Sw4 - Waterworld C3c1.22

Forget the Wonders, the only one we really want is Smith's. Keep pumping up the economy with markets and such.

Send Lizzie to her island, we don't need her around then do the same to Abe.

War Weariness will remain manageable unless we start losing battles, so don't.
 
Pre-turn - …why is that slave clearing a jungle right next to a barb camp…with 2 barbs in it?!? Send the settler in Delft north. Move the horses and cats towards Nottingham. Send 2 archers towards Liverpool. Think about what Bede said. Do we really need Leo’s? Not really. Although it would come in handy for when we want to upgrade all these horses…I’ll finish the market and a library in Rotterdam then start Leo’s.
Turn science down to 20%, since we were losing 11 gpt, and we only have 50. Now Invention is due in 14 turns (instead of 11), and we make 11 gpt. We are up to 40% lux? Wow. That’s another reason to take Lizzie out now. We need her incense.

IBT – Lizzie asks for peace. Uhh…no. The resistance in Warwick ends. An English MDI appears from the west.

260 (1) – Utrecht horse->horse. Bedehoven horse->market. Eindhoven horse->library. Arnhem barracks->horse. Coventry worker->worker.

Aztecs now have Invention. Forget if they did before, but I don’t think so. Coventry has a 1.342% chance of flipping, requiring 19 units. Warwick has a 5.026% chance, requiring 51! The settler from Delft is still 7 turns away. I could rush a settler in Den Helder for 68 gold, but we only have 61…decide to attack Nottingham this turn to hopefully get that extra 7 gold.
First horse attacks and wins flawlessly…capturing Nottingham…that was quick. We don’t plunder any gold, though.
I abandon Warwick. I’ll rush a settler next turn.

IBT – England drops off an archer by Chicago.

270 (2) – Maastricht horse->market. Nottingham has an 8.367% chance of flipping…it requires 50 units. The S.S. Minnow has survived and returned to safe waters off the coast of Harlingen. To celebrate, Igor and Maryann have their wedding (note, I’ve never seen Gilligan’s Island, so I have no idea what I’m talking about…). Gilligan spots a barb camp a few miles due east.
Rush a settler in Den Helder for 64 gold, 4 gold left. An AC kills the reg MDI and promotes to Elite. But another MDI is spotted right next to him. Attack him with a vet AC, but die doing just 1 damage. Lizzy’s Soul kills it, but is redlined.
England now has Pikes.
That English archer by Chicago will most likely take Chicago next turn. We have plenty of units to take it back. Chicago has no improvements, anyway, so it won’t be a big loss.

IBT – As expected, Chicago is captured, and the archer took 1 damage. Washington riots. I had started this turn earlier today, so I forgot about it…oops.
Inca are building Sun Tzu’s.

280 (3) – New Amsterdam worker->worker. Rotterdam market->library. Den Helder settler->worker. Den Rower worker->worker.
WW is starting to catch up on us. 20-25%. Next turn I should capture York, though, and we’ll have some incense. The S.S. Minnow finds a Burgundian galley…let’s hope this ship is as lucky in combat as it is in sailing. Recapture Chicago. Capture Liverpool, but lose an archer and a horse…
Load 2 horses into a galley that will attack Norwich. Kill the barb camp between Coventry and Den Helder and get a much needed 25 gold.

IBT – One of our archers is redlined by an English horse, and redlines (but promotes) and Archer before finally dying. The S.S. Minnow takes one damage from the barb galley.

290 (4) – Leiden court->market. The Inca have Monotheism now, too. They will take a straight Eng for Mono. It appears we broke a deal with the Aztecs, too, since he won’t accept a RoP. I’ll wait for now, since everyone else has Monotheism except for America, who doesn’t have anything to offer for Mono.
Found Leerdam where Warwick used to be ->worker.
None of our cats hit York. :( First horse redlines and promotes. 2nd dies doing 0 damage. 3rd dies doing 2 damage, but promoting the spear. This is the last spear, though. Next horse is redlined, but captures York! We now have incense.
Horse by Hastings takes 2 damage killing an archer. Unload both horses next to Norwich. It looks like there’s only one spear here (it’s unfortified), but there are a couple of barb horses to the north.
With the incense, Lux can be dropped to 30%, and Science can be raised to 30%, +20gpt, due in 9, or 40%, -1gpt, due in 8. I choose 30%. Monty is offering Wines for Dyes, Incense, and 8 gold. I’ll wait until I know the incense is secure.

IBT – Our palace gets a second floor.

300 (5) – Amsterdam market->library. Utrecht horse->library. Haarlem settler->settler.
Eep. Norwich is destroyed, redlining both horses, but one promotes. Move units towards Hastings, which can be attacked next turn. Rush a warrior in Seattle for 12 gold, since a barb is coming for it.

IBT – Inca offer Mono for Eng. Not on your turn, Pachacuti! The resistance in Coventry finally ends! I have no idea where those 4 American units are going, but it looks like they’re heading towards London…maybe to pillage the incense?

310 (6) – Seattle warrior->barracks.
3 of the 4 cats hit at Hastings! We redline the pike, and do 1 damage to a spear. An archer fires and misses our horse which is redlined killing the spear. 2nd horse takes 2 damage killing the pike. Just the archer left. He is killed doing 1 damage to our horse. We take Hastings and, like always, every citizen resists. The Minnow is redlined killing a barb galley. Advance units towards London, and see an American galley. Now I’m sure they are going to attack England.
Raise science to 40%, +8gpt, Invention due in 5. I decide to make the trade with Pachacuti. Eng for Mono. We are down Chivalry and Invention on Maya and Aztecs (but we’ll be getting Invention in 5 turns).

IBT – One resistor is quelled in Hastings. The resistance in Liverpool ends.

320 (7) – Rotterdam library->Sun Tzu’s. If we don’t want any wonders at all, this can be switched to something else. Arnhem horse->market. Dordecht woker->worker.
Raise lux back to 40% since WW is now at anywhere from 33-50%. But also decrease Science to 30% with same number of turns. Load and drop off Lizzy’s Soul and a horse next to Dover. The spear there is down to 2/4 health because of barbs.
Decide to attack London without catapult support. First horse wins taking 1 damage. Elite takes 3 damage. Vet dies redlining a spear. The exact same thing happens again, but promoting the spear. 2 spears left, 2 horses left. Horse takes 2 damage. And last horse is unhurt, capturing London and the Great Lighthouse…and 2 gold. We also get the Pyramids, and the Colossus.
I’ll take Dover next turn, then make peace and get Canterbury and Newcastle.

IBT – Maya are building Knight’s Templar.

330 (8) – New Amsterdam worker->worker. Lauwersoog treb->swiss merc.
Abandon York and found Hilversum in its place ->market. Destroy a barb camp in the south by Harlingen. After redlining the horse and bringing Lizzy’s Soul down to 2/5, Dover becomes Dutch. 5 barb horses (one redlined) and a warrior are found to the west on the mountains…
Make peace with England for Canterbury, Brighton, and a worker. The Americans were blocking our path to Canterbury anyway. Switch Tilburg from Granary to Settler, wasting 6 shields. Can now bring lux down to 20% and science to 50%, +7gpt, Invention due in 2.

IBT – All the barb horses head towards undefended Brighton. The resistances in Dover and Hastings end.

340 (9) – Eindhoven library->swiss merc. Delft settler->settler. Tilburg settler->worker. Nottingham now has the highest chance of a flip at just 3.553%. OK…a barb camp just popped up in a place with no fog…I didn’t think that was possible. Oh well! Destroy the camp and take 25 gold. Invention due next turn.

IBT – Monty demands Ivory. I tell him to get lost. He declares. And drops off 2 Horses next to Seattle…wish I had seen galley…*note* I replayed this turn just to see what he would’ve done if we gave in, and Monty dropped off the horses anyway. So there was no getting around this war.
Invention->Gunpowder.

350 (10) - Amsterdam library->MDI. Soulwerd settler->woker.
Abandon Nottingham and found Roosendal ->worker.

Are you sure you didn't do 10 turns, AK? I ended on an even turn (150), so either you did 10, or I forgot to record a turn...

Well, I guess now we’ll have to deal with Monty. We’ll have to watch out for our island cities, like Seattle (obviously), and he has some cities on the island with Brighton and Dover.
Soon I think we should declare on Abe, have him attack a swiss merc, triggering our GA, then finish him off and go into a peaceful growth period. Unless we’d rather conquer the world. ;)
There’s a settler in Soulwerd I haven’t moved yet. We can either send him north, or send him to an island. Rotterdam has 27 turns to go on Leo’s, so we can either switch that to something else, or leave it.

Dutch_350.JPG
 
Can we get to the island to finish Liz off?
 
If she could get there, then so can we... she didn't have the Lighthouse, did she?
 
----eldar
----tubby rower
----Bede -
----soul_warrior
----Admiral Kutzov
----IroquoisPlisken - just played
----DBear - Up now
----whomp - on deck

very nice turns, IroP, very nice indeed.

regarding the leo's prebuild - i agree we dont really need it, but it would be handy. since i dont recall us having a victorious army, and presuming a run for MT, we have to decide if we want to try for Mil Academy? if not maybe keep building other groovy stuff, and going for smith's later on? or maybe Sistine with the leo prebuild?
 
If we want to finish this quick, forget Wonders at all and build Knights and go kick butt!
 
eldar said:
If she could get there, then so can we... she didn't have the Lighthouse, did she?
Not anymore it was in London. :D Nice turns IroquoisPlisken.
 
DBear said:
Can we get to the island to finish Liz off?

Well, I think she only has Oxford and Newcastle left. Oxford is in the screenshot, and Newcastle is to the north, on a mountainous island with Mayan cities. We can get there, too.
I suppose I could have continued the war and finished her off for good, but that would have meant several more turns of WW (we had no boats around to get to Newcastle with). However, since the Aztecs declared on us, that might have helped with WW.

Whomp said:
Not anymore it was in London.

Yep, there's 3 wonders in London. I forgot to sell our extra granaries from the Pyramids, so the next person can do that. I was waiting to make sure London didn't flip back or was captured again, but I think it's safe now.
 
I have an idea. I think the time has come for Smoke and Pach. to make war on Monte and keep Monte busy for 20 turns. I don't see us having a viable force to attack Monte within 40 turns (20 of war/alliance and 20 of peace)
 
Hmm...that would also help us catch up to the Aztecs and Maya in tech. We may become the tech leaders after this.

While Monty's busy with the other two, we can take his city on the island with the English, and retake Seattle (that will not survive 2 horses). Then we can still finish off Abe, triggering our GA in the process, and by the time that's all over, we can start on our world Conquest.
 
OK, got the save. Should be done no later than tomorrow night.
 
Admiral Kutzov said:
I have an idea. I think the time has come for Smoke and Pach. to make war on Monte and keep Monte busy for 20 turns. I don't see us having a viable force to attack Monte within 40 turns (20 of war/alliance and 20 of peace)
just wondering what will the pricetag be?
i have a confession - not to good at brokering wars.
looking for some tutoring here :D
i think i have some of Igor's lesser relatives as ancestors :lol:
 
IroquoisPlisken said:
However, since the Aztecs declared on us, that might have helped with WW.
WW is per Civ so it doesn't carry over to Monte.
If we fought the English right now it would be an issue again. After 20 it goes away vs. Lizzie.

soul_warrior said:
just wondering what will the pricetag be?
i have a confession - not to good at brokering wars.
looking for some tutoring here :D
i think i have some of Igor's lesser relatives as ancestors :lol:

The cost/benefit in the case of Smoke (he's blue right?) vs. Monte is big. They pound on each other on the same island rather than Monte sending out boats to us, the tech pace slows and we can build whatever our heart desires. The bigger risk I see is if Smoke beats him to a pulp then we'd have some pretty stiff competition from Smoke. I'm not sure we'd need to get Pach (pinky, right?) in the mix.
 
For future reference :D :

Monty (Montezuma) = Aztecs (brown)
Smoke (Smoke Jaguar) = Maya (blue)
Pacha (Pachacuti) = Inca (pink)
 
Who's green then?
 
I haven't looked at the save, but I think we could buy in the Mezo-americans fairly cheap (thinking gpt and dead end techs). An idiot's guide to war brokering follows. Bede will fix all the errors.

1. Monte declared on us = war happiness as long as igor and his relatives don't take control (see Bede's 3 rules for war as a republic). Mount no offensives against Monte's homeland.
2. Make sure we have embassies with the prospective allies.
3. Dial all sliders to zero.
4. Approach allies. Ask what they want for alliance and offer gpt and/or lux only for alliance. use dead end techs as needed. the gpt and lux keep them from baling early.
5. REadjust the sliders to were they make sense. Plan on runnng deficiet spending.

Abe is a more viable target for our next war.
 
Hmm. Lots of meso-Americans around. Game was started with culturally-linked starts on wasn't it....
 
Crappy set o' turns

0) 350: WHY did we make peace with Lizzie? We had her on the ropes, why stop? Now London and Hastings are in extreme flip danger. Build an embassy to Smoke-Jag. I contact him for alliance. He wants all our gold and 2/turn. I bargain him down to 140. I bribe the Incas in with Invention. I decide to wipe Abe out once and for all, take slaves n of Philly.

1) 360: England allies w/Aztecs. Mayans land a couple units. Hague market-->mace. Bedehoven market-->mace. Coventry worker-->lib. Eischeid harbor-->mace. Tell Maya to scram, they declare. Kill the javs. Galley w/Gilligan picks up settler. Move workers to drain swamp near Mosquitoville.

2) 370: Barb galley sinks the Minnow, and Lizzie's Soul is killed by barb horses. The RNG hates me. Amsterdam galley-->Sun Tzu. Eindhoven merc-->mace. Get leader killing spear near Roosendaal. We take Philly, plan to attack San Fran.

3) 380: Another settler and horse killed by barbs. WTH is with the RNG? New Amsterdam worker-->mace. Den Helder worker-->rax. Den Rower worker-->rax. Form army. Attack archer outside Washington--get another leader! That makes up for the loss of settlers. Massive dogpile of workers drains swamp 3ne of Mosquitoville.

4) 390: Aztecs land outside Brighton. Utrecht lib-->mace. Tilburg worker-->galley. Leerdam worker-->court. Groningen founded, starts rax. Enschede rushes galley.

5) 400: Aztecs take Brighton. The Hague mace-->mace. Bedehoven mace-->Swiss. Maastricht market-->lib. Haarlem settler-->swiss. Enschede galley-->galley. Rush spear in Dover.

6) 410: Eindhoven mace-->settler. Dover spear-->longbow. Trade England engineer + 3 lux for Chiv. She wanted horses, but I wasn't about to give her that. OK, a little longer to finish Liz. BTW, she founded Leeds nw of Oxford.

7) 420: Dordrecht worker-->lib. Holwerd built. Barb warrior pops up near Hilversun, horse takes him out. Seattle recaptured.

8) 430: Learn guns, start chem. Bedehoven swiss-->knight. Soulwerd worker-->court. Lost a leet archer to a regular spear assaulting San Fran. Gawd I hate this RNG. And it gets worse. There is NO saltpeter on the whole damn continent! The nearest one is by Vilcas, just inside Incan lands.

9) 440: Washington settler-->knight. Utrecht mace-->treb. Eindhoven setter-->knight.

10) 450: Roosendahl worker-->market. Leiden market-->lib.

Successor: Wipe Abe off the planet and rename San Francisco. Anything you want. :mad: No screenie necessary.
 
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