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[BTS] SGOTM 26 - Home Slices

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Succession GOTM' started by AlanH, Apr 23, 2020.

  1. LowtherCastle

    LowtherCastle Deity

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    Note we already have +1 plusmod with SB for resource trades. We’ll likely get to +2 before +2 for OBs anyway. We likely only need 1 resource trade going.
     
  2. WastinTime

    WastinTime Deity Supporter

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    Any chance one cottage could help us get CoL 1t sooner?
    I don't want to do this. The TR is mostly +1 (unless we settle NE Island), but I suppose eventually +2/city after we meet some AI or SB gets more cities.
    We don't have any AI to trade with, we don't have alpha, and even if they trade resources, they probably don't even have 1gpt to pay us.
    Like Mitch said, if SH goes late, it's likely Oracle will go past T80. And were only talking about getting our failgold on 67 vs T70 at the latest.
    I've been considering this, but if we do our failgold right, there won't be time or (really a need) for double bulb (unless like you said we use caste scientists) Otherwise it's 34 turns (maybe less if we gamble with a dirty gene pool) to get GS #2. Paper is as little as ~10 turns after CS (but we will probably detour to IW, etc)
    Yeah, what MirrorGuard said. Change that to 1W, and 1S2W. Or, if you have the time, include the gems in the route.
    Note: you can build this ^^ road faster even with the jungle :eek: because it's 2t roads, so 5t total instead of 6t. (So we can probably build one less worker :mischief:)
     
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  3. Mitchum

    Mitchum Deity

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    I'm impressed with your results, Kait. You slid Oracle just a turn but appear to have gotten so much more out of the empire.

    Will you be posting your PPP today? I'd like to run through it once to see what you're doing.
     
  4. LowtherCastle

    LowtherCastle Deity

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    A Science cottage means Science grows at +2fpt after IW...?!

    You’re forgetting build wealth!!! :mischief: Actually has a use in this game. We could maxOF whip multiple Duns on the same turn gifting the stone away only once, while putting the hammer OF into the same wonder on consecutive turns. Cities wait their turn while building wealth.
     
  5. LowtherCastle

    LowtherCastle Deity

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    Any chance the farm or cottage could be improved before chopping Canal?
     
  6. Kaitzilla

    Kaitzilla Lord Croissant

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    Ya, working on it now.
     
  7. WastinTime

    WastinTime Deity Supporter

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    I know, I'm just sayin' (since we have an over-abundance of workers), we could temporarily use a cottage to squeak out CoL. Then maybe farm over it some day. Or, sometimes when you've grown to the happy cap, the cottage could be worked...give a citizen something to do a couple turns-- right before it's whipped away.

    re: wealth. Yeah, that or build research is a great way to hold overflow, but other than that, it's not a good investment (now that we have stone.) It was good--exactly the same as the hammers we put in Henge, but good by the time we get Currency. But you all know all that.
     
  8. LowtherCastle

    LowtherCastle Deity

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    Speaking of Lord Croissant... I have experienced early morning Spring Heaven twice: a walk in nature listening to the birds and a walk in Paris, air saturated with the aroma of freshly baked croissants. :yumyum:
     
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  9. Kaitzilla

    Kaitzilla Lord Croissant

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    PPP 1.3
    Turn 55 to Turn 77 (Will only play 10 turns)

    Continuing from LowtherCastle's T45-T55 playthrough.

    1st Rough Draft

    Empire
    Spoiler :




    Science City has 116:hammers: in Stonehenge


    Cow City has 6:hammers: in Barracks




    Profit City has 3:hammers: in Lighthouse


    Silver City has 3:hammers: in Lighthouse







    Scenarios
    Early Stonehenge - We see the "Stonehenge completed in a far away land" message between T56 and T63 and receive 116:gold: the following turn. :cool:
    Once we see the message, we cannot add more hammers or chops to a current Stonehenge build because they will vanish. :sad:
    Golden Stonehenge - We see the "Stonehenge completed in a far away land" message between T65 and T66 and receive (116:gold: + fail gold from Cow City) the following turn.
    Congratulations, we got extra money and have it early enough to use it to guarantee T77 Oracle -> Civil Service :D
    Late Stonehenge - We see the "Stonehenge completed in a far away land" message between T67 and T75 and receive (116:gold: + fail gold from every city that worked Stonehenge) the following turn.
    Oracle is delayed - This Stonehenge gold gets added onto the end of our Great Wall gold. Might be thinking about Oracle -> Currency.
    Criminal Stonehenge - We see the "Stonehenge completed in a far away land" message after Turn 76 and receive our gold the following turn.
    Getting Stonehenge gold after the Great Wall gold ran out means we limp to Oracle.
    Hopefully we delayed Great Wall completion a few turns so we could still attempt to Oracle Civil Service in a decent time.


    Ugh, can no city add Stonehenge fail gold on Turn 63?

    Techs
    T55 - Masonry 0% (40:gold: +20) Masonry@ 2/124
    T56 - Masonry 100% (60:gold: -37) +64:science: Masonry@ 3/124
    T57 - Masonry 40% (23:gold: +0) +25:science: Masonry@ 94/124
    T58 - Meditation 0% (23:gold: +24) Meditation@ 0+Overflow/124
    T59 - Meditation 0% (47:gold: +23) Meditation@ 5/124
    T60 - Meditation 100% (70:gold: -38) +69:science: Meditation@ 6/124
    T61 - Meditation 0% (32:gold: +33) Meditation@ 90/124
    T62 - Meditation 100% (65:gold: -38) +67:science: Meditation@ 91/124
    T63 - Priesthood 0% (32:gold: +29) Priesthood@ 0+Overflow/93 Note the +5:gold: from Chariot overflow
    T64 - Priesthood 100% (61:gold: -39) +67:science: Priesthood@ 49/93
    T65 - Writing 70% (22:gold: -20) +43:science: Writing@ 0+Overflow/187 (Goal was try to be broke each turn to be able to spend Stonehenge gold as fast as possible :hmm:)
    T66 - Writing 40% (2:gold: +0) +25:science: Writing@ 118/187
    T67 - Writing 100% (118:gold: -39) +65:science: Writing@ 159/187 (Gave myself +116:gold: with world builder to simulate Early Stonehenge Scenario. Science City can start Library on T68 even without Stonehenge money)
    T68 - Mathematics 100% (79:gold: -40) +66:science: Mathematics@ 0+Overflow/390 (Requires Open Borders with Sitting Bull for +1:gold: per turn)
    T69 - Mathematics 90% (39:gold: -34) +64:science: Mathematics@ 137/390
    T70 - Mathematics 100% (73:gold: -42) +74:science: Mathematics@ 215/390
    T71 - Mathematics 100% (255:gold: -42) +74:science: Mathematics@ 305/390
    T72 - Code of Laws 100% (213:gold: -45) +85:science: Code of Laws@ 0+Overflow/546
    T73 - Code of Laws 100% (168:gold: -45) +83:science: Code of Laws@ 107/546
    T74 - Code of Laws 100% (125:gold: -43) +81:science: Code of Laws@ 207/546
    T75 - Code of Laws 100% (82:gold: -47) +93:science: Code of Laws@ 305/546
    T76 - Code of Laws 80% (35:gold: -30) +68:science: Code of Laws@ 417/546
    T77 - Code of Laws 60% (15:gold: -13) +52:science: Code of Laws@ 499/546 Note the +10:gold: from Dun overflow in Science City

    Workers
    Shepherd - (Worker 2N1W of Cow City)

    T56 - Road 1N of Cow City and Stop!
    T57 - Move to tundra forest 1N2E of Cow City
    T58 - Chop 1N2E of Cow City and Stop!
    T59 - Move to tundra forest 2N2W of Science City
    T60 - T63 Chop forest for Great Wall
    T64 - Move to tundra forest 1N2E of Cow City
    T65 - T67 Chop forest for Great Wall
    T68 - Move to 1W of Science City
    T69 - Move to 2S1W of Science City
    T70 - T71 Road Gems
    T72 - Move to 3S2W of Science City
    T73 - T74 Road 3S2W of Science City

    Cowboy - (Worker 1E of Whale City)
    T55 - T59 Mine Silver
    T60 - T61 Move to the tundra forest 2W1N of Silver City
    T62 - T65 Chop forest for Great Wall
    T66 - Move to fur 2N of Silver City
    T67 - T69 Road fur
    T70 - Road 1W of Silver City and Stop!
    T71 - T75 Camp Deer

    Phillip - (Worker 1N1W of Profit City)
    T55 - Chop forest 1N1W of Profit City
    T56 - Chop forest 1N1W of Profit City and Stop!
    T57 - T59 Road stone
    T60 - T63 Quarry stone
    T64 - Board Galley and sail north
    T65 - Get off at forest 2S of Cows City
    T66 - T67 Chop forest for Great Wall
    T68 - Move onto Deer tile
    T69 - T70 Road Deer

    Joan Dark - (Worker 1N of Science City)
    T56 - Farm 1W of Science City and Stop!
    T57 - Road 2W of Science City and Stop!
    T58 - T59 Board Galley and sail south into Profit City
    T60 - T63 Exit galley in Profit City and quarry stone
    T64 - Board galley with Phillip and sail north
    T65 - Get off at forest 2S of Cows City
    T66-T67 Chop forest for Great Wall
    T68 - Move onto Deer tile
    T69 - Road Deer

    The Phillip + Joan Dark micro gets a little confusing T70 depending on when we want to chop Oracle. :hmm:
    One of them will board the galley on T70 or T71, unload in Profit city, and chop forest 2W of Profit City.
    The other will road 1S1E of Deer, chop the forest to kill time, and board the galley to sail south, unload in Profit City, and chop the forest on the same turn as the other.

    Rex - (Worker born in Science City on Turn 58)
    T58 - Move to 2N2E of Science City
    T59 - T60 Move to forest 1E of Wheat
    T61 - T63 Chop forest
    T64 - T66 Return to Science City on same path
    T67 - T69 Farm 1W of Science City
    T70 - T73 Farm 1N1W of Science City

    Settlers
    Settler 7 - (Our last Settler located 7N5E of Science City)

    T56 - Move 1N1W and halt game if fish or copper discovered
    T57 - Move 1W onto hill to get a good look
    T58 - Board galley to sail back to capital if northern island is a dud
    T60 - Exit galley 3N3E of capital
    T61 - T64 Walk to forest 2N of Cow City without trampling on any forest growth
    T65 - ??? make a settling decision because Sitting Bull Open Borders will occur T68 and he will target those clams

    Cities
    Science City

    T55 - Worker; Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm, Plainsriverfarm
    T56 - Worker; Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm, unimproved Plainsriver
    T57 - 2-pop Whip Worker; Sheep, Horse, Winefarm (I'll take 2:science: over 2:hammers:)
    T58 - Granary; HALT GROWTH BUTTON ON Sheep, Horse, Rice
    T59 - Chariot; Sheep, Horse, Rice
    T60 - Chariot; HALT GROWTH BUTTON OFF Sheep, Winefarm, Rice
    T61 - Chariot; Sheep, Horse, Rice, Winefarm
    T62 - 1-pop Whip Chariot; Sheep, Rice, Winefarm (3:gold: from overflow cap is better than 1:food: when played out to T77)
    T63 - The Great Wall (goes to 110/150:hammers:); Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm
    T64 - Warrior; Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm (If early Writing comes due to Stonehenge gold, do Library!)
    T65 - The Great Wall (goes to 128/150:hammers:); Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm
    T66 - Dun; Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm, Plainsriverfarm (If early Writing comes due to Stonehenge gold, do Library!)
    T67 - Warrior; Dun; Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm, Plainsriverfarm
    T68 - Library; Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm, Plainsriverfarm
    T69 - T70 Library; Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm, Plainsriverfarm x2
    T71 - 2-pop Whip Library; Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm
    T72 - Pyramids (goes to 50:hammers:); Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm, Plainsriverfarm
    T73 - Dun; Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm, Plainsriverfarm
    T74 - Pyramids (goes to 70:hammers:); Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm, Plainsriverfarm
    T75 - Pyramids (goes to 88:hammers:) Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm, Scientist x2 (not sure if scientists are needed)
    T76 - 1-pop Whip Dun; Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm, Plainsriverfarm
    T77 - Pyramids (goes to 208:hammers: if Deer road gets pillaged and Stone returned); Sheep, Rice, Horse, Winefarm, Plainsriverfarm

    Cow City
    T55 - 1-pop Whip Workboat; Crab, Cow, Tundrafur, Plainshillfur
    T56 - Another Workboat; Crab, Cow, x3 Fur
    T57 - T59 Another Workboat; Crab, Cow, x3 Fur
    T60 - T63 Another Workboat; Crab, Cow, x3 Fur
    T64 - Stonehenge or Pyramids (goes to 22:hammers:); Crab, Cow, x3 Fur (Stonehenge is more important if available)
    T65 - Stonehenge or Pyramids (goes to 38:hammers:); Crab, Cow, x3 Fur
    T66 - Stonehenge or Pyramids (goes to 54:hammers:); Crab, Cow, x3 Fur
    T67 - The Great Wall (goes to 96:hammers:/150)
    T68 - Stonehenge or Pyramids (goes to 70:hammers:); Crab, Cow, x3 Fur
    T69 - Stonehenge or Pyramids (goes to 86:hammers:); Crab, Cow, x3 Fur
    T70 - Stonehenge or Pyramids (goes to 102:hammers:); Crab Cow, x3 Fur
    T71 - Stonehenge or Pyramids (goes to 118:hammers:); Crab Cow, x3 Fur
    T72 - Granary; Crab Cow, x3 Fur
    T73 - Pyramids (goes to 134:hammers:); Crab Cow, x3 Fur
    T74 - T75 Warrior; Crab Cow, x3 Fur (to pillage road to deer to get stone back, costs us -1:gold: per turn)
    T76 - T77 Granary; Crab Cow, x3 Fur

    Canal City
    T55 - 1-pop Whip Workboat; Crab, Coast
    T56 - Granary; Crab, Coast
    T57 - Granary; Crab, Clam
    T58 - Granary; Crab, Clam, unimproved Clam
    T59 - T62 The Great Wall CRUCIAL BUILD; Crab, Clam, unimproved Clam
    T63 - 2-pop Whip Granary; Crab, Clam
    T64 - The Great Wall (goes to 86/150:hammers:); Crab, Clam
    T65 - T66 Lighthouse; Crab, Clam
    T67 - Lighthouse; Crab, Clam, unimproved Clam
    T68 - The Great Wall CRUCIAL BUILD (goes to 90/150:hammers:); Crab, Clam, tundraforest
    T69 - 2-pop Whip The Great Wall; Crab, Clam
    T70 - Lighthouse; Crab, Clam
    T71 - T72 Lighthouse; Crab, Clam, unimproved Clam
    T73 - 2-pop Whip Lighthouse; Crab, Clam
    T74 - Library; Crab, Clam
    T75 - T76 Library; Crab, Clam, unimproved Clam
    T77 - Library; Crab, Clam, unimproved Clam, Coast

    Profit City
    T55 - 57 Granary; Tundraforest (These 6 hammers help a lot after Turn 77, so no Stonehenge gold)
    T58 - T59 Dun CRUCIAL BUILD; Tundraforest
    T60 - T61 Dun; Crab
    T62 - Dun; Crab, unimproved Stone
    T63 - T64 Dun; Crab, Stone
    T65 - T69 Oracle CRUCIAL BUILD; Crab, Stone
    T70 - Dun; Crab, Stone, Coast CRUCIAL BUILD (if going for Oracle faster than Turn 77 chops do Stone + 2 Tundraforest)
    T71 - T75 Oracle; Crab, Stone, Coast
    T76 - 1-pop Whip Dun; Crab, Stone
    T77 - Oracle chopped complete; Crab, Stone

    Silver City
    T55 - Granary; Clam, Silvermine
    T56 - T61 Granary; Clam, Silvermine, Fur
    T62 - T64 Granary; Clam, Crab, Silvermine
    T65 - 1-pop Whip Granary; HALT GROWTH BUTTON ON Clam, Crab
    T66 - The Great Wall (goes to 68:hammers:/150); Clam, Crab
    T67 - Scout; HALT GROWTH BUTTON OFF Clam, Crab
    T68 - Scout; Clam, Crab x2
    T69 - Scout; Clam, Crab x2, Silvermine
    T70 - T71 Scout; Clam, Crab x2, Silvermine
    T72 - T73 Scout; Clam, Crab x2, Silvermine, Fur
    T74 - Lighthouse; Clam, Crab x2, Silvermine, Fur
    T75 - T77 Lighthouse; Clam, Crab x2, Silvermine, Fur, Coast

    Whale City
    T55 - T59 Monument; Crab
    T60 - T67 Monument; Crab, Silvermine
    T68 - T71 Granary; Crab, Silvermine
    T72 - T77 Granary; Crab, Silvermine, Coast

    Units
    Galley 1 (8N1W of Canal City)

    T56 - T59 Sail to 1S of Mountain to pick up Settler and then sail towards Canal City
    T60 - Drop off Settler 1N1E of wheat and sail towards Canal City
    T61 - T69 Sail to 4S1E of Cow City
    T70 - Depending on the Oracle chop schedule, take Phillip or Joan down to chop 1 forest 2W of Profit City, and then come back north to take the other down to chop the 2nd forest at the same time to complete Oracle

    Galley 2 (Inside Cow City)
    T58 - Pick up Joan Dark and sail to Profit City
    T60 - Unload Joan Dark in Profit City
    T61 - T63 Move to 1N of Profit City and wait
    T64 - Pick up Joan and Phillip and sail north
    T65 - Drop off Joan and Phillip at 2S of Cows City
    T66 - Pick up Warrior 2 from Deer Camp and sail for Silver City
    T71 - Drop off Warrior 2 inside Silver City in passing on the way west
    T73 - Reach 3S1E of Whale City
    T74 - Pick up Scout from 2S2E of Whale City and sail west to explore

    Warrior 2
    T56 - Head to Deer 2S1E of Cow City. Cow City does not need a garrison
    T66 - Get on Galley 2 before it sails northeast
    T71 - Get off Galley 2 into Silver City

    Warrior 3 (Born in Cow City)
    T75 - Move to 1S1E of Cow City
    T76 - Move to deer camp 2S1E of Cow City
    T77 - Pillage road 1S1E of Deer to get the empire Stone back from Sitting Bull

    Scout 1 (Born in Silver City)
    T73 - Born in Silver City, move to 2S2E of Whale City
    T74 - Board Galley 2 to explore the west

    Chariot
    T63 - T68 Head to 2S1E of Canal City
    T69 + Explore Sitting Bull's lands if Open Borders are signed

    Workboat 5 (Born in Cow City T56)
    T56 - T61 Sail to 1E of Silver City
    T62 - Net crab 2E1N of Silver City

    Workboat 6 (Born in Canal City T56)
    T56 - Move to 1S1W of Canal City
    T57 - Net clam 2S of Canal City

    Workboat 7 (Born in Cow City T57)
    T57 - T59 Sail to 3N2E of Profit City
    T60 - Net Profit City crabs

    Workboat 8 (Born in Cow City T60)
    T60 - T65 Sail to 2S of Silver City
    T66 - Net crab 2S of Silver City

    Workboat 9 (Born in Cow City T64)
    T64 - T73 Sail to 1S1W of Whale City
    T78 - Net seafood 2S1W of Whale City

    Diplomacy
    Espionage :espionage: on Sitting Bull
    Cancel health resource gift if empire becomes unhealthy
    T68 - Possibly Open Borders with Sitting Bull to explore his lands. This might cause him to settle double clams. The +1:gold: per turn is actually useful and was used to help me get T77 Oracle Chop.
    Check for fist icon every turn (Technically possible if Sitting Bull is Cautious and has Bronze. ??? possible if he has Dog Soldier and Chariot)
    Screenshot religion screen, espionage screen, demographics, and sitting bull cities every turn
    T76 - Give Stone + Deer to Sitting Bull after whipping Duns in Science and Profit

    Stopping Points
    T56 -
    Copper or additional seafood is found in northern island
    Any World Wonder is completed by the AI
    Meet a new AI
    Sitting Bull starts plotting war (fist icon)
    Start of Turn 65 is reached

    **Edit**
    Updated with latest changes after playing Turn 55
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2020
  10. LowtherCastle

    LowtherCastle Deity

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    :lol:
     
  11. Mitchum

    Mitchum Deity

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    I thought is was closer to 7.5% or 8% done myself.
     
  12. LowtherCastle

    LowtherCastle Deity

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    Created a summary post with thread links finally. Have a look. If there are any more links, from here or elsewhere, you’d like available, let me know any time going forward.
     
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  13. LowtherCastle

    LowtherCastle Deity

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    Re-visiting our required city builds:

    upload_2020-5-21_21-52-31.png

    I discovered that the Industrial Park requires a 250h factory. :eek::eek::eek:
     
  14. LowtherCastle

    LowtherCastle Deity

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    I don’t know how much our maintenance costs will be with Sushi but Cows will be able to dry-whip wbs for 50gpt w/forge+factory+coal plant+ ironworks+ drydock. Not sure how long that will be in operation before game end. x50% w/Kremlin.
     
  15. Kaitzilla

    Kaitzilla Lord Croissant

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    Whoa, that was a lot of work!
    Must have reread the whole thread.

    Hopefully the team likes it.
    PPP is up now for testing to iron out mistakes and add any good ideas. :)

    The map is 84x36 and cylindrical.
    That means the farthest possible city distance will be on a band halfway around the world.
    City 1 has 41 tiles to the left and right which intersect at City 2 on the 42nd tile.
    Bottom strip has 35 tiles above it, so max vertical distance is 35 tiles.
    So go diagonally 35 tiles followed by 7 tiles to the side.
    That is 35*1.5+7 rounded down or 59.
    Maxplotdistance should be 59.
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2020
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  16. Mitchum

    Mitchum Deity

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    As a wise man once said: "Whoa, that was a lot of work!"

    I'll try to walk through it in detail tomorrow.
     
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  17. LowtherCastle

    LowtherCastle Deity

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    I get it. Sadly, the lower the maxplot the higher the ep cost to steal techs.
     
  18. LowtherCastle

    LowtherCastle Deity

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    City MM looks well conceived. :goodjob:

    I assume you get the fur happy soon enough. You could avoid the 14 wkr-ts roading the Cow deer by roading and camping the Silver deer instead. Food for thought.

    Would that make Rex unnecessary?
    Or enable more failgold?
    Or better prepare for gems?
    Or improve a Sci tile sooner?

    Hard for me to know how to fine-tune your optimization...
     
  19. WastinTime

    WastinTime Deity Supporter

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    of course you meant 1W
    A lot of worker plans can be derailed with forest growth, so if you have critical moves/chops, etc. you might want to consider worst case scenarios.

    tl;dr Send Galley 2 far NW w/ chariot or warrior
    If we don't settle the Island-formerly-known-as-Metal-Island, then Galley 1 could pick up chariot and quickly drop it at Canal-2S1E, then...
    Go and get the Oracle choppers. This means...
    Galley 2, after dropping off T65, can explore the far NW with a unit on board. Ideally, a chariot (from Silver?).
    Most of the AI is coastal rt now, but that chariot could help us get more TR connections and spy on inland cities.
    Not to mention the possibility that land/ice blocks us from circumnavigating and the chariot completes the connection.
    That means...
    wb9 is probably for Whales' seafood.
     
  20. LowtherCastle

    LowtherCastle Deity

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    Why not a scout?
     

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