Sid variant

[Own]

I had a funny feeling that I'd be wrong. 15 posts between you and larkin should outwit my 15 minutes analysis of a picture and spreadsheet.

Great Lighthouse... hmm... DocTs claims to have built the MoM on a standard sid island map. It is probably worth committing a city to, but I find that building wonders on sid (except GL, because the AI skips lit) usually takes a whole civ dedicated to building it- improving that city's tiles first, joining workers, raising lux instead of hiring specialists in that city, etc. I'm not sure if it's worth that, since our chances of hitting it are slim. But it would be huge. I always find that the AI that builds the GLH on island maps pulls ahead because they get contacts the quickest, especially if there are few seafaring civs.

 

[ThERat]

Larkin, I like your suggested spots 1 and 2. Much less crowded...

As far as the GLH is concerned, what do we hope to achieve from it? Are we actually planning to invade an AI on Sid with their massive troops early on? I don't think that is viable.
Maybe if 2 Civs share an Island and start to hammer each other, we could go in and play opportunistically

 

[Beorn-eL-Feared]

I was thinking maybe too small, just reaching contacts. I'll try and forget that idea.

Is Buce around?

 

[ignas]

Wow, just don't plan building any lighthouses and any invasions of Sid AI's home islands at least until the Industrial Age. I think all our main attention early on must be focused on building infrastructure (workers,settlers,libs,unis and few markets) and ICS'ing corrupted lands if our island is big enough.

Well like THERat i agree with I.Larkin's suggested town spots.

 

[Own]

In addition to those focus's, our other focuses should be distracting the AIs. If only one AI can safely, we can declare war on many civs and get them as an ally so they won't ally against us. They will be a buffer from the civs we're at war with. And we can war once we get gunpowder and astronomy. Land 30 muskets on the hill of an ironless backward AI, settle a city, rush walls and barracks, and watch their archers suicide and give us about a leader an IBT. We can make 2 musket armies and use them to pillage major AIs, as well as conquer entire civs by hiding trebs and LBs under them.

There is nothing more fun in civilization than conquering another island on civ. It's all tactics and baiting and sneakiness. It does take a long time though, so if we manage to delay the rest of the world via phony wars, alliances and pillaging, we can conquer lots and gain enough specialist farms to keep up.

This is looking way too far into the future, I apologize. At this very moment our focus should be building a powerful island.

 

[ignas]

well warring i guess is not in the first place in this SG. Firstly it is infrastructure to keep up in tech pace, war route is not the way to go. Well your 30 musketmen is 18 universities (30*60=1800 shields=18 unis).

11AI's = very fast tech pace, everything must be into techs and expanding

 

[ThERat]

actually I think getting the AI's into phony wars will slow them down a lot. They will sink all their shields into units and then drown in unit cost. Taking out their cities without reducing the # of units is key.
AI's that fight at Sid level are the ones that win in the end due to the reduced unit support...

 

[ignas]

Of course phony wars are one of the keys to victory. But it's quite uneasy to maintain this in later stages and against 11 civs on large size map.

But this should be discussed later. Now the main problem is where to settle and which direction to explore.

 

[ThERat]

I think the problem right now is, that the person that is up, isn't around. Many pages of good discussion, I think it's time to play another 10 turns and settle one of the 2 suggested spots...

 

[Own]

I can play ten easily tomorrow if all I have to do is follow a spreadsheet...

I think that the focus should be military, since we honestly can't keep up with the AIs by peacefully building, especially with the variant restrictions. Not that that has anything to do with our current situation, I'm just saying.

 

[Beorn-eL-Feared]

So, we need that concensus don't we.

Taking votes for city 2:
1 - Wine red dot (auto deer, 1 turn faster chop)
2 - Bright red '2' dot (auto silk, fat cross deer and wheat)
3 - Green dot (auto wines)
4 - Tile labeled 'Irrigate' in IL's rebuttal (auto deer, fat cross silk)
5 - White dot (fat deer)

Image ->

My vote is on 4: 'Irrigate' tile, for the deer real soon with silks in fat cross radius.

 

[Bucephalus]

Is Buce around?

Sorry guys, different time zone.

Unfortunately, I think I must bale out of this; I've misjudged how much free time I have, and I'm not able to give this the attention it needs. Apologies.

 

[Own]

I would rule green out- it has pretty crappy tiles in it's imediate radius, and will take a long time to develop. I don't see any deer next to the wine red. Graphics problem or are we thinking of a different dot?

I vote 4 also. We can get cow sharing going on, and a deer. We can't get it to grow in five turns, so we can't build a worker first, but what about a warrior then a worker?

I can take it this afternoon, even tho I am a bit busy, since all I have to do is follow strict instructions.

 

[I. Larkin]

Sorry guys, different time zone.

Unfortunately, I think I must bale out of this; I've misjudged how much free time I have, and I'm not able to give this the attention it needs. Apologies.

So, will we look for one more player? Anybody have a friend to pm?
Own up.
Strict instruction: Well... S/sheep will not work for many reasons...
Qwn: We can't get it to grow in five turns, so we can't build a worker first, but what about a warrior then a worker?
Why? Cow gives 4 fpt Just what we need to have worker at 5...
I think 3 workers is OK?
We started discusiion before s/sheet appeared...
Can I have .xcl file?
I vote for 4 "Irrigate" tile and that give us "qualified majority" to settle there.
It will work on Cow and we will not lose any fpt.
It has 4 fold usage. As I propose we will disband this sity at IA.
What to build next? I'd rather build workers in both Cities. Then Curragh and Settler.
Lighthouse reason: We may be :"locked at island". Slow Curragh have 2^-5 probability to cross 10 tiles sea/ocean. (say). So we need about 30 Curragh to establis contact. Lighthouse is "Cheaper". However we may easy to loose it on Sid.

 

[I. Larkin]

Roster re-open
3. Own- Up
4. ignas On Deck
5. ThERat
6. I. Larkin
1. Beorn-eL-Feared- just played
2. Bucephalus - claim out

 

[Own]

Why? Cow gives 4 fpt Just what we need to have worker at 5...

Of course, bad miscalculation/thinking that the cow would be given back to Flint for a turn or two.

I will "got it" after finishing this post.

 

[Own]

I have started playing, and so far I've moved the settler to our agreed second city location. The spreadsheet says curragh next, but I think we need a worker. And why are we mining a non river BG before a river BG? A new worker could improve that BG.

 

[vmxa]

Lurker:

I doubt you can afford to wait to industrial age for a war. You will need to get at least one army before then, so you can get the MA built and eventually the Pentagon.

In any Sid game that I found I was not able to get a real conflict till late, I had a big struggle.

Trying to match research will be a very unpleasant task, even if it is an island game. They pay only 40% for things and you will need lots of cities to get in the race.

 

[Beorn-eL-Feared]

If we follow the sheet, Own, We can't pull a worker in 5 from #2 because the cow has to be given back to the capital. In the capital cow hog scenario, #2 will have to produce something bigger at first, say, a settler (don't forget we have an inbound chop and an additionnal food for #2).

In a separate cows scenario, worker first would waste the chop. I'd give cow to the capital as much as it needs it while making sure a) we don't overproduce the settler (30 shields before growth to pop 3) in #2 town and b) not too much food is lost in doing a).

 

[Own]

I was wondering about it messing up the cycle, that's why I asked first. I'll finish up soon.