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SteamDB: "Bison" Depot??

Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by Scirocco16V, Nov 15, 2013.

  1. anandus

    anandus Errorist

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    Wow. If they would do that it would be a game-changer. Literally.
    It would increase the longevity of Civ5 immensely.
     
  2. Tsuchinoko

    Tsuchinoko Warlord

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    For all the people saying that Civ VI ought to be released next year - I really doubt that's going to be enough time for Firaxis to produce a particularly good game, even under the leadership of Beach and Shirk. If we were to see something released then I'd expect it to be the bare-bones of a game - lacking many of the mechanics and civs we're used to in BNW (or BtS!) and probably full of bugs and balance issues - much like Civ V was in Vanilla. I reckon that 2016 (or later) would be a much more reasonable target for a well fleshed-out Civ VI Vanilla, as it'll give the development team time to properly test their ideas and make sure everything works as expected, and hopefully add a bit more content so the game doesn't feel so stripped down. I'd much rather wait an extra year if it meant that Civ VI released with, say, 25+ Civs, a solid AI, some kind of religion system, trade mechanics, meaningful diplomacy and espionage, etc.

    Of course, I wouldn't say no to another expansion for Civ V before then either - but that sounds somewhat unlikely at this point.
     
  3. Camikaze

    Camikaze Administrator Administrator

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    The producer/design team for vanilla was Shirk, Shafer, Beach, Lewis. The producer/design team for G&K was Shirk, Beach, Lewis, Strenger. It was the same for BNW. So it's not like the expansions were by completely different people. There might have been some design problems with vanilla that were down to Shafer, and certainly Ed Beach is a great designer, but a buggy release with less features than the previous civ version isn't a matter of the lead designer. It's a matter of time, which you'd think would be much more under the control of 2K. I think it's quite odd to think that an almost identical Civ6 development team would produce a drastically higher quality vanilla game given the same amount of time. The optimism is nice, and you'd think an almost identical team would've learned from past mistakes and would be able to set themselves up quite nicely for the next release, but if you're expecting a fantastically balanced and polished Civ6 vanilla, you may be setting yourself up for disappointment.
     
  4. Myomoto

    Myomoto King

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    Does anybody know when the supposed civ mmo will be out? If it's published by 2k as well (which I imagine it is), I could see that dropping in 14/15 and civ VI would be out the following year.

    It doesn't make sense to me if there would be more than one civ product in a given year, since the audience is probably not that big that 2k wouldn't be concerned about cannibalizing sales from one product on another.
     
  5. anandus

    anandus Errorist

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    Both Civ4 as Civ5 shipped with 18 civs, so I'd suspect a same amount (give or take) for Civ6. Not much more.
    They should also leave room for civs for expansions/DLC.

    That said, if they'd have a cheaper approach to new civs than now (which I assume is quite expensive with the 3D art and the voices), more could be possible, of course and still have room for plenty of civs to sell.
    But personally I don't count on it.
     
  6. Scirocco16V

    Scirocco16V Warlord

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    We have no idea when development started on Civ VI. I remember hearing that they originally didn't plan on any expansions for V. Then they thought G&K would be the only expansion and had no plans for BNW. Based on that, for all we know VI has been in development since before G&K. Also, I remember hearing that parts of the code from IV were carried over into V; there's no reason to think chunks of the code from V won't be carried over to VI.

    Firaxis also has to pay all it's employees and its bills in a timely matter while they're developing whatever comes next. They're going to be living off Civ 5 Complete sales and whatever they have saved up until VI (or whatever is next) comes out. That results in a certain time frame they have to release in whether the game is done or not.
     
  7. cpm4001

    cpm4001 Goggleman

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    I get the feeling that Civ VI development has already begun, but probably in the sense of the devs saying, "Hey, wouldn't it be cool if [whatever] was in the game?"
     
  8. Tsuchinoko

    Tsuchinoko Warlord

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    I don't actually think that Shafer was at fault for most of the problems with vanilla Civ V. He may not have been the best choice as designer due to his relative lack of experience, but he seemed to ende up as the fall guy for a lot of things that were nothing to do with him. I think that it was poor decisions by 2k that were the real issue - laying off Firaxis staff a few months before release and pushing for a release when the game was barely in a state that could be considered 'finished'.

    I don't think I'm deluding myself over what Civ VI vanilla will be like - I'm expecting to be at least somewhat disappointed by it. It concerns me though that if 2k sees lots of people on the forums demanding Civ VI as soon as possible they'll push Firaxis into releasing the game in unfinished state again (resulting in the usual cycle of people complaining that it's irreparably broken and that they should move on to Civ VII immediately) and that's something I think really ought to be avoided, if at all possible.

    Yeah - I expect they'll have 18 again too - even though that will leave out some civs that were very important historically. I also agree that if they could find a cheaper/easier way of doing the leaderheads that would be great - having more civs and/or multiple leaders for civs seems like a good thing to me. Also there are still plenty of interesting civs that haven't ever been included in the series yet - there's no need to remove any of them for expansion material, so why not request that Firaxis aim higher and include a greater starting number?

    Again - I'm sure you guys are correct on this - I'd be very surprised if there wasn't some initial groundwork done on Civ VI (assuming that is Firaxis' next project) already. However, a large majority of it probably hasn't even been touched yet, and I don't think that one year will be enough to produce something that is anything more than underwhelming. As far as I'm aware Firaxis/2k aren't short of money, and after the success of Civ V and its expansions they know that future content/interations will sell (I think there was some concern that strategy games just weren't popular anymore prior to the release of Civ V) - so hopefully 2k will be willing to invest a bit more and won't be afraid to give Firaxis the time and money it needs to make a game that's more satisfying than Civ V was.

    It does seem that a lot of people are willing to accept an unfinished, stripped-down and sub-par game just because it's 'vanilla', even when we know that Firaxis are capable of producing something much better. We shouldn't have to wait for an expansion pack to make the game good, just because it's beneficial for 2k when they're able to release a game early and still make loads of sales because people know that it will eventually be something amazing. Is it really so unreasonable for us to ask for a Civ VI that's at least as good as, say G+K on release? :(
     
  9. Eagle Pursuit

    Eagle Pursuit Scir-Gerefa

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    I'd bet they are in the early coding phase of Civ VI. I recall seeing a message on Twitter that they were hiring programmers at Firaxis for an unnamed project.
     
  10. beetle

    beetle Deity

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  11. ColdFever

    ColdFever blue

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    Don't worry. Civ VI will blow us away. Firaxis is bigger and better than it ever was.
    They now have the people, the tools and the support to realize anything a designer's dream can imagine. The only thing PC players probably will have to get used to is to share their favorite game with the consoles. With the pc architecture and the power of the new consoles, Firaxis/2K finally will be able to reach this audience as well with their finest product. A Civ IV release in 2015 appears likely for me. Currently, the question is: What will be the BIG Firaxis game of 2014? Any ideas?
     
  12. adwcta

    adwcta King

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    They're going to do the civ MMO before Civ VI and there'll be a 1 year gap between the two releases.

    2014 holiday season for civ mmo, 2015 summer for civ V if the MMO flops and winter if it does okay-well.
     
  13. ColdFever

    ColdFever blue

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    The Civ MMO ("Civ Online" by XLGames) has nothing to do with Firaxis and will only be released in Asia. So what may come from Firaxis in 2014?
     
  14. adwcta

    adwcta King

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    Actually it gets support from Fraxis on a high level. Plus, release dates are publishing decisions, and publishers strategically avoid doing things in conflict, especially things from the same franchise. The mmo is also expected to launch closed beta in the next couple of months, which means it will likely do a minecraft-esq open beta release in the holiday season.

    Just don't hold your breath for civ 6, it'll be at least a year and a half to release, even if they're already deep into working on the game (which, they probably aren't, except at a high level).
     
  15. ColdFever

    ColdFever blue

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    Interesting, from where did you get this? Sid Meier once told the press there was only one contact at the start of the MMO project to check the overall design, so that he could give his ok. I did not see any info update indicating more involvement of Firaxis in Civ Online. So if you know more, please share!
     
  16. adwcta

    adwcta King

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    I googled it, "fraxis support". if it sounds implausible, then take it with a grain of salt since its just unsubstantiated reports on the internet. Sid's not involved past that first meeting (no evidence otherwise).
     
  17. Kwami

    Kwami Deity

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    EA might own the name, but they can't own the concept. At least in the US, game play, concepts, and mechanics cannot be trademarked, patented, or copyrighted. That's why there are so many legal Tetris clones, for instance.
     
  18. Arachnofiend

    Arachnofiend Perturbed Pugilist

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    If EA wanted to be a butt about it they could take it to court anyways and just stall proceedings enough to make it too costly for it to be worth it for 2K. Tear Ring Saga (Playstation game, made by ex-Intelligent Systems director that was functionally identical to Fire Emblem) got canned this way. And this is EA we're talking about so they'd totally be a butt about it.
     
  19. Iklabain

    Iklabain Warlord

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    I think late 2014/early 2015 is likely for vanilla civ 6. It probably won't be perfect, but it will be better than civ 5 otherwise they wouldn't be the company we know and love.
     
  20. Kwami

    Kwami Deity

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    I don't know about that. Vanilla Civ V was a fair bit worse than Civ IV:BtS, I think. I expect that VI will feature some major changes on the level of hexes, 1UPT, or city-states, but that it will lack depth and polish until the expansions.
     

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