LowtherCastle
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Good thinking. I count 65 tiles from Manchou to Washington, so it should work if it's 84. Guess we'll find out. Are there 104-tile maps?
[BTS] SGOTM 25 - Home Slices
- Thread starter AlanH
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I'm away from computer right now, so I cant check anything.
For stealing Workers, we should use the bomber to pillage any road to help our archer escape the inner ring.
If I recall, we can't bomb tiles we have units standing on?, so it would have to be before we step onto the tile and after we leave it.
My instincts say steal the Worker!
And take the risk.
It will be hard to turn off Bismark's war, but what can he do to us?
The only time Worker stealing truly blew up in my face was someone getting Alpha and bribing 5AI to DOW me.
Then those AI kept egging each other on with more war bribes.
Also, can someone check on some bomber mechanics?
Does our bomber in a foreign city vanish or rebase if borders close?
Also, does our bomber in a foreign city vanish or rebase if a war declaration occurs?
Would suck for a dogpile event to instakill our bomber.
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LowtherCastle
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Bismarck's worker is on the copper which is adjacent to Tsingtao. No road to pillage. If we wait till it goes to the cows, though, then there will be a tile in between.
LowtherCastle
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Bbp's test save. Rebased to Moscow, closed borders, bomber teleported to Beijing. Rebased to Rome, DOWed, teleported back to Yanan. Seems to follow usually teleport rules. Didn't test for us getting DoWed.
Incidentally, we might be able to use that to our advantage. If we conduct a recon mission from a foreign city, then DoW that AI, we teleport way back to our nearest city for free, if that's useful. Recon+rebase in 1 turn.
We do have State Property, so no distance penalty.
The bomber is so fierce it ought to work.
If we steal everyone's Workers, we might not have an airbase to attack from.
Can someone test if Horse Archers can be 2 pop whipped with Kremlin and State Property with 1 hammer invested?
I can't recall how these multipliers combine on Normal speed.
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Istanbul and/or Rome.
Heh, the Ottomans exist to be our airbase and work deserts!
LowtherCastle
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We still want some Ais to tech for us, right? Should we leave Roosy for that and try to get him to Friendly? Looks like Roosy owns the Christian Holy City so after we capture Hong Kong, we could revolt to Christianity and get up to 5 plusmods for that alone. Then +1 for peace and +4 for fair trade and he's Friendly. We want to capture Hong Kong before Roosy and Churchill meet to not get a DoW negmod. At Pleased we could also bribe him to DOW others and gain shared war plusmods to get him to Friendly even sooner. We could get +4 shared war plusmods with Roosy, so we wouldn't even need the shared religion while still sharing the war. His favorite civic is Mercantilism so there's an additional basket of plusmods but that's far down the road and we don't even need that tech path.
Of course, we don't know if Roosy will tech very fast, but we could speed him along, especially since he's not a threat to us if we don't need his land.
Of course, we don't know if Roosy will tech very fast, but we could speed him along, especially since he's not a threat to us if we don't need his land.
LowtherCastle
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It can be 1 or 2h for a HA 2whip, so evidently each whip is worth 47h. What's more, the overflow maxes out at 45h !!!!! In other words, the Kremlin bonus is not subtracted from the hammer overflow, just the SP 10% bonus. So that means a 2whip yields 2 HAs immediately. Getting only 2h into the HA build won't be easy, btw,
Thanks for testing for me LowtherCastle.
I'm a bit surprised 2 pop whip is still possible.
That is very promising for small cities with one food.
As for trade partners, I feel that we can just ignore such.
We have the ability to easily steal the tech of every civ in the game since the mapmaker put all the 2nd AI cities near us.
Civs will always take back cities they used to own.
That makes it really easy to manipulate espionage bonuses.
Plus, the AI are backwards and will have a slower start with no Workers.
How fast can they really tech?
Maybe if Roosevelt or Churchill has a really nice capital.
LowtherCastle
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I think we can do it with chariots, except for Churchill, and we use swords built out west for him. That way we don't need to tech HBR, at least not right now.
An unpromoted chariot against a fortified, non-protective 3.0/6 lbm got 40% odds. Two chariots win that battle. HAs are great, but what do we really want for our first tech?
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LowtherCastle
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The point is we want some AIs to tech for us. Things like Calendar, Monarchy, Alpha and whatnot. You're right that we could spend eps on them but we have an abundance of techs to get them for free, so that seems optimal to me. We'll see what kind of land Roosy has, probably blessed since it's America. Fastest finish -- how to take advantage of every single opportunity presented.
LowtherCastle
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Nine Classical Techs We Need
That's it. They open up 7 wonders. We already have 10 wonders open to us, plus GW, so 18 total. Music for the Great Artist opens up a 19th wonder. Edit: Then of course, up to 7 shrines, or a total of 26 wonders. That's already 100 points worth so we definitely don't need any more techs than that.
Astro is opened up by adding Optics.
- HBR
- Aesthetics
- Alphabet
- Monarchy
- Compass
- Literature
- Calendar
- Construction
- Currency
That's it. They open up 7 wonders. We already have 10 wonders open to us, plus GW, so 18 total. Music for the Great Artist opens up a 19th wonder. Edit: Then of course, up to 7 shrines, or a total of 26 wonders. That's already 100 points worth so we definitely don't need any more techs than that.
Astro is opened up by adding Optics.
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LowtherCastle
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The way to play this scenario, I think, is minimalistically. That means anything we don't need, we skip. Anything. Then ask:
Then figure out how to do that.
What's the absolute shortest number of turns it would take to win?
Then figure out how to do that.
Does that include shrines?
LowtherCastle
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Nope. Forgot...
Well, the one problem with killing everyone quickly is they don't have a chance to pop a GP...Nope. Forgot...
Actually, no, I just checked and they are utterly useless. The bomber can't reach any existing city from Istanbul.
Moscow actually can't be reached from anywhere either. We would need to plant an air base city for it. Edit: couple of spots with wheat/rice/gold SE of Moscow could potentially get both Moscow and Istanbul. But, then again, Stalin is likely to plant another city or two sooner than that. Probably one reachable from Istanbul.
I concur. How is that possible? I'm currently playing a game with Kremlin. I often get confused on things like overflow gold, etc. but I thought I had the Kremlin calcs down, 100% understood. It should be simply 45 base hammers and +10% is 49. So a 2 whip should be impossible on a 50h unit. So unless the SP 10% works differently than OrgRel 25% or forge 25% or IND trait 50%, etc, I'm confused.
Are you sure you tested that correctly? Not sure how you could test it wrong, but I really thought I understood Kremlin and the rounding involved.
correct. (I thought) I find Kremlin easy to understand. It's just 45 instead of 30. But I still can't make sense of 47h with SP.
