*Spoiler2* Gotm17- Full World Map+Explore

Originally posted by haegint
First of all I want to apologize to cracker and the community that I failed completely to take screenshots of my exploration events. I just forgot about it completely. I also did not write down the dates I made contact. So I will give you a rundown from what key elements and events I remember.

I didn't take any screenshots while playing. I just saved the game every other turn or so. Then I go back and pick out whatever screenshots I want. I have 73.1MB worth of saves for just GOTM17.

I find it interesting how the AI behaved so differently in everyone's games. Some people's games the American's took control of their continent, while others say the Germans did, etc. Some people had two civ's wiped out before even making contact while other games the AI never had any wars at all. In my game there was no evidence of any wars before 1250 AD except for mine with Egypt. The power on each set of islands was very balanced between the two or three civ's there.
 
Yes Shillen, the different behaviours of the AI's among themselves I noticed also going through other player's notes.

In my game there was more warmongering among the AI's than the Russia - America war I mentioned.

On the top of my head, I do remember a popup saying that Iroqouis and Zulu signed a peace treaty, but that was only "recently", like in mid-medieval age. Greece and Rome may have had a war in the early game as well. Babylonians may have been involved in a war also, not sure.

I'll take a closer look and report when I get home later.

<<I have 73.1MB worth of saves for just GOTM17.>>
You're a good GOTM-er :)
 
@flexo - how do you know about coal resources in the middle ages? Ack - I've been spoiled. Lucky for you, Steam is in 1 turn and I can do nothing with the knowledge your timetraveller has imparted on me.

My travels (from memory so don't sue me if some of the details are a little off):
After losing a half dozen galleys, an intrepid sailor heading due south finds Germany ~600AD. They have Monarchy which I've skipped for good reason. We have Feudalism and Engineering. I'm guessing they got montheism when they entered the middle ages. They know the Americans. I had previously been notified that the Russians were eliminated. After buying Germanys map I realize they were the aggressors. Not only is russia gone but America has lost half their empire and is left with washington, boston and one other city. Germany has not inhabited their inner island which has luxuries and a goody hut. I love huts but can't get to this one. My suicide galley had no passengers. America, contacted next also has Monarchy but is down by Monotheism, Feudalism, Engineering. I think we had Invention also. After trading WM and selling them ROPs that they have no hope of using, neither civ has gold left and I really don't care about monarchy at this time. No techs gained. I vow to help America as much as possible to prevent their elimination. My successful galley captain sets about charting the seas around Germerica that only the holders of the GLighthouse can see. I spare him a suicide run as a reward for successfully making contact.

A half dozen other admirals were not so lucky. Finally I fortify the remaining ships on sea tiles waiting for Navigation. Research is nearing 4 turns/tech and we're beelining to Navigation.

After Navigation, a due east boat contacts Persia through a musketman! They (obviously) have Gunpowder and they have Chivalry but are behind in theology and the entire upper branch. I don't want to get gunpower yet as I have no need for defence until others get to navigation. I don't want to give them any help toward navigation but I use theology as a bargaining chip. They have a ton of gold and quite a few cities. I take most but not all of their savings and income (+20GPT) and their map with a ROP, WM and Theology. They know England but I will introduce myself as I now see where they are. England is in the same boat as America, down to two cities. I make another vow to help them out. They have nothing to trade with which means persia has knights and muskets to their spears and warriors. Ouch! I gift Feudalism as a start although I don't think they have iron left. It will be the first of many gifts.

Babylon is contacted by a Southwestern boat. They also have monarchy and are behind by the first middle age techs. Their map guides the way to the Iroquois and Zulus. I switched to selling my territory maps, only, to prevent their quick exploration. The Zulu's are definitely the richest and have luxuries to spare. They become good trading partners for the remainder of the age. I had high hopes for this continent because all civs were evenly split but they remain backwards.

The aztecs were contacted by my suicide captain, travelling much more safely east from Germerica. China is found on their map and contacted also. They both are way behind and become the recipients of a lot of gifts to keep then near the other civs. I don't want the other civs to have a lot to offer when they all finally meet.

I landed a settler on the tiny whale island with hopes of having that all to myself. Another on the wines pennisula and have two boats of muskets+settler headed to the fur pennisula guarded by crackers minions.

I was pretty happy maintaining ROPs with everyone and trading territory maps frequently. Looks like I'm headed for another Diplomatic win. The only war after the elimination of Egypt has been with Rome and I blame that on the stupid goto command. I ordered one of my ships home to pick up supplies and didn't notice that path went through the canals of Rome. At the end of one turn my ship stopped on the one tile exit for the neighboring city's port. Rome felt that I was blockading his port and attacked me. His galley lost. I moved away and 5 turns later he sent 20g as an apology and went back to being polite!

EDIT: Forgot to mention Greece and Rome. I think I found them After Persia and England. They were also behind me. I had no problem buying luxuries from Greece. Rome originally needed some help and got some gifts to catch them up to their island partner.
 
I managed to reach rome/greece-island with a suicide galley but lost another 6-7 or so. I was way ahead of them in tech so I didn't gain anything on that.

Around 700bc I had problems with one of my cities (Leptis Minor). As soon as I entered it I was thrown out of the game. I reloaded and tried again - thrown out. When I tried this later it worked fine. I'm running vanilla civ 1.29f. I have kept the save so I will see if I can reproduce the error.

Anyway, Romans just landed on my island and wants a war with me. I've been nice giving away contacts and trading with him and still he is aggressive against a clearly stronger opponent. Well well, I guess I have to teach him a lesson.
 
Originally posted by drewshark
Hee, Hee, I actually have reached the second spoiler this month before the 25th.

I guess that new baby hasn't negatively impacted your civ time!:)
 
Originally posted by Megalou


Incredible! My best city produces 48 c/t. Even if I had had all my small wonders and culture-producing wonders in that city it would only yield 78 c/t. I bow to this superior achievement, especially since you still seem to be somewhere around the middle ages. It also goes to show how valuable it can be to stick to one tactic. I changed tactics from conquest to culture 100k and I'm way behind you in anticipated date of victory.
Would be fun if you gave some interesting details on this later.

I didn't notice da_greatest's comment the first time around, but it's gotta be some kind of typo. I don't think it's possible at all in the time frame covered by this spoiler thread.

All of the ancient age wonders base culture added together: 25 cpt.

All of the middle age wonders base culture added together: 34 cpt.

The possible small wonders added together (FP, HE, MA): 8 cpt.

The five available cultural improvements added together: 17 cpt.

And I'll throw in the palace (1 cpt) just for hahas.

Now double them all and it's still only 170 cpt. I did the math in my head so I may be off a smidge, but not by *that* much.

Renata
 
370AD marked the beginning of a new era in the history of the Republic of Carthage. Our researchers had developed the study of Monotheism, our first step into the Middle Ages. After two short wars, all of Egypt had been subdued, and was being developed. (For details on those wars and the Ancient history of Carthage, click here .) Construction of the Forbidden Palace had begun in Cirta (just west of the Egyptian lands) in 340AD, and would take approximately 300 years.

It was now time once again to look outward, beyond our local archipelago, and discover new lands and new peoples to trade with. Since we had discovered a thick bank of fog to the south of Incense Island, that seemed like a logical place to begin. After all, most of our earlier islands had been shrouded in fog, why else would it be there? However, that galley had died in the attempt, and it would be too risky to try and cut through the fog one at a time, especially in treacherous waters where speed was of the essence. Remembering the legends of Hanno an dhis journey, it was thought there would be safety in numbers. Therefore it was determined to assemble a Great Expedition. This group, gathered near Sabratha, included 5 galleys, carrying 2 swordsmen and 2 horses to explore any lands they might find.

They left sight of land in 390AD, fighting their way into the first layer of fog. Two of the five galleys did not survive, lost in treacherous waters, but the other three pressed on south. The elite galley pushed into the second layer, and seeing a third layer of fog, waited for another galley to push forward until he saw sunlight once again. However, there was no land on the other side of the fog!!! After muttering some curses only a sailor could understand, they pressed further south, but still saw nothing.

The year 410AD began with all three galleys still afloat! With no fog in sight, they decided to split up in the hopes of finding land. The lead galley continued due south, a second went southeast, and the third went southwest, where just over the horizon they saw a whale spouting out of the sea! Unfortunately, that was the last we heard from them, as they and the galley to the south were both lost in the treacherous waters. Now we were faced with a quandry, as the remaining galley had seen nothing, but would take it decades to reach the whale spotted by the southwestern galley. Instead they pressed on, going SW then S, hoping to find some more land, while back home several ports were scrambling to outfit more galleys to follow up on the whale sighting. 430AD was another tense year, as our sole surviving galley stayed afloat in the deep ocean, then sailed due south again, but was still met with nothing but ocean. Amazingly, they survived yet again, and continued south, and just when their voyage seemed to end, they caught sight of a seacoast, and the markings of a new people: America!

Having trouble uploading the screenshots to the server, but here is the first, as the survivors of the Great Expedition break through the fog!
 

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Lincoln was cautious toward us, and obviously still in his own ancient age, he did not understand the concept of currency. He had 9 cities, 21 gold, and access to fur and horses, although none to spare. He also knew of two other peoples, the Germans and the Russians. He agreed to introduce me to them both, as well as show me his map of the world and pay me 20 gold, if I would teach him about currency. Bismark was annoyed, and even less advanced than the americans, not having discovered mathmatics or code of laws, but did have Monarchy. He was broke, had only one fur, and 4 cities. He gave me his map for math, but would not explain monarchy to me for anything! Since we were happy with our Republic, and he had already built the Hanging Gardens, I wasn’t particularly concerned. Catherine was cautious, had obviously been trading with Bismark, as she also needed math and had monarchy, but would not trade. She did give me her map and 7 gold for math. She had 5 cities, and also had access to Dyes, as well as incense. Looking at their maps, they formed a strange shape, like a big donut, with smaller islands in the middle, one of which even had a hut on it that no one had reached, but I couldn’t get to it either. This was a great year, we also developed the study of Theology. Because ocean trade looked to be so critical, we continued researching down this path to Education.
 

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Meanwhile, it would be nearly another hundred years, and three more galleys, before we finally reached our elusive whale sighting to the southwest. In 530AD a galley reached the borders of Greece. Alex was considerably more advanced than the others, as he had already begun his middle ages, and had Monotheism, but had somehow bypassed the study of Literature. He had 8 cities, 20 gold, and spices, as well as contact with a new nation called Rome. However, he wanted way too much to introduce me, so I accepted his map and 20 gold for teaching him literature and sailed to Rome myself. 40 years later, (570AD), I met Caesar aboard his private, elite Barge. He was also polite, had expanded to 12 cities, also had spices and gems, and 34 gold. He wanted Monotheism badly, and since Alex would sell it to him eventually if I didn’t, I gave it to him for Monarchy, his map, 30 gold and 1gpt. By now we had also implemented a program of Education in Carthage, and had begun research into Astronomy.

600AD was a year of revelation. The city of Cadiz, next to the incense on Incense Island, completed a harbor in preparation for Astronomy. However, it turns out that our traders could have been bringing that incense home for the past 1700 years by the light of our Great Lighthouse, and did not need the stars to sail by. The secrets of Astronomy were unlocked in 610AD, and we immediately sought to apply them to Navigation.
{600AD: Carthage 609, Amer. 370, Rome 362, Greece 264, Russia 240, Germ. 237 Egypt 183}
 

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In 640AD the Forbidden Palace is finally completed in Cirta, and corruption and waste is dramatically decreased in the former Egyptian lands. The pace of our research also begins to accelerate. New caravels begin to push out to the east and west of our home islands, while the galleys that found America and Greece continue to scout around the edges of their seas, waiting to understand Navigation to eliminate the risk of their journeys, which is completed in 670AD. This also allows trade with our newly discovered lands. Greece will sell us Spice for Ivory, Wine and Iron, and also wants our horses, which we sell for 20 gold plus 4gpt. Russia trades us Dyes for Ivory, Wine, the secret of Currency, and 14gpt.

The Caravels have better luck, finding England in 690AD. Elizabeth is cautious and relatively advanced, as she has a system of Feudalism, 9 cities, 93 gold, and silk, as well as contact with Persia. However, one of my other caravels travelling around the world can see the borders of Persia, so I won’t pay for what I can get for free, and in 700AD I make contact with Persia myself. Xerxes is annoyed, has Monotheism, 6 cities, 15 gold, and excess silk! Not wanting to give up Theology just yet, (which is what they both want), I wait another ten years to finish my work on Engineering. Luckily I trade with England first (I forgot she had the Great Library), and she will give me Feudalism, her map, 190 gold and 11 gpt for it, and Persia supplies me with silk for Engineering and 2gpt. The Romans now have some spare gems available, and will trade them to me, along with 60 gold +9gpt, for Engineering. They also want some of my wine, which I sell them for 40 plus 2gpt. No one else has enough to offer to be worthwhile.

{750AD: Carthage 705, Eng 405, Rom 403, Ame 402, Per 317, Gre 290, Rus 256, Ger 250}
 

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750AD is a year of decision. We have contact with 7 other civilizations, but there are rumors of four more, which must be even further south. Through trade, we have access to seven different luxuries, but the only two known sources of the eighth, fur, are Germany and America, and neither have any to spare. They are the most backward group of people, in fact Germany is still in the ancient ages. We could mount a major expedition to sieze a source of fur, but that is still a long distance at these speeds. I have kept from introducing any of the groups of people to one another, and have not revealed my map to anyone, and by not selling Theology to anyone, I know it will be a long time before they can contact one another. Surely we could research down the warpath and overwhelm any one group with superior forces, but I don’t see much of a payoff. As long as I am more advanced than they are, I can keep trading for the luxuries I need, and any cities I took would be hopelessly corrupt. Carthage is will finish building Copernicus’ Observatory in 60 years, so I wouldn’t want to move my palace away from there. Utica is also working on Sistine Chapel, but is still three centuries from completion. No, I will remain peaceful, and that means I should pursue an improved form of government, known as Democracy. I start by researching the Printing Press, to create ballots I guess. I also send more caravels south to explore beyond Rome and America.

In 790 we invent the Printing Press, and begin to work on the details of Democracy. Copernicus’ Observatory is completed in Carthage in 810AD. In 820AD one of our caravels discovers the Aztecs. They are a backward people, lacking literature, mapmaking, and polytheism. They are annoyed, but have 5 cities, and know the Chinese. For Literature, they share their map and knowledge of China. China is also backwards, cautious with 7 cities, but I give them literature for their map. Significantly, they have NO luxuries between them. Maybe that is why they are so backward, luxury taxes draining their research. Also, how did they settle the outer islands without mapmaking? Culture cannot explain these...
 

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The Carthaginian Revolution begins in 830AD, as our people yearn for Democracy. In preparation for the upcoming anarchy, I paid to rush construction on several projects, including a couple of settlers to build extra cities on some of my coastal areas. Also, to make up for the lack of research, I sell engineering to the Greeks. Now all four of the advanced societies should be researching Invention, hopefully one of them will get it before I am done, and I can buy it from them. My exploration continues during this period, and in 860AD I discover the Zulus. Shaka is annoyed, but has 16 cities. He has entered the middle ages, and has Feudalism and Monotheism. Looking at the names of some of his cities, he must have overrun the Babylonians, although he still has contact with them and the Iroquois. Also looks like the Iroquois have taken at least one of his cities. He also has Fur available. A decade of trading follows in 870AD. After hearing that Persia has started on Leo’s Workshop, I immediately go to Xerxes and offer Theology for Invention, which he will accept if I throw in 150 gold, and I do. I now turn to Elizabeth to see what I can get, but now realize she has the Great Library, so she now has both technologies. (duh!). Caesar, however, wants invention, and will offer Chivalry, 120 gold, and 2gpt for it. This time I am smart, and go back to England first, getting 70 gold and 39gpt for Chivalry and Iron, then turn to Xerxes and get 170 and 9 gpt for it. Shaka trades me contact with Iroquois, Babylon, and his map for Theology, and gives me Fur for Engineering and Literature (steep, but it’s the last one). Turns out Babylon is down to one city on an island, only has monotheism, the Iroquois have 7 cities, cautious, but also only have monotheism. They both need literature, so I give it to them for their maps. It is time to renew some trade deals, Russia gives me 30 gold +9gpt for Chivalry, and then trades Dye for Ivory, Wine, and Engineering. Greece wants Chivalry to renew the spice deal, AND 40gpt, but I have to take it.

920 is a big trading year, I shop Education around. I start with England, getting satisfaction out of her paying me 120+16gpt to obsolete her own library. Persia and Rome each kick in 21gpt, also renew the silk deal with Persia for Printing Press. I also find a new isolated island in the far southeast, but it is swarming with barbs!!! That is where I also see my fourth volcano and some captives, but it also has a source of fur!! Time to mount a new expedition, of muskets this time, to subdue these barbs and secure my own fur. That ends this age, as Carthage is now beginning the transition into The Industrial Age.
 

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Originally posted by Justus II
I also find a new isolated island in the far southeast, but it is swarming with barbs!!! That is where I also see my fourth volcano and some captives, but it also has a source of fur!! Time to mount a new expedition, of muskets this time, to subdue these barbs and secure my own fur. That ends this age, as Carthage is now beginning the transition into The Industrial Age.

I knew it!:jump: I knew that there was some names there. I saw two barb camps there, but I was too busy preparing for the invasion of Germany (I needed all the ships for tranporting troops). After I took Berlin, the Germans escaped to that Southeast Island and they took care of that volcano before I had a chance to check them out.
 
This is my 1st gotm, Just thougt I'd say acouple things. I noticed that a lot of different war and non war scenarios have happened. I am not really good at this game yet, never played civ 1 or 2 just played civ 3 for about 4 months. I love this map, Great job Cracker!!! By the time I met all the other civs, The Russians and Babylonians were both Gone. Germany had taken out Russia and part of America. The Iroqouis had taken out the Babylonians and were at war with the Zulus(they finished them off shortly thereafter) I went to war with Egypt, But was nice and left them 1 city, took way too long due to cultre flips.

Anyway I have never won a game any higher than Warlord laevel, But I am in 2nd place in points behind Iroquois. In Tech's I am pretty far behind England,persia, Iroqouis and Germany. I am right even with America and a little ahead of China. Egypt and Aztec are both way behind.

Thanks for the fun Game, Love it!!
 
The suicide galleys did work for me. I found 3 different land masses with them. Had I waited for Navigation, I would have waited until 900 ad to make contact as opposed to 300ad. That's worth it in my book. However I think my lack of a Forbidden Palace until almost 1000 ad must have really slowed me down as I seem to be far behind some of the front runners.

310ad. Land sighted! I’ve lost 3 other galleys, but the one heading south from Alexandria managed to survive 3 turns and I have entered sea north of a land mass holding 2 civs at least from what I can see. Contact should be next turn.
320ad. I meet the Russians and the Americans, who also have knowledge of the Germans. I don’t trade anything yet, because I want to explore their shores some.
370ad. I trade currency around for contact and everyone’s world map. The 3 civ island is cool looking, like a volcanic atoll. They have not explored much at all, so I’ll start testing the west side of their world for signs of other civs.
450ad. I trade Monarchy to Russia for Construction, and enter the Middle Ages. I start a beeline for Navagation, which will take 5 techs.
500ad. My galley in the german/American waters finds no signs of nearby land. So again they set off on a wild goose chase, this time heading west.
510ad. The galley spots a civ to the south, but ends in ocean. IF they can survive, we’ll make contact… they don’t, so it will have to wait!
550ad. I send a galley south from the southwest corned of my main island. They survive the first round, and at the end of the second round they see a civ to the south. They die also. I start building some ships to send 4 at one time on a death voyage to see who will make it.
730ad. I’ve built up a fleet of 8 galleys. I’m sending them all together hoping that some will make it to the civ(s) to my south. 4 of the 8 are lost on the first turn. Amazingly, NONE of the 4 remaining ships are lost on the next turn.
750ad. I make contact with Greece, give him Monarchy to get contact with Rome and his WM. At this time I keep contact with everyone a secret, and I also keep my TM and WM a secret. My theory is when everyone finally gets ships that can sail the oceans, they will have to come find me if they want to, but they will know where everyone else is when I finally allow them contact.
900ad. I discover navigation, and will build Magellan’s in 14 turns. I’m now heading for Democracy, and then I’ll trade some techs to get caught up on the military side. I’m way ahead in tech, as well as in communications. I’m building zero military right now since there’s almost no way anyone else could manage to get here. The one exception might be to build a couple of my UUs and try to get them to someone else to fight. In retrospect I should have used a few on the last Egyptian city to start my GA.
980ad. Iroquois complete Sun Tzu’s.
1070ad. My last galley from the Rome/Greece island has made it to the Babylonian lands. I make contact. They have knowledge of the Iroquois and the Zulu. I get their World Map for Ivory!
1110ad. My galleys don’t seem to sink since Magellans. So either that or Navigation must have given them safe passage over the oceans. That will help speed things up.
1120ad. I research Democracy and begin revolution.
1170ad. I make contact with the Persians. I trade him Printing Press for Chivalry, his WM and $10 gpt. His map reveals the English who I also make contact with. Only 2 civs left to find. I’m guessing they will be in the southwest corner of the map.
1180ad. I find the Aztecs and make contact with them. I buy the Aztec WM. I still haven’t given my TM or WM to anyone.
1210ad. I discover an unsettled island far southwest near china.
 
I never sold my maps either to slow the AI expansion down. But a handful of turns after Navigation, the Persians had settled on all three of the wildcard islands. They had to beeline there with settlers on board so unless they got extremely lucky, they cheated. I figured I had another 15 turns or so to fill out my settlements. Now I'm forced to share which will probably drag me into a war I don't want to fight.
 
Originally posted by ControlFreak
I never sold my maps either to slow the AI expansion down. But a handful of turns after Navigation, the Persians had settled on all three of the wildcard islands. They had to beeline there with settlers on board so unless they got extremely lucky, they cheated.

The AI doesn't get lucky. They know exactly what they're doing. The same thing happened in my game, except with the English. The English had no knowledge of the island to their south, but as soon as they had Magnetism, they sent a galleon there.
 
I've found a few screenshots of my game and after 2 successful suicide runs. It sounds to me like, even with the GL, I had less success and took longer than most to break through. By 1120 ad, I was already researching Navigation, 7 turns away.
Like Justus II, I too attempted for many years to get a landing party on the barbarian island to the far Southeast finally getting in around 1500ad. We can now rush a harbor and send back more furs to the home island group.
 

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I think the timing of trading communications to the AI is critical to this game. I spread the info around too early and that allowed the AI to speed up its tech research. Having lots of gold and luxury trade was great during the Middle ages, but in the long run a bad plan.
 
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