SGOTM7 - Team tao

[Sabre]

Some news from turn 5

First, the good - I've landed both forces and the counterattack was almost nothing. I razed Intombe and placed Konya on the planned location. The northern force is just about ready and I expect no problems with Hlobane - they are defended by reg Impis!

Now the bad, I've made contact with the Vikings and Americans and they are in the MA with no MA techs. I traded Republic and Monotheism to the Vikings for the world map and contact with the Americans. Should I give those two techs to the Americans or should we give up on getting techs from the AI? We have 12 turns left on Engineering - do we give up on it and head for Chivalry ourselves? Horses and swords should have no problem with the Zulu, Arabia and Persia (provided Persia doesn't get to Feudalism - if they are researching Engineering it could be a long time for them) and we are building masses of horse. We can afford to research one of Feudalism or Chivalry on our own at 90% for 8 turns and the other at 40% for 17 turns. I have some libraries started so this can be trimmed some.

I propose that we switch to Feudalism at 40% now. If we get it from the others before the next 17 turns we could then get Chivalry in 8 turns from that point so at worst we get it in 25 turns. What do you guys think? I'll save the game here and return after some input.

Oh and the world map is odd. The land north of the Americans stretches off to a point, making the world's landmasses look like a sideways number 9. Lots of coastline, so we may need to take most of the land to trigger domination.

 

[Renata]

Can we see a picture just for curiosity?

Ok, so that makes Persia the world leader in techs, based on the fact that they're the only ones who have cash, right? Has anything shown up on F4 yet with Persia? I'm assuming no, but just thought I'd ask.

Ugh, what a quandary. We can assume the Zulus and Arabia are paying gpt to Persia for either Republic or monotheism, maybe both. Republic just showed up in the world halfway through my turns, so at worst Arabia (Zulus will be a nonentity by then) should be out from under its debt by about ten turns from now and able to trade for something from Persia. Vikings probably aren't paying for anything if you just gifted them Rep and Mono, so they may very well have gpt to spare once something comes available.

Do you want to give it a few more turns for something to break? As long as we're saving our money without spending it, we're really not losing any time on the self-research -- as more money goes into our coffers, we'll be able to afford more deficit research and the research times will drop accordingly. And with one more civ added to the list of those we know who are potentially researching Feudalism, the odds that it will show up soon increase a bit. (Vikings are quite possibly researching it now based on the techs they had when you met them.)

Does America have iron? If they don't, I'd say go ahead and gift them everything; there's nothing to lose there. If they do ... use your trusty coin?

Ugh, I need food.

The invasion sounds like it's going perfectly. A leader would be quite nice of course. Is the Antalya elite still alive? Any promotions?



Renata

 

[Sabre]

Persia has been as lifeless as the rest. The Americans do have iron, but by the time we get to them they would probably have pikes anyway. America also could be researching Feudalism as we speak. However, both were missing the two govt techs at contact so it's highly possible they could have been researching one of those. The Antalya elite is still alive and won a battle in the fight for Intombe (no leader ) and we are also now in possession of three elite horsemen and three elite swords. Hopefully we'll get a little luck soon, though with my history with leaders that luck will probably come after my turns.

I'll play on at min research, saving up gold. We don't really NEED knights at the moment, but I'd like to have them before we get to Persia. The dumb AI just really needs to get on the ball here!

 

[Keath]

I wonder if there isn't a nice parcel of land in the middle of the map? There seems to be lots of sea tiles jutting into the fog. If there is it must be out of reach of even the GLH so getting it doesn't now have the same urgency. The only problem would be barbs. In a domination win, I assume we must get 2/3 of all the land and population, including unclaimed?

Suicide volunteers? Or do we need to know?

 

[Renata]

Funky map. I bet that's it, though; it's a perfect spiral.

Renata

 

[Sabre]

A continent full of barbs would be a piece of cake to clear and settle. It doesn't really look like it is there to me but I could be wrong. Once we get a good portion of the known world conquered we might want to send a galley or two in there just in case.

News from turn 6 - the Persians have Theology!

 

[Keath]

Once we get the GLH I'd seriously consider a venture into the fog. What a great training ground clearing any land there would be.

Can we find anything out from the Submissions graph? Like have the other teams posted beyond 950 ad? Wacken might be finished, Peanut, Xteam? If that's the case it might give us a hint as to what our task is.

Theology?????

 

[Renata]

That might not be bad news. We know Persia can afford to buy Feudalism if someone else researches it, so we'll have two people knowing it immediately once it shows up. Whereas if Persia had gotten Feudalism, probably no one could have afforded it and we'd have to wait for a second civ to get it on their own anyway.

Renata

 

[Sabre]

Well, there will now be two civs who can buy Feudalism as the Arabs have learned it one turn later. Any chance they got it in a demand?

 

[Renata]

No doubt Persia gave it away for free. We all know how Deity AIs cheat.

Must .. get .. food .. am .. getting .. silly.

Renata

 

[Tone]

The Antalya elite is still alive and won a battle in the fight for Intombe (no leader ) and we are also now in possession of three elite horsemen and three elite swords. Hopefully we'll get a little luck soon, though with my history with leaders that luck will probably come after my turns.

At this rate it'll be when the GA will have no effect or when the HG are built and are too far away to capture quickly!

I'll play on at min research, saving up gold. We don't really NEED knights at the moment, but I'd like to have them before we get to Persia. The dumb AI just really needs to get on the ball here!

I think that we need knights if we want a quicker finish though. How many more turns before they get Fued?!!!!!!

 

[Renata]

The Hanging Gardens have been built, at the start of my turns. They're in Zimbabwe, which is very nice for us. All we need is to capture Zimbabwe, then after that to rush Sun Tzu's or something with a leader. Assuming we get one.

How many turns to Feudalism? Oh, maybe 40 or 50, no big deal.

Still need food.

Renata

 

[Sabre]

Turn 0 - 50ad: Move warrior from Cowtown South to North and mm Sogut 1 entertainer from a sea tile
Lux to 10% gaining +14gpt
Rush Galley in Jungle Port

ibt - Great Library catapult - horseman
Uskudar catapult - settler
Aydin horesman - horseman
Cowtown North - catapult - horseman
AI Bait catapult - catapult
Jungle Port galley - galley

Turn 1 - 70ad: Land 3 spears, 2 swords, 1 horse, 1 catapult, 1 settler 2 north of Antalya

ibt - Zulu land a horse in India
Indians request an audience - denied
Sogut horseman - horseman
Bursa galley - galley
Epulu worker - barracks

Turn 2 - 90ad: mm Cowtown North coast to taxman for happiness purposes
mm South Beach mined desert to entertainer (settler built next turn)
3 straight catapults hit zulu horse
elite sword kills horse - no dmg (1-0)
Konya built in zulu territory
Land 3 horse, 3 catapults and 1 sword into Konya

ibt - Persia denied an audience
Zulu horse killed by spear in Konya (2-0)
resistance ends in Madras - riots - starved with taxmen
Great Library horseman - horseman
Izmit aqueduct - horseman
New Calcutta catapult - catapult
Antalya horseman - horseman
South Beach settler - settler
Incense Hill galley - galley

Turn 3 - 110ad: send all but 1 spear from Konya to se of Intombe
vet horse kills reg Zulu archer near Intombe - no dmg (3-0)
transport new horse from Antalya directly to Konya and join him to Intombe stack
approaching galleys notice Hlobane defended by reg Impis

ibt - Persia lands 2 immortals near AI Bait
Zulu archer loses to horse - horse takes 2 dmg and promotes (4-0)
Zulu lands 1 horse near AI Bait
Sogut horseman - horseman
Aydin horseman - horseman

Turn 4 - 130ad: Catapults vs Intombe 2 hits, 2 miss, 1 hit Impi, 1 lost pop
Vet horse kills reg Impi, 1 dmg, promotes to elite (5-0)
Vet horse kills reg Impi, 3 dmg, promotes to elite (6-0)
Vet horse loses to 3hp vet Impi, 1 dmg (6-1)
Elite sword kills 2hp vet Impi, no dmg (7-1)
Intombe captured and razed, 4 workers captured
2 swords, 1 spear, 1 catapult land near Hlobane
Catapults vs Immortals 4 hits, 3 misses
Vet sword kills 2hp Immortal, 1 dmg (8-1)
Vet sword kills 2hp Immortal, 0 dmg (9-1)
Catapults vs horseman 1 hit, 1 miss
Reg sword kills 3hp horseman, 1 dmg (10-1)

ibt - Arabs denied an audience
Great Library horseman - horseman
Uskudar settler - library
New Calcutta catapult - catapult
Cowtown South horseman - library

Turn 5 - 150ad: Catapult vs Hlobane miss
4 swords land outside Hlobane
Contact Vikings - they suck as bad as the rest
Trade Monotheism, Republic for world map, contact with America, 64g
Glad I waited a bit on that suicide run - the land to the north is a narrow tail filled with various civs' towns
Declare war on Vikings
Ugh - America is right in line with the others
Trade Republic, Monotheism to Americans for world map
Declare war on America
Send exploring galley back home

ibt - Sogut horseman - library
Izmit horseman - horseman
Antalya horseman - horseman
Cowtown North courthouse - library
Bursa galley - galley
Uh - Persians are building Sistine Chapel?!? No you idiots!!!

Turn 6 - 170ad: 6 catapults land outside Hlobane - this should be enough to attack next turn
Catapult hits Hlobane, damaging an Impi - I was hoping for a lucky pop loss
8 horse, 3 swords and 4 catapults head into south Zulu, targetting Bapedi and hoping to meet up with the north force

ibt - Zulus land a warrior near Madras
Great Library horseman - horseman
Aydin horseman - horseman

Turn 7 - 190ad: Vet sword kills reg warrior near Madrid, 2 dmg, promotes to elite - need to get him to the front!
Catapults vs Hlobane - 1 hit, 6 misses - 1 Impi damaged - ugh
Elite sword loses to reg Impi (10-2)
Elite sword kills 2hp Impi, no dmg (11-2)
Vet sword kills 2hp Impi, 3 dmg, promote to elite (12-2)
Hlobane captured - I'll keep it to get those furs - 4 workers captured
Misclick while returning to civ after writing to notepad moves catapult in wrong direction - grrr
Lux to 0%
Catapults vs horseman outside Konya - 1 hit, 2 misses
Elite horse kills 2hp horse, 3 dmg
Decide to just leave the cats behind and take 8 horsemen, 3 swords and a spear on to Zimbabwe
Arabs now have Theology too
Hurry spearman in Bombay for 15g so I can replace our elite sword up in Madras

ibt - Zulu horse kills elite horse, no dmg (12-3)
Theology given by Great Library
Bombay spearman - spearman
3 resistors quelled in Bombay - riots - starve with taxmen
New Calcutta catapult - catapult
AI Bait catapult - catapult
Epulu barracks - horseman

Turn 8 - 210ad: Catapults attack zulu horseman - 2 hits, 1 miss
Catapult hits zulu archer
Elite horseman kills 2hp horseman, no dmg (13-3)
Vet horseman kills vet horseman, 2 dmg (14-3)
Vet horseman kills 2hp archer, 2 dmg (15-3)

ibt - Zulu reg archer loses to vet horseman, 2 dmg (16-3)
Sogut library - horseman
Great Library horseman - horseman
Uskudar library - settler
Izmit horseman - horseman
Antalya horseman - horseman

Turn 9 - 230ad: Vet horseman loses to vet Impi at Zimbabwe, 1 dmg (16-4)
That was Zimbabwe's only vet
Vet horseman loses to reg Impi, no dmg, promotes to vet (16-5)
Vet horseman loses to vet Impi, 2 dmg (16-6)
Vet sword kills reg Impi, 2 dmg (17-6)
Vet sword kills reg Impi, no dmg (18-6)
Elite sword kills reg Impi, 2 dmg (19-6)
Elite horseman loses to reg Impi, no dmg (19-7)
Vet horseman kills reg Impi, 2 dmg (20-7)
Vet horseman loses to reg Impi, 1 dmg, promotes to vet (20-8)
Vet horseman kills 3hp Impi, 3 dmg (21-8)
Vet horseman kills 3hp Impi, 3 dmg (22-8)
One 2hp Impi left that I know of

ibt - Zulu horse dies against elite horseman, no dmg (23-8)
Zulu archer kills vet spear, 2 dmg (23-9)
Aydin horseman - horseman
Lahore barracks - horseman
Bursa galley - horseman
Cowtown South library - horseman

Turn 10 - 250ad: Catapults vs Isandhlwana - 3 hits, 6 misses - 2 Impis damaged (1 redlined)
Elite swordsman kills 2hp Impi, no dmg (24-9)
Elite spearman kills 1hp Impi, 1 dmg (25-9)
Isandhlwana razed - 2 workers captured
Vet swordsman loses to vet Impi at Zimbabwe, 1 dmg (25-10)
Vet horseman loses to 3hp Impi, 1dmg, promotes to elite (25-11)
Vet horseman kills 3hp Impi, 1 dmg (26-11)
Elite horse loses to reg Impi, 2 dmg (26-12)
Elite sword kills 1hp Impi, 2 dmg (27-12)
Zimbabwe and Hanging Gardens (oh and the Oracle) are captured!
Vet sword loses to Vet Impi in north, 1 dmg
Vet sword forces Impi to retreat and captures settler
Vet sword kills 1hp Impi, 1 dmg (28-12)
Catapults vs archer - 2 hits and 1 miss
Vet horseman kills 1hp archer, no dmg, promotes to elite
Feudalism learned by Arabs and Persians same turn - nice way to end the set!


end notes - I have some galleys in Bursa waiting for use as transit to Arabia. I didn't really need them right away but I wanted to make sure we could get our troops across quickly.

We can research Chivalry at 100% (we are now running at 0% lux) in 5 turns I believe at a cost of just 445g. This will barely put a dent in our 1118g bank.

I have two settler in Konya waiting for Bapedi to be captured so we can fill in some of the gaps.

edit - Forgot to mention that the Persians have a galley on the way to AI Bait - very little going on there btw.

Killboard update:
Sabre - 31
Keath - 28
Tao - 20
Renata - 18
Furiey – 8

 

[Tone]

The Hanging Gardens have been built, at the start of my turns. They're in Zimbabwe, which is very nice for us. All we need is to capture Zimbabwe, then after that to rush Sun Tzu's or something with a leader. Assuming we get one.

How did I miss that gem? Was it illuminated with neon lights and loud sirens in your post? If the answer is yes then that'll be why. Oh well, at least any wonder will do once we get that town then

How many turns to Feudalism? Oh, maybe 40 or 50, no big deal.

It is inevitable that if we research it at max, the GL will give it to us one turn before we would get it ourselves. This could be in 10 or 30 turns; the game just knows when to do this. (BTW it was a rhetorical question but thanks for the reply anyway!)

You need food-I need sleep. Goodnight!

Edit:wrong again! Well done, Sabre!

 

[Renata]

@ Sabre:

That. Was. Freaking. Awesome.

Need to get home to look at the map. Yay!

Edit: Ok, I did that, and I have a whole stack of suggestions, if Furiey wants to hear them. It'll have to wait for morning, though.

Renata

 

[Keath]

What a great read! Nice going! I'm going to look at the map, too.

 

[tao]

Wow - excellent progress on the Zulu front. And bad news on the tech front.

I don't think that there is a big continent left, since there are no AI towns "missing" from the map.

Some minor details:
I would irrigate towards Konya, since it will become productive if enough citizens.
I would create entertainers in Bapedi, otherwise it will riot if resistance subsides.
I would rush the library in Edirne to claim the Indian lands.
Kick Jungle Port into wltkd.
We can put a number of towns in northern Zululands to increase free units.
Starve Hlobane, move the sleeping workers and cats out of it.
Put a harbor in Izmit for growth, irrigate the mine.
Build an aqueduct in New Calcutta.
Irrigate at Aydin to grow.
What about a market in Antalya?

Since we now have Hanging Gardens, the next Wonder we build will trigger our Golden Age. Thus let's hope for feudalism soon and a Leader for Sun Tzu's.

 

[Tone]

Since we now have Hanging Gardens, the next Wonder we build will trigger our Golden Age. Thus let's hope for feudalism soon and a Leader for Sun Tzu's.

We get fued next turn through the GLib so all we need is a GL!!!

 

[Furiey]

OK, got it. Can't look (other than check it loads OK) till after work. The thing I did notice was 7 turns to Engineering. So do we complete that then do the rush to Chivalry? It'll give us more horses built in the meantime and more gold to upgrade them with. Or do we abandon that and go all out for Chivalry straight away. OK, we get Fued next turn from the GL so it'll be 6 turns to go on Engineering that we'd be abandoning. Think I would probably finish Engineering at that. But I'm not awake yet and rambling....

 

[Sabre]

I need to make a correction on my time to research on Chivalry. Chivalry and Feudalism have the same base cost, so I've been using Feudalism's time to estimate Chivalry's. When I made my 5 turn guess I was forgetting that Feudalism was known by two civs and discounted. Chivalry will take a bit longer than that.

On Engineering, 6 turns is a tough call. The Zulu won't need knights, but they may come in handy vs those big Arab cities (Zimbabwe was pretty tough - of course the no retreat vs Impis made it worse). Depending on how long Chivalry really takes, we may want that extra gold.