Suggestions and Requests

[Wessel V1]

Or maybe rather, let them be limited to Historical territory, so that warriors can move between two cities if they are unconnected by culture.

 

[Imperator Knoedel]

Poor China can't escort its settlers.

Just reduce the hammer cost of scouts to 10 if you want them to be more valuable.

Also what sneaky early raids? Egypt and Babylon are separated by Jerusalem and for China you can and should just spawn more animals in Central Asia.

 

[Tlönitte]

I think removing free barb wins has neutered early attacks anyway, as there is no more opportunity to get lots of city raider promotions.

How about scouts starting with woodsman and hills 1, so they only need one promotion to get faster movement?

 

[Leoreth]

That's also an option.

 

[DC123456789]

Um, no... According to the Penguin History of Canada, written by Professor Robert Bothwell:

Spoiler :

“The Fenians proposed to strike at Great Britain, not in distant Ireland, but in the adjacent British colonies. This definitely alarmed the colonial governments, which had to mobilize troops of their own to counter the Fenian threat.”(pg. 210)

and this led to....

Spoiler :

“The Fenians did invade from time to time, most notably on the New Brunswick frontier in April 1866 and then across the Niagara River in June. The American government didn’t support them, and instead confiscated their arms and cut off their supplies. The Fenian menace eventually subsided, but it had been an expensive lesson for the colonists who had for the first time seriously to pay for their own defence. Money, as always, talked, in this case speaking to the colonists about what it meant, and what it cost, to remain British." (pg 210)

No, I'm not saying that Canada was going to be traded for Ireland, being a likely scenario. But like the countless servile revolts in Ancient Rome, or whatever example you want to use, this was expensive to put down and end the threat, and caused people to think of how to do things differently. But to be perfectly clear, the Fenian raids were not idle threat.

None of that actually insinuates that they actually had any measure of success. As I said earlier, the only thing they actually accomplished was to scare the BNA colonies into uniting.

I never said they did, you decided to make that connection. I'm saying there was general unrest in both Lower and Upper Canada, but for different reasons. The Catholic Quebecois were not given the same freedoms as the Anglo-Protestants.

Such as?

Have it still spawn as a vassal, BUT have it also spawn ONLY if stability is even a little bit shaky. Canada should be a frequent sight, but if the colonies are happy, I don't see why you should force the player to release Canada. There was nothing "inevitable" about releasing Canada in a single Union. Don't let a nationalist narrative of Canada teach you that.

Another quote from Professor Bothwell on how discontent (instability) was the force behind unification (or Canada in our game frame):

Spoiler :

“The driving force behind union was discontent in the western part of the province of Canada, the former Upper Canada, sometimes called Canada West. ” (pg. 211)*

*Later Bothwell talks about the process not being smooth, as Lower and Upper Canada had to deal with population differences and representation... but that is beyond the scope of this game...

You shouldn't be forced to if you're stable. You should be given a chance, but if you say no you shouldn't suffer anything more than maybe a bit of unhappiness. None of what you said precludes that in any way.

 

[merijn_v1]

The dawn of man of England says it's 829 when it spawns. Wouldn't it be more appropriate if England spawns in 830 AD instead of 820 AD?

 

[The Turk]

None of that actually insinuates that they actually had any measure of success. As I said earlier, the only thing they actually accomplished was to scare the BNA colonies into uniting.

I never said they succeeded. I said they were a serious threat. As I just quoted you from a classic scholarly text on Canadian history, defeating the Fenian Raids was a costly procedure. Minor annoyances do not require costly procedures to put down. I equated it to a servile revolt in its threat, but overall inability to cause long term harm (due to unorganization), and I stick to this comparison.

Such as?

Not quite sure what you are asking here. But if you are asking what type of problems French Canadians faced versus Anglo-Canadians, that would be a better PM (private message) question, rather than asking it here. I can help you find the appropriate source.

You shouldn't be forced to if you're stable. You should be given a chance, but if you say no you shouldn't suffer anything more than maybe a bit of unhappiness. None of what you said precludes that in any way.

We seem to be arguing the same thing here. If you are stable, the Canadians should not pop up. But if you are even a bit stable, than they should be released (post-1850 let's say), as a vassal of Britain.

If you have further inquiries about Canadian history, please PM me, I can direct you to some more quotes from Professor Bothwell's Penguin History of Canada.

The dawn of man of England says it's 829 when it spawns. Wouldn't it be more appropriate if England spawns in 830 AD instead of 820 AD?

I'd love to see England spawn in 1066, as you guys did in RFC: Europe. Anglo-Saxon England was largely disconnected from currents on the continent, being outside the "Frankish" sphere of political, cultural and economic homogeneity, until the Norman conquest of 1066. Not to mention it could be interesting for the Vikings to get to settle/raid Scotland/England. If England spawns in 1066 it shouldn't flip Scotland, let the English fight for it. You can even place a Scottish city-state, that the Vikings and English can fight for. My two-cents anyway, as I don't see the point in representing one of the several English Kingdoms that rose and fell before 1066 (even under Alfred the Great).

 

[Leoreth]

The dawn of man of England says it's 829 when it spawns. Wouldn't it be more appropriate if England spawns in 830 AD instead of 820 AD?

Yeah, although I'll probably get flak for taking even more stuff from England

 

[Swarbs]

Should the Indian Edict not give happiness with the presence of Buddhism? Seems odd to have it give +1 with Pantheon when the Indians are the one early civ that will almost never use Pantheon, and the Edicts were heavily associated with Buddhist teachings.

 

[Ani Taneen]

Suggestion:

In 1.15, make the 2nd UU 2nd UB mod part of the main game!
In 1.15, make the Enhanced Culture mod part of the main game!

 

[Imperator Knoedel]

Could we include a random event that can happen if another civ is runing Totalitarianism, positing that this other civ is persecuting a minority of some sort and giving the player several options as to how to deal with that, e.g. ignoring, secretly helping people flee that country, publicly condemn the regime, or if you want to be their friend deport members of the minority that fled to you etc.?

Yeah, although I'll probably get flak for taking even more stuff from England

Actually I couldn't care less about England's whereabouts in the medieval age, as long as they manage to become the dominant world power by the 19th century. As far as I'm concerned you have my blessing to cut off 200 years from their beginning and add it to their end instead.

 

[Leoreth]

Should the Indian Edict not give happiness with the presence of Buddhism? Seems odd to have it give +1 with Pantheon when the Indians are the one early civ that will almost never use Pantheon, and the Edicts were heavily associated with Buddhist teachings.

I'm kind of hesitant to tie UBs to specific religions.

But it's true that Edicts do not make a lot of sense where they are right now, but I hope I can rectify that along with the ongoing tech tree changes (i.e. Edicts will probably not replace Pagan Temples anymore).

Could we include a random event that can happen if another civ is runing Totalitarianism, positing that this other civ is persecuting a minority of some sort and giving the player several options as to how to deal with that, e.g. ignoring, secretly helping people flee that country, publicly condemn the regime, or if you want to be their friend deport members of the minority that fled to you etc.?

That sounds interesting. Maybe there should be a thread to pool event suggestions such as this so I can implement a couple of them in one batch at some point.

Actually I couldn't care less about England's whereabouts in the medieval age, as long as they manage to become the dominant world power by the 19th century. As far as I'm concerned you have my blessing to cut off 200 years from their beginning and add it to their end instead.

Yeah, I know and agreed.

 

[citis]

About France:
I would like to see France represent Caroligian and merovigian dynasties. Moreover, Franch forged a colonial empire in Africa which is unrepresented. So:

Move french starting date back to 450AD, they start as Franks.
Updated french UHV:
*Build a cathedral in Paris by 600AD, have 25000 culture by 1600AD.
*Control 40% of North America, Europe in 1800, and north Africa by 1850AD.
(North Africa includes all of west africa and continuous to Egypt).
*The same as before.


Updated Byzantine UHV:
*The same
*The same
*Control Balkans, (3 cities), Anatolia (3 cities), Levant, Egypt (3 cities in Levant and Egypt combined), Africa (1 city), Italy (1 city) and mediterranean Spain (1 city).

For the scope of this goal, "control" means two things:
1) Control at least as many cities as refered above.
2) No foreignly controlled city in the refered areas.

So if there are three cities in Italy, you have to conquer all three of them. If there is no city in Italy you just have to found one.



Change the date of the second scenario in 325AD (byzantine start).
So you can play Byzantium, Franks, Viking and Japanese from their starting date without having to wait much. In this scenario Roman and Persian inflation rates should be udjusted to make it difficult for them to fully revocer.

 

[DC123456789]

I never said they succeeded. I said they were a serious threat. As I just quoted you from a classic scholarly text on Canadian history, defeating the Fenian Raids was a costly procedure. Minor annoyances do not require costly procedures to put down. I equated it to a servile revolt in its threat, but overall inability to cause long term harm (due to unorganization), and I stick to this comparison.

You said:

But it was preceded by riots, the Finean Raids (Irish rebels who occupied swaths of Western Canada)

which implies a certain degree of success and isn't quite how you're describing it right now.

We seem to be arguing the same thing here. If you are stable, the Canadians should not pop up. But if you are even a bit stable, than they should be released (post-1850 let's say), as a vassal of Britain.

Well, I'm also of the opinion that even a stable Britain should be given the choice to release Canada in 1867 (as a vassal), but should be able to say no with little to no repercussions.

 

[citis]

Parthenon is the norm for ancient mediterranean civs, so modern names for republic don't fit.
I propose "greek confederation" or "greek sympoliteia" if Greece runs republic or autocracy in classical era.
And the generic "X confederation" for any civ that runs autocracy or republic in classical era.


Moreover feudal republic (republic+feudalism) should be distinguished from modern republics. I find it somewhat annoying to play as "Republic of China" before 1700AD. Maybe adopt the generic "Commonwealth of X" like Commonwealth of England and Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth that are common. Or maybe "Republic of X" where X is the capital, after the example of "Republic of Novgorod" and "Republic of Venice", if it is in renaiscance or earlier era.

 

[The Turk]

which implies a certain degree of success and isn't quite how you're describing it right now.

No, its exactly how I'm describing it. I said, they occupied land. Occupying land means
restricting the sovereignty of the previous sovereign in a piece of territory for a duration of time. You might have read more into it than I implied, but I can't do anything about that. I was very clear in my second post, about how the local authorities thought of the issue.

How you define "success" is another issue, did they succeed initially in occupying territory sovereign to the British government (and constituents)? Yes. Did they get Ireland in exchange for Canada? No. But to be clear, I never used the word "success".

Well, I'm also of the opinion that even a stable Britain should be given the choice to release Canada in 1867 (as a vassal), but should be able to say no with little to no repercussions.

This sounds overly-complex to implement. We don't have other events akin to this, and the macro-level of gameplay of RFC never seemed to fit this type of gameplay (see Victoria 2 if you are interested). I however am not the modmod creator, but I do think a better way of doing it would be to just have the British keep Canada if stable, or lose Canada (make it a vassal) if the British are even a little bit unstable come the 1850s. Either way is fine, just depends of Leoreth is willing to do the coding work.

 

[The Turk]

About France:
I would like to see France represent Caroligian and merovigian dynasties. Moreover, Franch forged a colonial empire in Africa which is unrepresented. So:

Move french starting date back to 450AD, they start as Franks.
Updated french UHV:
*Build a cathedral in Paris by 600AD, have 25000 culture by 1600AD.
*Control 40% of North America, Europe in 1800, and north Africa by 1850AD.
(North Africa includes all of west africa and continuous to Egypt).
*The same as before.

Why not have a Frankish Civilization, as a precursor to the "French". The Franks could have separate UHVs, UBs and UU, akin to how we recycle the Persia -> Iran civilization.

The UHV goals of the Franks would be to create the Carolingian Empire, expand Latin (Roman) Christianity, and (perhaps) keep out Barbarians (Vikings, Magyars, Avars, Muslims etc). The civilization would end with the Germans, Spanish and French spawning. Makes no sense for the Spanish, Germans, French to spawn on the ashes of the Roman Empire, when in reality they were all previously influenced by Carolingians.

The Franks would begin in 481 (reign of Clovis - or we can start earlier).

Doesn't have to be specifically like this, but considering that the Franks laid out the complete civilizational outwork for a good 1000 years (till 1789) and beyond for Europe, seems like they should be shown in some way.

 

[DC123456789]

No, its exactly how I'm describing it. I said, they occupied land. Occupying land means
restricting the sovereignty of the previous sovereign in a piece of territory for a duration of time. You might have read more into it than I implied, but I can't do anything about that. I was very clear in my second post, about how the local authorities thought of the issue.

How you define "success" is another issue, did they succeed initially in occupying territory sovereign to the British government (and constituents)? Yes. Did they get Ireland in exchange for Canada? No. But to be clear, I never used the word "success".

You said they occupied swathes of Western Canada (by which I presume you mean Canada West, as otherwise it makes even less sense). When you occupy land in a war, that normally means "take control of", which did not ever happen. At best they marched into Niagara, got defeated after a couple battles and returned home. Unless you mean "occupy" as in "get the attention of"? That would be a very unorthodox use of the word though, although that meaning of the word would actually make sense.

This sounds overly-complex to implement. We don't have other events akin to this, and the macro-level of gameplay of RFC never seemed to fit this type of gameplay (see Victoria 2 if you are interested). I however am not the modmod creator, but I do think a better way of doing it would be to just have the British keep Canada if stable, or lose Canada (make it a vassal) if the British are even a little bit unstable come the 1850s. Either way is fine, just depends of Leoreth is willing to do the coding work.

I'm not sure how this is complicated in any way given that all you have to do is a simple check for stability (which would be done anyway based on the generally agreed-upon method of spawning) and a pop up if you're stable, which then spawns the civ if you choose the correct option.

 

[merijn_v1]

Why not have a Frankish Civilization, as a precursor to the "French". The Franks could have separate UHVs, UBs and UU, akin to how we recycle the Persia -> Iran civilization.

The UHV goals of the Franks would be to create the Carolingian Empire, expand Latin (Roman) Christianity, and (perhaps) keep out Barbarians (Vikings, Magyars, Avars, Muslims etc). The civilization would end with the Germans, Spanish and French spawning. Makes no sense for the Spanish, Germans, French to spawn on the ashes of the Roman Empire, when in reality they were all previously influenced by Carolingians.

The Franks would begin in 481 (reign of Clovis - or we can start earlier).

Doesn't have to be specifically like this, but considering that the Franks laid out the complete civilizational outwork for a good 1000 years (till 1789) and beyond for Europe, seems like they should be shown in some way.

IMO, this isn't a very good idea. The Franks would only have 27 turns to live, if you let them spawn in 481 AD and end in 750 AD. That can't be a fun game. Even if you spawn earlier, you won't have much more turns.

Also, it would be a game without neighbours (except the Vikings), as they didn't spawn yet. Not very good for a fun game either.

Persia -> Iran works because the is a huge time gap between them.

 

[Force44]

HRE contiues as Austria after Prussian spawn.

Similarly the Merovingingians could continue as the short lived middle part of the Carolingian empire (Ruled by Lothair after the treaty of Verdun in 843). It wasn't around very long in history but maybe you (the player) can do better?

It could turn out to be a very fun modmod and with the ease of incorporating modmodmods into the main modmod with gith... ...who knows...

...Untill that day Rhyes and Fall of Europe is also a pretty fun modmod.