4 years, and he's been a senator before that, and even before that he was of prestige... even when he was in college he was the President of the Harvard Law review. The man has been in the "spotlight" for some time. Even with all this being said, I don't think there's a single Obama quote that can make him seem like he's similar to Hitler or the dictator of Iran.

The only semi-valid point would be "he was in the church of Jerimiah Wright". Which by the way, seems to be a church he both joined and left for political convinence.

 

[Ayatollah So]

Sorry, but the thread starter isn't living up to his username. To quote a famous philosopher*, "Never interrupt the enemy while he is making a mistake." Santorum is the mistake. Let it be made. Please, oh please Flying Spaghetti Monster, amen.

Ridicule Santorum after the primary is settled, K? Thx Bye.

* Napoleon Bonaparte

 

[kochman]

When Obama said "people cling to their guns and religion" he was practically making an anti-gun and anti-religious point.

his "cling to the guns" quote was:
"And it's not surprising then that they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations,"

Oh yeah, this really sounds like something Hitler would say. Anyway Obama has been the President for nearly 4 years, and he's been a senator before that, and even before that he was of prestige... even when he was in college he was the President of the Harvard Law review. The man has been in the "spotlight" for some time. Even with all this being said, I don't think there's a single Obama quote that can make him seem like he's similar to Hitler or the dictator of Iran.

The only semi-valid point would be "he was in the church of Jerimiah Wright". Which by the way, seems to be a church he both joined and left for political convinence.

It is something Hitler could say...
He instituted gun control and looked down on religion hugely...

I completely agree about the Wright church, by the way...

 

[Ajidica]

He instituted gun control

Odd, given that most of his support came from the paramilitary Freikorps and Blackshirts.

looked down on religion hugely...

Except when he was trying to make Protestantism into some sort of Aryan Supremacy religion with the phrase "God is with us" emblazoned on the SS belt buckles.

 

[caketastydelish]

It is something Hitler could say...
He instituted gun control and looked down on religion hugely...

I completely agree about the Wright church, by the way...

Someone has posted this very same thing on civfantics before, and I thought it was very interesting so I saved the post. Here it is...


"I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord.." Adolf Hitler.

My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded only by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was His fight for the world against the Jewish poison. To-day, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before in the fact that it was for this that He had to shed His blood upon the Cross. As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice.... And if there is anything which could demonstrate that we are acting rightly it is the distress that daily grows. For as a Christian I have also a duty to my own people.... When I go out in the morning and see these men standing in their queues and look into their pinched faces, then I believe I would be no Christian, but a very devil if I felt no pity for them, if I did not, as did our Lord two thousand years ago, turn against those by whom to-day this poor people is plundered and exploited. Adolf Hitler

Just as the Jew could once incite the mob of Jerusalem against Christ, so today he must succeed in inciting folk who have been duped into madness to attack those who, God's truth! seek to deal with this people in utter honesty and sincerity. Adolf Hitler

It matters not whether these weapons of ours are humane: if they gain us our freedom, they are justified before our conscience and before our God. Adolf Hitler

We are a people of different faiths, but we are one. Which faith conquers the other is not the question; rather, the question is whether Christianity stands or falls.... We tolerate no one in our ranks who attacks the ideas of Christianity... in fact our movement is Christian. We are filled with a desire for Catholics and Protestants to discover one another in the deep distress of our own people. Adolf Hitler

http://www.nobeliefs.com/Hitler1.htm

All of this being said, I don't think it's safe to presume that hitler was anti-religious.

edit: It was Formaldehyde who originally posted it http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=316931&page=3 in that link, so if you found it interesting you can thank him.

 

[classical_hero]

If anyone believes that Hitler was Christian, they are downright disingenuous. You can tell his plans at they were set out in the Nuremberg Trials as part of the prosecutions attempt to show how evil they wee and what they were trying to do. http://org.law.rutgers.edu/publications/law-religion/nurinst1.shtml

Clearly there was wide spread persecution of those who stood up to what Hitler was doing and his most fervent critics were those of the Christian Faith.

 

[Cutlass]

If anyone believes that Hitler was Christian, they are downright disingenuous. You can tell his plans at they were set out in the Nuremberg Trials as part of the prosecutions attempt to show how evil they wee and what they were trying to do. http://org.law.rutgers.edu/publications/law-religion/nurinst1.shtml

Clearly there was wide spread persecution of those who stood up to what Hitler was doing and his most fervent critics were those of the Christian Faith.

Which has nothing to do with whether or not Hitler thought he was a Christian or whether he thought his actions were Christian actions.

 

[caketastydelish]

If anyone believes that Hitler was Christian, they are downright disingenuous. You can tell his plans at they were set out in the Nuremberg Trials as part of the prosecutions attempt to show how evil they wee and what they were trying to do. http://org.law.rutgers.edu/publications/law-religion/nurinst1.shtml

Clearly there was wide spread persecution of those who stood up to what Hitler was doing and his most fervent critics were those of the Christian Faith.

Taken from the post I just made:

"My feelings as a Christian"- Adolf Hitler. Hitler claimed to be Christian. I am a Christian and I believe Hitler was not a true Christian, but for that matter I think Santorum is not one either. The point was he was "openly" Christian, and used his "pro Christian" agendas to stir up hatred. Of course they weren't true Christian philosophies, but neither is Santorum's desire to go to war with Iran. Would you call that Christian either?

 

[phoenix_sprite]

Oh my, I only got 1 right!

This quiz definitely blurred the line between these two men. Besides race, nation and religion, they're almost the same person!

 

[kochman]

Someone has posted this very same thing on civfantics before, and I thought it was very interesting so I saved the post. Here it is...


"I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord.." Adolf Hitler.

My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded only by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was His fight for the world against the Jewish poison. To-day, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before in the fact that it was for this that He had to shed His blood upon the Cross. As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice.... And if there is anything which could demonstrate that we are acting rightly it is the distress that daily grows. For as a Christian I have also a duty to my own people.... When I go out in the morning and see these men standing in their queues and look into their pinched faces, then I believe I would be no Christian, but a very devil if I felt no pity for them, if I did not, as did our Lord two thousand years ago, turn against those by whom to-day this poor people is plundered and exploited. Adolf Hitler

Just as the Jew could once incite the mob of Jerusalem against Christ, so today he must succeed in inciting folk who have been duped into madness to attack those who, God's truth! seek to deal with this people in utter honesty and sincerity. Adolf Hitler

It matters not whether these weapons of ours are humane: if they gain us our freedom, they are justified before our conscience and before our God. Adolf Hitler

We are a people of different faiths, but we are one. Which faith conquers the other is not the question; rather, the question is whether Christianity stands or falls.... We tolerate no one in our ranks who attacks the ideas of Christianity... in fact our movement is Christian. We are filled with a desire for Catholics and Protestants to discover one another in the deep distress of our own people. Adolf Hitler

http://www.nobeliefs.com/Hitler1.htm

All of this being said, I don't think it's safe to presume that hitler was anti-religious.

edit: It was Formaldehyde who originally posted it http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=316931&page=3 in that link, so if you found it interesting you can thank him.

Ummmm... are you trying to say Hitler was a Christian?
If so, I suggest you look into things further. He was a complete and total maniac, first... and not a Christian at all... He persecuted the Church whenever it didn't serve his purposes... This is a terrible idea, that Hitler was a Christian.
He replaced ornaments on a Christmas Tree with Swastikas for crying out loud.

Lots of people claim to be Christian for political reasons... he was clearly nowhere near a Christian...