Second Leaders: Which Civs Need Them?
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fredrikslicer
Tailor
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Mauses for Scythia
Made the first push into India and was a patron for Buddhism
Made the first push into India and was a patron for Buddhism
Lord Lakely
Idea Fountain
Would Sargon work as an alt Sumerian Leader? He could introduce a new UU for Sumeria as part of his ability. (though personally, I'd rather just see the Akkadian empire as a shock replacement for Babylon, rather than as a sub division of ancient Sumer.)
Mithridates of Parthia could be an alt leader for Persia and have a horse archer UU as well. (meet the Zradha Shivatir)
Not as pretty as the Assyrian Cav Archer The Kingmaker suggested on the previous page, but functional enough (Parthians had excellent Cav Archers).
Mithridates of Parthia could be an alt leader for Persia and have a horse archer UU as well. (meet the Zradha Shivatir)
Not as pretty as the Assyrian Cav Archer The Kingmaker suggested on the previous page, but functional enough (Parthians had excellent Cav Archers).
PhoenicianGold
Emperor
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The consensus seems to be it's a mess no matter how you slice it, since Gilgabro is speaking Akkadian, which only further blurs the line differentiating Sumer from Assyria/Babylon/Akkadia.
THAT said, the most elegant solution I've seen would be making an Akkadia civ, but with both Hammurabi *and* Sargon as leaders. It wouldn't be that far off from how Greece is portrayed under both the Delian and Peloponnesian Leagues (sort of in reverse, actually), and it would throw a bone to fans of all three civs.
fredrikslicer
Tailor
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Would Sargon work as an alt Sumerian Leader? He could introduce a new UU for Sumeria as part of his ability. (though personally, I'd rather just see the Akkadian empire as a shock replacement for Babylon, rather than as a sub division of ancient Sumer.)
Mithridates of Parthia could be an alt leader for Persia and have a horse archer UU as well. (meet the Zradha Shivatir)
Not as pretty as the Assyrian Cav Archer The Kingmaker suggested on the previous page, but functional enough (Parthians had excellent Cav Archers).
Mithrades would be a neat ruler even if I would like to see Artaxerxes III or Khosrow
Lord of War N02
Grand Master of the East
Indonesia, Indonesia need modern leader like Sukarno.
China deserved another leader this time Emperor with Beijing as capital like Yongle or Kangxi or Qianlong
China deserved another leader this time Emperor with Beijing as capital like Yongle or Kangxi or Qianlong
Manifold
ModderProtectionAdvocate
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Mithrades would be a great personality and addition for the classic game.
PhoenicianGold
Emperor
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I think you're talking about different Mithridates? I don't see much special about Parthia. I see so many special things about Pontus that I'm tempted to include it in my wishlist.
Jewelrunna
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With the release of Chandragupta, Civ VI now has two alternate leaders for Civilizations, in the forms of Gorgo & Chandy. I can't help but shake the feeling that Firaxis is missing a big opportunity here to utilize this really neat mechanic. Even if they primarily intended it for modding purposes, the fact they introduced official alternate leaders shows they could capitalize on it, but aren't. With that said, what are some leaders you'd like to see added to the game, and how would you like the said leader to alter the gameplay of the Civ? Assuming that they'll keep the number of choices to two leaders, let's keep the suggestions to one per Civ, if you had to pick one.
France: France is a bit underpowered right now, and I think they're a prime candidate for an alternate leader as a result for adding a certain "je ne sais quoi" to the civ. Napoleon immediately springs to mind, but I don't know what they could have him do that Shaka doesn't already cover in terms of armies. Consequently, I think the best choice is Louis XIV. He could have a mechanic centered around the palace due to his association with Versailles, where districts in the capital also add to the yields of the Palace. Maybe also take France on an aggressive path, where each chateau adds to the military strength of units, perhaps even give him another unique unit. I think Louis XIV could add a lot to a Civ in sorely need of a reinvention, and plus he'd be a great AI with a lot of personality.
Arabia: Arabia isn't a Civilization in need of a buff, but it just feels wrong to not have any Abbasid representation in the game. Personally, I'd love to see the return of Harun al-Rashid in the game to give the civ a trade-centered spin, to reflect the economic influence of the Empire. Maybe make trade routes give bonus gold for each campus, theater square, & holy site in the originating city, and/or have great works give bonus science while in a golden age to reflect the famous House of Wisdom in Baghdad. It would be an interesting take on an already solid Civ.
Egypt: Many people, including myself, have criticized the choice of Cleopatra as the representative of Egypt, as it neglects the peak of Egypt's power in the ancient era. She's a fun personality in game, but Egypt could use an alternate choice. Another returning figure that I'd like to see is Ramesses II, arguably the most powerful of the pharaohs. A man with a history of great monuments & conquests, his unique ability could find a way to blend army building with production. Perhaps have it so that once Ramesses finishes building a unit, the cities in his empire could get a boost to production; similar to what already exists with Alexander, but with production instead of science. Or, he could get a bonus to unit strength related to how many wonders he has constructed. I could even imagine an agenda for him; he could respect Civs that have a large army & that build wonders, and dislike Civs that only spam wonders.
America: I'm going to be honest; I would just like to see Abraham Lincoln in the game. The new loyalty mechanic gives him a natural ability; he could exert extra loyalty pressure over neighboring cities and incorporating free cities into his empire could add points towards golden ages. To also mimic the Reconstruction (which I realize isn't necessarily Lincoln's defining feature, but he did start it), he could get a production bonus to newly settled or incorporated cities to get them off the ground. Lincoln is just an iconic leader in American history, and it'd be cool to see him in the game.
Germany: It's inevitable that Firaxis is going to embellished the somewhat lacking diplomacy mechanics in Civ Vi, and when they do, I can't think of a more fitting leader to use this abilities than Otto von Bismarck. I'm not really sure what his ability would necessarily be, since I'm justifying his inclusion by using mechanics that aren't yet in the game, but maybe give him extra delegates in a future world congress? He could have an agenda where he dislikes Civs that have a larger military than him, to reflect his desire for a balance of power. Bismarck is an iconic leader in German history, and I'd love for him to make a return.
Those are just some of my suggestions, but what leaders do you guys think would be cool to add to the game?
Moderator Action: Merged with existing thread -- Browd
France: France is a bit underpowered right now, and I think they're a prime candidate for an alternate leader as a result for adding a certain "je ne sais quoi" to the civ. Napoleon immediately springs to mind, but I don't know what they could have him do that Shaka doesn't already cover in terms of armies. Consequently, I think the best choice is Louis XIV. He could have a mechanic centered around the palace due to his association with Versailles, where districts in the capital also add to the yields of the Palace. Maybe also take France on an aggressive path, where each chateau adds to the military strength of units, perhaps even give him another unique unit. I think Louis XIV could add a lot to a Civ in sorely need of a reinvention, and plus he'd be a great AI with a lot of personality.
Arabia: Arabia isn't a Civilization in need of a buff, but it just feels wrong to not have any Abbasid representation in the game. Personally, I'd love to see the return of Harun al-Rashid in the game to give the civ a trade-centered spin, to reflect the economic influence of the Empire. Maybe make trade routes give bonus gold for each campus, theater square, & holy site in the originating city, and/or have great works give bonus science while in a golden age to reflect the famous House of Wisdom in Baghdad. It would be an interesting take on an already solid Civ.
Egypt: Many people, including myself, have criticized the choice of Cleopatra as the representative of Egypt, as it neglects the peak of Egypt's power in the ancient era. She's a fun personality in game, but Egypt could use an alternate choice. Another returning figure that I'd like to see is Ramesses II, arguably the most powerful of the pharaohs. A man with a history of great monuments & conquests, his unique ability could find a way to blend army building with production. Perhaps have it so that once Ramesses finishes building a unit, the cities in his empire could get a boost to production; similar to what already exists with Alexander, but with production instead of science. Or, he could get a bonus to unit strength related to how many wonders he has constructed. I could even imagine an agenda for him; he could respect Civs that have a large army & that build wonders, and dislike Civs that only spam wonders.
America: I'm going to be honest; I would just like to see Abraham Lincoln in the game. The new loyalty mechanic gives him a natural ability; he could exert extra loyalty pressure over neighboring cities and incorporating free cities into his empire could add points towards golden ages. To also mimic the Reconstruction (which I realize isn't necessarily Lincoln's defining feature, but he did start it), he could get a production bonus to newly settled or incorporated cities to get them off the ground. Lincoln is just an iconic leader in American history, and it'd be cool to see him in the game.
Germany: It's inevitable that Firaxis is going to embellished the somewhat lacking diplomacy mechanics in Civ Vi, and when they do, I can't think of a more fitting leader to use this abilities than Otto von Bismarck. I'm not really sure what his ability would necessarily be, since I'm justifying his inclusion by using mechanics that aren't yet in the game, but maybe give him extra delegates in a future world congress? He could have an agenda where he dislikes Civs that have a larger military than him, to reflect his desire for a balance of power. Bismarck is an iconic leader in German history, and I'd love for him to make a return.
Those are just some of my suggestions, but what leaders do you guys think would be cool to add to the game?
Moderator Action: Merged with existing thread -- Browd
Last edited by a moderator:
Cagarustus
Prince
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Napoleon for France.
After declaring a formal war, all units have +3 Combat strength for each great general you have stacked with a military unit for the first 10 turns.
After declaring a formal war, all units have +3 Combat strength for each great general you have stacked with a military unit for the first 10 turns.
awesome
Meme Lord
Reza Shah would be pretty cool for Persia, since he modernized the country. I've posted my idea for him in the new civilizations thread, so I won't bother reposting it in here, but I can add a link to it in this post, if anybody is interested.
Edit: actually, I'll just repost it here:
Reza Shah (of Persia)
Leader bonus - Foreign Educated Advisors
+2 Trade Route capacity with Urbanization civic. Can have a Research Alliance with up to 3 civilizations.
Leader agenda - Mission For My Country
Likes more advanced civilizations. Dislikes backwards civilizations.
Capital: Tehran
(Won't lie, I stole the idea for the ability from the Hittites thread)
Edit: actually, I'll just repost it here:
Reza Shah (of Persia)
Leader bonus - Foreign Educated Advisors
+2 Trade Route capacity with Urbanization civic. Can have a Research Alliance with up to 3 civilizations.
Leader agenda - Mission For My Country
Likes more advanced civilizations. Dislikes backwards civilizations.
Capital: Tehran
(Won't lie, I stole the idea for the ability from the Hittites thread)
Last edited:
Okay, I had a fun idea...
Charles I
Leader Unique Unit: Cavalier: Gains culture and GWP when defeating an enemy. Replaces Musketman.
Leader Unique Ability: Personal Rule: When Charles I switches policies, there is a 25% chance one of his cities will suffer -100 loyalty for ten turns; a 25% chance he will gain +10% culture, faith, and GWAM points for ten turns; and a 50% chance nothing happens. When Charles I switches governments, there is a 50% chance that one of his cities suffer -100 loyalty, and a 50% chance he will gain +15% culture, faith, and GWAM points for ten turns.
Agenda: Divine Right: Charles I likes civs with few governor titles and dislikes civs with many governor titles.
"Charles I also leads England in Civilization VI: Dubious Leaders DLC. He gains the unique unit the Cavalier, which replaces the Musketman and gains culture and Great Writer points when it defeats an enemy. His leader unique ability is 'Personal Rule.' When Charles I changes his policies, there is a chance that he will gain a boost to culture, faith, and Theater Square great people for ten turns, but there is also a chance that one of his cities will suffer -100 loyalty for ten turns. The chances and rewards are much greater when switching government. Charles I also gains the seadog and royal dockyard. Use your Cavaliers to reconquer your rebelling cities, and your culture will surely flourish. How will you lead England as Charles I in Civilization VI: Dubious Leaders?"
Charles I
Leader Unique Unit: Cavalier: Gains culture and GWP when defeating an enemy. Replaces Musketman.
Leader Unique Ability: Personal Rule: When Charles I switches policies, there is a 25% chance one of his cities will suffer -100 loyalty for ten turns; a 25% chance he will gain +10% culture, faith, and GWAM points for ten turns; and a 50% chance nothing happens. When Charles I switches governments, there is a 50% chance that one of his cities suffer -100 loyalty, and a 50% chance he will gain +15% culture, faith, and GWAM points for ten turns.
Agenda: Divine Right: Charles I likes civs with few governor titles and dislikes civs with many governor titles.
"Charles I also leads England in Civilization VI: Dubious Leaders DLC. He gains the unique unit the Cavalier, which replaces the Musketman and gains culture and Great Writer points when it defeats an enemy. His leader unique ability is 'Personal Rule.' When Charles I changes his policies, there is a chance that he will gain a boost to culture, faith, and Theater Square great people for ten turns, but there is also a chance that one of his cities will suffer -100 loyalty for ten turns. The chances and rewards are much greater when switching government. Charles I also gains the seadog and royal dockyard. Use your Cavaliers to reconquer your rebelling cities, and your culture will surely flourish. How will you lead England as Charles I in Civilization VI: Dubious Leaders?"
Ferocitus
Deity
Leader Unique Ability: When Charles I switches governments, there is a 50% chance that
Cromwell replaces him.
Agenda: Head of State: Charles I dislikes any civ containing the colour green in their livery.
Cromwell replaces him.
Agenda: Head of State: Charles I dislikes any civ containing the colour green in their livery.
I actually forgot I was going to include that if all of Charles's cities turn to free cities, he's replaced by Cromwell.
Although I might be alone in thinking that Cromwell would actually be a worse choice than Charles I. 
Ferocitus
Deity
I actually forgot I was going to include that if all of Charles's cities turn to free cities, he's replaced by Cromwell.
Worse? No, they are a perfectly matched pair to lead England.
Two men - one head of state, IYKWIMAITYD.
Morningcalm
Keeper of Records
I would like Egypt to get a competent male pharaoh--it need not be Rameses II either. Thutmoses III and Senusret III would both be excellent choices, though I think Senusret III would make for the most dramatic leaderscreen given his God status among Egyptians and Nubians, his famous (and realistic, if slightly exaggerated) statue showing him as a grim man worn by the cares of statecraft, his legendary attribution as Sesostris, and his kickass quotes like "I am a king who speaks and acts. What my heart plans is done with my arm."
Though France is another popular choice for a second leader, I'm annoyed at how overrepresented Europe is in Civ VI thus far, and how little it seems some quarters thirst for more worldly variance. (As an example, we have three Hellenistic/Greek leaders currently, and some people even want a Greek-speaking Byzantine emperor on top of that. (I would prefer one who speaks Latin and Greek, I.e. Justinian or Theodora.)). Accordingly I don't think France takes priority for a second leader choice.
Though France is another popular choice for a second leader, I'm annoyed at how overrepresented Europe is in Civ VI thus far, and how little it seems some quarters thirst for more worldly variance. (As an example, we have three Hellenistic/Greek leaders currently, and some people even want a Greek-speaking Byzantine emperor on top of that. (I would prefer one who speaks Latin and Greek, I.e. Justinian or Theodora.)). Accordingly I don't think France takes priority for a second leader choice.
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Melchizedek
Prince
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America: Benjamin Franklin (Yes, I know he wasn't president, but he was a leader.)
UA: Poor Richard's Alminac. Receive a free culture building whenever you complete a science building in a city with a theater square.
UA: Poor Richard's Alminac. Receive a free culture building whenever you complete a science building in a city with a theater square.
Melchizedek
Prince
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Aztec: Christopher Columbus
UA: Columbus Day Parade. Whenever you eliminate a leader from the game, you gain his or her UA for the rest of that era.
UA: Columbus Day Parade. Whenever you eliminate a leader from the game, you gain his or her UA for the rest of that era.
Melchizedek
Prince
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England: Doctor Who
UA: Don't Blink. You may select this leader from the starting screen even though he is not coded into the game.
UA: Don't Blink. You may select this leader from the starting screen even though he is not coded into the game.
Jewelrunna
Prince
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I agree that Civ VI is a bit Eurocentric at the moment, but France could use the buff in the form of a new leader ability, and they have a wide range of options to choose from. A Chinese alternate could be really fun too, since that Civ is already really open-ended from a design standpoint. Taizong, Liu Bang/Gaozu, Emperor Wu, Wu Zetian: a lot of choices are available!
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