Succession Game for Newbies

[Tad Empire_0_o]

Gl Kumquat nice job overseerer I think we should I have a early war with the celts, they are 2 close 2 us !

 

[Tad Empire_0_o]

I think otheil is next than me and then HY =)

Overseer
Kumquat- just played
Othneil- up
Tad
Hycrest

 

[Tad Empire_0_o]

er.... you where playing on regent? If it is lets just start othneils map <---- Backup plan

 

[TheOverseer714]

Yes, I think a screenshot would be nice at the end of each individual's turn in the round. Thanks Cbob, It makes too much sense to not use it. Here is roster.
Round 1
1. TheOverseer714-played
2. Kumquat-just played
3. Othniel -up
4. Tad Empire-on deck
5. HyCrest-warming up
6. drakdan? (are you still interested?) I assume not, so it'd be back to me.

I can't find Othniel's save, where is it? I only saw the screenshot.

 

[Kumquat]

Regent and Monarch are almost the same why restart?

 

[TheOverseer714]

I'm ok with Regent level, just wonder if everyone else is. Where is Othniel, he seems to have vanished? I'm okay with going on or a re-start, I'm reading another SG for newbies, they had their fits and starts too, so a re-start is not unprecedented. Tad is here, but haven't seen Hycrest either, so we're on hold anyway. I'll want to hear from them before we go either direction.

 

[Tad Empire_0_o]

well, atleast we started a little bit , we should each have 20 turns, because its 2 fast 2 change people because some arnt ready.

 

[Othniel]

Hey guys. I'm still here.

I haven't had a chance yet to open the save, but so far it sounds pretty good Our starting area looks nice, and I like the decision to build an early settler before the Paris granary.

Bummer on the pottery thing. Normally I refrain from researching pottery because you can usually easily trade for it before you need to build a granary. But, there is always the risk if you don't research pottery that you would have to delay a granary, which is stinky. Anyhow, I don't think that was much harm done, and we should still easily be able to get a slingshot on Regent.

Orleans will be an easy worker factory, and possibly even a settler factory is we got some BG's after chopping the forests.

You know, I think I'm ok with playing the game on Regent. I know that it means we will have a really easy game, but honestly I think we would whup the AI on Monarch too. The key will be to have good playing habits and not get lazy just because the AI is easy.

If you guys want to restart too, that's fine.

Hey Kumquat, do you have a turn log to post?

EDIT: Now I see Kumquat's turn log. Never mind...

 

[Othniel]

I need to go for about an hour here. After that, I'll come back here and see if there are updates.

If not, I'll continue with this game and play my 10 turns tonight. I still think we should play 10 turns simply because this part of the game is vital and important to take slowly.

Remember to feel free to stop in the middle of your turns and ask the team for their opinions if you reach a major decision point (like the decision points I posted a while back...)

If you want to go with the other game I posted, let me know and I can post the .sav file. I haven't done so yet...

 

[TheOverseer714]

I think he may have just put it with his screeny, rather than as a word.doc. I think we can run through this SG at Regent, and then the next can go higher. I have been reading another SG for newbies, and theres been much talk of dotmaps for city planning. I can't do much good with that, as I don't have access to CAII on this computer. Can someone else, or should we just build according to where the land looks right? I liked the looks of the jungle delta for those dyes, even if thats just a placeholder city, until we get rid of the jungle. How soon should we smack those Aztecs for being too close? Anyway, good luck tonight with your turn Othniel, and Tad when he gets the next turn. Anyone seen Hycrest on? I gotta run, good night, catch you all sometime tomorrow.

 

[Othniel]

Yep, I'll play tonight with this map.

I'll also try my hand at a little dotmapping and post that with my turn log. I'll probably won't be able to post that stuff and the save until early evening PST tomorrow, so hopefully that's ok with ya'll. I'll try to hurry.

Just to set the precedent on good SG formatting:

Consider this post my "got it". FYI That means I have the save and am preparing to play.

Short-term goals:
Prepare Paris as a settler factory and Orleans as a probable worker factory

Continue research on Writing and look to trade for CB and Myst as possible. I'd like to research Polytheism after Writing (or Myst if we can't trade for it yet) and prepare for a monarchy slingshot. There's no way the Regent AI will get Polytheism fast enough, so we'll have to self-research it.

Scout for more contacts

Mid-term goals
Prepare plans for an assault on the Aztecs

Long-term goals
Win game by early domination

Ok, that's it for now. Ready to rock!

 

[Kumquat]

The Aztecs really have no room to expand, they have Ocean to the east and west with Vikings to the south and us sitting on there heads

 

[Othniel]

Here's the summary version of my turnset:
Researched writing and started research on Code of Law for one turn (see end of post for more details.)
Finished granaries in Paris and Orleans and started setup on factories.
Used Paris mp to scout northward

Here is my (shortened ) turnlog:

Spoiler :

Diplomacy Check:
We know Aztecs and Scandinavia
- At par in techs with Vikings
- Up alph on Aztecs. They have 10 gold, but that is certainly not worth alph right now.

Other thoughts:
Both Paris and Orleans are building granaries, which I agree needs to happen at some point. However, we only have one worker. That is bad. It's often more efficient to build more workers first --> earlier terrain improvements --> quicker granary builds overall. We are industrious, but still.

Whoever had Paris using just one of the BGs so the granary comes in 4 turns and the growth in 5, good job. That's exactly right.

I plan on irrigating one of the Orleans cows and mining the other. That way we'll still produce +5fpt and will have more shields for a factory. I think I'm leaning toward running Orleans as a worker factory for a few turns, then switching it over to a settler factory one we get a few more workers...

A little bit of fog-gazing looks like the coast is directly west of us, and there is a sugar and river at the edge. I plan on sending our next settler that way and getting a coastal city to build some curraghs --> contacts.

Pre-turn Moves:
Decide to move warrior in Paris to do some scouting to the east and the north. Temporarily move lux slider to 10&#37; to prevent rioting, move warrior in Orleans north and plan on using it as mp in Paris next turn. We need scouting more then we need to have both MPs.

This temporarily makes writing be finished in 10 rather than 9 turns.

Decide to have Orleans work both cows for faster growth than use the other BGs. Having it grow faster will produce more shields in the long run rather than just emphasize shields from the get go. Have Paris temporarily work both BGs for extra commerce.

NOTE: I switched a few options in the preferences menu. Switch them if you like, but I recommend you leave them as is.

IBT
zzz

Turn 1--> 2510BC:
Worker to irrigate river cow.

Keep science at 100% might recaputure the extra turn and the 1gpt benefit of keeping it at 90% is too marginal.

IBT
zzz

Turn 2 --> 2470BC:
MM Paris to work both BG's and a forest (not the wheat). This won't actually slow city growth and will allow us to get the granary 1 turn earlier.

Vikings have worker for sale that I'd really like to buy, but they will only take 5gpt and 15gp for the worker. No worries, I didn't do the deal. It's amazing how much workers cost in C3C.

IBT
zzz

Turn 3--> 2430BC:
Drat! A barb moves in vicinity of Orleans and our worker, forcing me to move the Paris mp across the river again and the lux slider to go to 10% to keep the peace.

Paris finishes it's granary. Build --> worker. Paris is not ready to function yet as a settler factory because it doesn't have enough pop and the land is not sufficiently developed. I'll probably build--> worker--> warrior--> settler.

Northern warrior reveals a fp wheat north of Paris. Quite nice land, really.

IBT
zzz

Turn 4 --> 2390BC:
Whew! Barb runs away. I still fortify the warrior in Orleans for now.

Drat again!. That barb distracted me and so how I forgot to MicroManage Paris last turn. That's gonna delay city growth by one turn. Sorry guys.

MM Orleans to work one of the BGs. It will grow next turn.

I set the governor to emphasize production. This should have been done from the beginning of the game...

IBT
zzz

Turn 5--> 2350BC:
Southern warrior (renamed Louie XIV) pops a goody hut and we get CB. French are now religious...

Northern warrior (renamed Charlemagne) climbs a moutain and reveals the extensive fp system to the northwest of Paris.

Paris builds a worker, goes north to fp to irrigate and build road toward next city location.

Turn lux slider to 0%. We are making 13bpt with 54 beakers to go on writing. With the city growth next turn for Paris, we should get the extra 2 beakers we need to get writing in 4 turns. (FYI, 54 / 13 equals 4 remainder 2.)

MM both cities for exact growth and production.

IBT
zzz

Turn 6--2310BC:
Check diplomacy screen. (Should have done that last turn, argh.)
Trade Vikings CB for their worker
Trade Aztecs CB for their 10gp
-I figure that the Vikings worker is far more valuable than CB and that we should get what we can from the Aztecs. If they want to build temples, by all means. Makes them easier to conquer if they don't build units.

Raise lux to 10% to keep Paris happy. This is going to be close if we're going to get that turn shaved off writing. Writing due in 4 now.

MM cities. Paris warrior due in 1, Orleans granary due in 4.

Move Viking slave to the plains NW of Paris, due to irrigate their next turn.

IBT
Barb attacks Louis, dies without taking a scratch off old Louie.

Turn 7--> 2270BC:
Louis disperses a barb camp, again without a scratch taken. 25 gold, cha-ching.

With the new warrior in Paris serving as MP, lux to 0%, science to 100%, and voila!, writing due in 2 turns. The turn has been shaved with absolutely 0 beakers lost.

IMPORTANT: Changed build in Paris to settler. I would like to NOT build a settler here yet until the settler factory is set up, but we still don't have the proper terrain improvements finished. We need to get the fp irrigated (and roaded) and two more plains irrigated. The soonest that it can be done is 7 turns and by that time Paris would grow to size 7, not what we want. SO, I'll build a settler now, and the next player needs to MM Paris such that we only build warriors until the factory can be set up. Should be fairly straightforward.

MM Paris and Orleans to get the Orleans granary done in 3, city growth in 4. Paris to build settler in 6, although that will improve with the pop growth in 2 turns.

Turn 8--> 2230BC:
zzz

MM cities.

IBT
See an Aztec warrior-settler pair move SE from their capital. They are moving toward the southern dyes, so they might claim them after all. I may let Charlemagne attack, but probably not...

Turn 9--> 2190BC:
Writing researched. Set research to Myst at max, due in 10 turns. After that, Poly and then Philo. We will not trade Writing until Poly has been researched, at the earliest.

Set lux slider to 10% now that Paris is size 4.

Scratch that on Myst. After considerable debate, I think that we should go for Republic rather than Monarchy. I think any WarWeariness will be manageble because we have 2 lux nearby, this is Regent so the AI is weak-sauce for battles, and both the Aztecs and Vikings look really weak. I think we can overrun them very quickly before we have any WW problems. So, research set to CoL on 90%, due in 23. After that, research Philo, take Republic, and voila!, a slingshot.

Our economy is losing 1gpt, no biggie.

Orleans granary due in 1, city growth in 2.

By working the now irrigated fp, Paris is running at +5fpt and 2 turn growth. Perfect.

IBT
Aztec pair moves right below Louis on the hill. Barb moves nearby too.

Turn 10-->2150BC:
Orleans finishes granary, set build to worker. Not sure on this build; up for debate.

MM Orleans to get max commerce next turn, due to grow next turn also. It can now do +5fpt, and once the cow is mined next turn, it can do 5spt, so perfect worker factory if we want it that way.

Leave all other units untouched, so that Tad can move them as he pleases. The Aztec settler pair is on a plains right below Louis, we can attack them if we so choose.

We only had one worker before my turnset started. That is newbie mistake #1 Unfortunately, we were pretty much locked into our granary builds, so I had to wait until they finished to build more.

Research:
I chose CoL next because I think we should do the Republic slingshot. I think we can overrun the Aztecs and Vikings, and probably all other AI's, in very short wars, preventing war weariness.

We can get the Republic slingshot at least 10 turns ahead of the Monarchy slingshot, so that's a point in its favor. Plus, the commerce in Republic. And we have at least 2 luxes for happiness.

If we do the Republic slingshot, just continue research on CoL and then research Philo after that, choosing Republic as the free tech. DON'T trade writing until after we complete CoL. I don't think the Regent AI could still get to Philo first, but let's not chance it.

If you guys want the Monarchy slingshot, no big deal to switch CoL to Myst (and then Poly--> Philo--> Monarchy) There's only been one turn of CoL research done so far.

IMPORTANT: In any case, let's decide this before the next player plays.

Aztec war:
We should go for them first. It was really too early for my turnset to accomplish this, and probably too early for Tad's as well. We need workers and settlers first.

However, we could use Louis to attack that Aztec pair, possibly preventing the Aztecs from getting another city. That would mean an ultra-early war and would complicate things a lot as we don't have anything but warriors right now.

My vote is no on the war. I want to wait another 20 turns or so, then attack Aztecs and Vikings bang-bang.

 

[Othniel]

The possible early Aztec war:

Also, I tried my hand at dotmapping the surrounding area. That means I selected the locations I thought were the best for our next cities.

I think the RED location should be next. Build curraghs for contacts once we found that spot. Then, I think YELLOW, then GREEN. Let's wait on the TEAL tile for a while. It's too hard to develop quickly and we don't need those dyes yet.

The GREEN dot could probably be moved 1SE for a tighter build pattern (cxxc rather than cxxxc), so that would be cool with me. The TEAL tile could also be moved, but I tend to keep it where it is.

 

[TheOverseer714]

I wanted to build workers, but I also wanted a settler ASAP, so I built a settler, to do a worker factory in the 2nd city. I prefer Republic slingshot, as Monarchy allows protracted wars that bog down. Under Republic, WW will prevent that. It's possible that a short war with Monty would net us the slave workers and prevent growth by them long enough to get more cities built. With maybe 2-3 Jags, are they much of a real threat? I don't typically use governors(from reading the turn log), but that's ok, I just don't like their decisions 90&#37; of the time. I think if we declare on Monty before they have even 1 more city might be a gamble worth taking, depends on terrain, no since declaring and then losing that battle.

 

[Tad Empire_0_o]

ok can I get the save?

I think we should wait about 10 turns & then start the war so we can mass up archers or horsemen or swords, if we have iron, than kill the aztecs and build settlers in paris while teoteuacan can build millatary

 

[TheOverseer714]

1. TheOverseer714-Warming Up
2. Kumquat-Waiting Patiently
3. Othniel- Just Played
4. Tad Empire- Up
5. HyCrest-On Deck

Othniel will post the save soon, but we need Kumquat to help decide on the war question and the government choice. We also to find out whether HyCrest is still with us, and I assume Drakdan is not going to play, so I left him off the list, but there's still time to add a 6th player if we can recruit another.

 

[Othniel]

One more thing: At the possible risk of hammering this point (I"m not worried ), I want to again make sure we're on the same page about the factories.

I attached two edited screenshots of Paris and Orleans, adding some numbers, plus an excel worksheet .

Here's the spreadsheet --> http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/98133/Paris_Settler_factory.zip

Follow the excel worksheet's pattern of tiles worked to get a 4 turn settler factory in Paris. It is CRITICAL that we do not start the factory until Paris has just grown to size 5 and all 6 tiles are fully improved (with irrigation at least). Then, every other turn (when Paris grows in pop), you will have micromanage Paris to work the tiles I outlined in the spreadsheet.

Is this a lot of work? Not really. In fact, if you just follow the spreadsheet, it's really simple and seems almost like magic when it's working properly. Really, it's quite fun to see.

So, I recommend that after Paris finishes its settler, that it build warriors until it grows to size 5 again. On that turn, start using the spreadsheet and keep Paris on its cycle indefinitely.

For Orleans, I recommend keeping it at size three and work the three tiles I makred with numbers in the screenshot. It will produce +5fpt, grow every two turns, and by working the forest on growth, will produce 10 shields every two turns. A perfect worker factory!

Ok, guys, please indulge me and actually read this post. I guarantee that if you read and practice what I just described, your gameplay will improve SIGNIFICANTLY. Please, do, hit me with questions if you have them. Then I know you are really reading this.

 

[Othniel]

Oh yeah, almost did forget to post the save.

Here it is -->
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/98133/SGFN_France_2150_BC.SAV

Thanks for being patient with me.

 

[Tad Empire_0_o]

k I got it I will start playing, but I cant read the spread sheet