[GS] Science victory - GS - Elimination thread

[kryat]

13. Gilgamesh/Sumeria [19]
17. Hojo Tokimune/Japan [3] (6-3) Weak early game
20. John Curtin/Australia [33]
28. Pachacuti/Inca [16]
34. Qin/China [27] (26+1) That extra builder charge goes a very, very long ways, regardless of victory type
37. Seondeok/Korea [34]

 

[bengalryan9]

13. Gilgamesh/Sumeria [19]
17. Hojo Tokimune/Japan [eliminated] (3-3) Pretty good, but time to go.
20. John Curtin/Australia [34] (33+1) As far as AI play is concerned, Australia is every bit as capable of running away as Korea is. He can put up some pretty crazy numbers.
28. Pachacuti/Inca [16]
34. Qin/China [27]
37. Seondeok/Korea [34]

 

[Victoria]

13. Gilgamesh/Sumeria [16] (19-3) 5th place is pretty good for Gilga. Goody huts and zigs are his only benefits
20. John Curtin/Australia [34]
28. Pachacuti/Inca [16]
34. Qin/China [28] (27+1) Its a pretty good list to me

1. 10% science and culture from the start to the end in inspirations is pretty awesome. And its not 10% of your science its 10% of the science... and culture.
2. The great wall gold is good and the culture is better. Culture so necessary and the wall culture buff is great
3. Chosing any wonders early, Pramids and Coli are one thing but Apadana, The great Bath, Petra, stonehenge, and so on. Just help so much
4. That builder charge is so powerful, not only for an extra charge through the ages but also at the end when using them to finish

37. Seondeok/Korea [34]

 

[enKage]

13. Gilgamesh/Sumeria [13] 16-3 Isolated start and we have a problem. Still you are able to make Pingala-ziggurat city, but that is not enough to aim for top3. Sincerely unexpected presence so high IMO
20. John Curtin/Australia [35] 34+1 The last upvote here before top3, when I would support someone else. Theatre-campus-HS trangles and bonus housing on coast justify top3
28. Pachacuti/Inca [16]
34. Qin/China [28]
37. Seondeok/Korea [34]

 

[lotrmith]

13. Gilgamesh/Sumeria [10] 13 - 3 War Carts can conquer nearby civs very early and pay dividends for units you would have built otherwise (ie early warriors) even if only to clear barb camps and etc. A few clutch goodie-hut bonuses from barb camps (any builders, population, envoys) that early are huge wins. Ziggs on any terrain that might otherwise be low value farmland are also great. But there's stiff competition now from great campus adjacency civs and the wonder/worker spamming China.
20. John Curtin/Australia [35]
28. Pachacuti/Inca [17] 16 + 1 No real great reason here, just making sure he finishes above Sumeria.
34. Qin/China [28]
37. Seondeok/Korea [34]

 

[Ondolindë]

13. Gilgamesh/Sumeria [10].
20. John Curtin/Australia [35]
28. Pachacuti/Inca [18] (17+1) Absolutely not deserving of a fifth or fourth place. In my opinion it should be in the top two. Too many powerful options for a science victory.
34. Qin/China [28]
37. Seondeok/Korea [31] (34-3) People’s assumptions have gotten her thus far, but it’s not a well rounded Civ that could make it under most conditions. In my experience Australia and the Inca can certainty put up a stronger fight, and a more enjoyable one for that matter.

 

[Kmart_Elvis]

13. Gilgamesh/Sumeria [7] (10-3) The top 4 are scientific powerhouses...Sumeria just seems out of place here. A 5th place finish is pretty commendable though.
20. John Curtin/Australia [35]
28. Pachacuti/Inca [19] (18+1) Certainly not as strong as Australia or Korea, but should they be ranked below China? Pacha and Qin both have general bonuses, but Pacha's seems more geared for SV with mountains, growth, campus spots, and production.
34. Qin/China [28]
37. Seondeok/Korea [31]

 

[Leucarum]

This does feel like a tough top 5 to decide between....

13. Gilgamesh/Sumeria [4] (7-3) while nice, the early boosts to science and culture don't scale very well... Probably the only obvious choice to eliminate.
20. John Curtin/Australia [35] I think in earlier elimination threads I overvalued Australia's abilities. They have flashy eye catching adjacencies which are fun to work with but consistency pays off more as your empire grows so Korea edges them out IMO. I'm not saying they're bad, and I find them definitely more fun to play than Korea...
28. Pachacuti/Inca [19]
34. Qin/China [28]
37. Seondeok/Korea [32] (31+1) As above. It was easier to put my reasoning next to Australia...

 

[kryat]

13. Gilgamesh/Sumeria [1] (4-3) At this point I think Gilga is a bit outclassed by others on the list.
20. John Curtin/Australia [35]
28. Pachacuti/Inca [20] (19+1) I like the fundamentals game. The thing though that makes Pacha great isn’t just his mountain bias or the extra food and production. It’s the Qhapaq Nan. Early tunnels in mountain-rich terrain means you have incredibly fast settlers and builders. This means using builders from your developed cities to augment the newly founded ones almost instantly, or spreading settlers out from the ends of a mountain chains that are far from your Capitol in the ancient era, so you can secure the best geographic advantage. No one else can cross mountain curtains in one turn remotely that early in the game.
34. Qin/China [28]
37. Seondeok/Korea [32]

 

[bengalryan9]

13. Gilgamesh/Sumeria [eliminated] (1-3) Good early science and culture, but time to go.
20. John Curtin/Australia [36] (35+1) It's not *that* hard for Australia to match Korea's +4 campuses, but even if you're mostly stuck at +3 you're *also* getting bonuses to your theater squares, holy sites, and commercial hubs... and you get free bonus housing... and you get a huge production boost if someone comes after you... and resourceless infantry... and that's all really good.
28. Pachacuti/Inca [20]
34. Qin/China [28]
37. Seondeok/Korea [32]

 

[Weraptor]

20. John Curtin/Australia [36]
28. Pachacuti/Inca [17] (20-3) No raw science perks.
34. Qin/China [28]
37. Seondeok/Korea [33] (32+1) Could use a rebalance, Seowons dominate the science game

 

[Loderingo]

20. John Curtin/Australia [33] - 36 - 3 - Still not convinced he is as good as he is looks. Very dependent on having high appeal tiles and pastures.
28. Pachacuti/Inca [17]
34. Qin/China [28]
37. Seondeok/Korea [34] - 33+1 - Should be number 1. Not map dependent. Can build Seowons on the ice if you have to!

 

[Bangau]

20. John Curtin/Australia [33]
28. Pachacuti/Inca [14] (17-3) It pains me. Inca is definitely one of my top 3 favorites. Great at all victories, but Science most of all. But greater than the other three. Nope.
34. Qin/China [28]
37. Seondeok/Korea [35] (34+1) Great top 4 so far. I think if you let 100 of us play all four of these on all kinds of maps, Korea has the bonuses that help the most players in the most situations. If she wins, it'll be my next game. Relive the overpoweredness of Korea.

 

[enKage]

20. John Curtin/Australia [33]
28. Pachacuti/Inca [15] 14+1 I'd prefer Inca in top3. Start bias = guaranteed early strong science to tech very early machinery while not neglecting anything else. Meantime you spam scouts. Then flood everyone with Warak'aqs (ohhh my fav unit in game) and a single horse to secure strong production cities
34. Qin/China [25] 28-3 No start bias, loses at consistency with everyone left and before
37. Seondeok/Korea [35]

 

[Pure24]

20. John Curtin/Australia [33]
28. Pachacuti/Inca [16] 15+1. Not much of an Inca fan. But I can see the appeal
34. Qin/China [22] 25-3. More of a Culture Civ, and most of the bonuses are indirect
37. Seondeok/Korea [35]

 

[lotrmith]

20. John Curtin/Australia [33]
28. Pachacuti/Inca [13] 16 - 3 Inca is strong but China is stronger. Chop chop. Eureka boosts. Super easy culture to propel.
34. Qin/China [22]
37. Seondeok/Korea [36] 35 + 1 I agree with the sentiment that Korea is better suited in more situations. In easier difficulties, Aus will make the war declarations and there won't be any cities to liberate, so no bonuses. In MP nobody will declare war on Aus unless they're at a massive advantage to either wipe out Aus completely or seriously hurt Aus by stealing early settlers (when the production boost is most minimal) or mass pillaging, setting Aus back more than they can make up for with the boost. Only on Deity is the Aus production boost likely to take effect and while that is a common standard setting for HoF purposes it's not the sole criteria for this contest.

 

[Tabarnak]

20. John Curtin/Australia [34] (33+1) Slightly superior to Korea, this civ should finish 1st or at least 2nd in my book(i.e. mp games observations,)
28. Pachacuti/Inca [13]
34. Qin/China [19] (22-3) The 3 others are better. Science isn't the only factor at this point, but how everybody can manage the whole meta game for a good SV game. Also, China lacks a bit of oomph in the beginning. The science kick start> rest of game.
37. Seondeok/Korea [36]

 

[Ondolindë]

20. John Curtin/Australia [34]
28. Pachacuti/Inca [14](13+1) Top 3 most definitely.
34. Qin/China [16] (19-3) Love China, but doesn’t meet the others’ abilities.
37. Seondeok/Korea [36]

 

[kryat]

20. John Curtin/Australia [31] (34-3) That +100% production bonus is not reliable. Appeal reliance might slightly limit your number of mines.
28. Pachacuti/Inca [14]
34. Qin/China [16]
37. Seondeok/Korea [37] (36+1) I really can’t argue with half-price campuses and science from mines.

 

[bengalryan9]

20. John Curtin/Australia [32] (31+1) In a game where nothing is guaranteed, that 100% production bonus is pretty reliable. If a city state has been captured in your game (which pretty much happens all the time), you can proc it more or less on command. If we're going to attack Australia for limiting where you can put mines when Korea is equally as guilty - not only do they take up a hill, they also limit where you can put every other district if you want to get the full bonus.
28. Pachacuti/Inca [14]
34. Qin/China [16]
37. Seondeok/Korea [34] (37-3) Someone posted that they're not map dependent? They *have* to have hills to build a campus. No hills, no campuses. Yes they get a hills bias right where they spawn, but as soon as you start spreading out (or conquering other cities) you may find yourself with fields of flat land. Any civ that potentially has cities that can't have campuses can't be said to not be map dependent.