The End of the Euro

[jackelgull]

Yes, I too welcome a higher USD to incentivize getting rid of more workers in favour of robots and Chinese people.

So you want to hurt the US worker? That's pretty much what I'm getting, not sure if that is what you mean though.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

So you want to hurt the US worker? That's pretty much what I'm getting, not sure if that is what you mean though.

Zelig, Jackelgull. Jackelgull, Zelig. Glad you two finally met.

 

[CavLancer]

...and in my thread about the end of the euro too, that's glory.

 

[Takhisis]

Are you sure?

Well, yes, seeing as I was speaking about Tokugawa Japan.

 

[FriendlyFire]

It is all unsecured debt. Greece could effectively just say "we aren't gonna pay" and that would be that. There is a question of survival if sanctions (basically economic warfare) were imposed though.

Yes there are no repercussions for defaulting or unilaterally deciding that debts reduction of 100%. Like the last time Greece defaulted and the UK, Britain France set up an economic blockaid.

The Greeks had actually planned to size control of the Banks and 22 Billion in Euro Capital as part of there plan B as well as seizing all German assets inside Greece. I think this is an excellent way of Defaulting.
And immediately being sanctioned by the entire EZ, EU and US. Germany would be happy to get rid of Greece.

 

[Zelig]

So you want to hurt the US worker? That's pretty much what I'm getting, not sure if that is what you mean though.

I want to help the US worker by getting rid of menial job availability.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Yes there are no repercussions for defaulting or unilaterally deciding that debts reduction of 100%. Like the last time Greece defaulted and the UK, Britain France set up an economic blockaid.

The Greeks had actually planned to size control of the Banks and 22 Billion in Euro Capital as part of there plan B as well as seizing all German assets inside Greece. I think this is an excellent way of Defaulting.
And immediately being sanctioned by the entire EZ, EU and US. Germany would be happy to get rid of Greece.

Seems like a pretty stiff price for getting rid of them. Especially if they manage to not get sanctioned by quite all of the world. Russia would be a good trade partner. So would China. And I'm not totally sure the US would jump on that bandwagon.

 

[jackelgull]

I want to help the US worker by getting rid of menial job availability.

The way I see it, getting rid of menial job availability hurts the worker. I mean it is inevitable, but speeding it up will cause more people to fall behind the curve.

 

[FriendlyFire]

Seems like a pretty stiff price for getting rid of them. Especially if they manage to not get sanctioned by quite all of the world. Russia would be a good trade partner. So would China. And I'm not totally sure the US would jump on that bandwagon.

Germany would be happy. The German Goethe Institute which is to help Greek learn to speak Germany and prepare them for working inside Germany. German schools private schools which serve Greek students because the Greek education system is a shambles one of the worst rated in Europe. This is the most well thought out and productive winning move by the Greek government.

Greece wont be sanctioned, after all many countries have seized control of other countries banks and seized tens billions of dollars, this happens ALL the time.

Dont worry the Greeks are well know for planned out, calculated, well prepared and thought through such actions. Greece definitely will not find itself on the verge of an economic collapse. But rather Greece will have a "Wirtschaftswunder".

....

Hopefully Greece Plan B is shelved and someone who isn't insane can draw up a new Plan B.

 

[Hygro]

The way I see it, getting rid of menial job availability hurts the worker. I mean it is inevitable, but speeding it up will cause more people to fall behind the curve.

True as it stands, but the surplus capital created by the automating can be monetized and distributed however we the citizens of our republic see fit. We could all be richer for it if we want. We could even use it as a basis for financing more jobs in more pleasant, less necessary areas if we want to still be working.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

True as it stands, but the surplus capital created by the automating can be monetized and distributed however we the citizens of our republic see fit. We could all be richer for it if we want. We could even use it as a basis for financing more jobs in more pleasant, less necessary areas if we want to still be working.

Enter political reality. The additional wealth will be distributed such that the newly chronically unemployed will join the already chronically unemployed in being begrudged the barest minimums of survival while the bulk goes into automating the car elevators in the ninth summer home of the 1% and other critical infrastructure improvements.

 

[Zelig]

Enter political reality. The additional wealth will be distributed such that the newly chronically unemployed will join the already chronically unemployed in being begrudged the barest minimums of survival while the bulk goes into automating the car elevators in the ninth summer home of the 1% and other critical infrastructure improvements.

Once enough people are chronically unemployed they'll be motivated to forcibly redistribute the wealth.

 

[Hygro]

Enter political reality. The additional wealth will be distributed such that the newly chronically unemployed will join the already chronically unemployed in being begrudged the barest minimums of survival while the bulk goes into automating the car elevators in the ninth summer home of the 1% and other critical infrastructure improvements.

Yep. Now's a good time to get capital while capital is still get-able.

Once enough people are chronically unemployed they'll be motivated to forcibly redistribute the wealth.

Maybe, but the current system is very clever. What used to be a quirk that wouldn't interfere with work is now a mental health disorder that gets you disability. The labels, the diagnoses, the progressive move toward including everyone by giving them an identity that explains their lack of success will maintain a huge growing welfare state that does the minimum it needs to keep the people happy. Cue dropping electronics prices and the constant advances in entertainment (foremost: porn) and the revolution will be procrastinated. "I'll protest tomorrow".

The system is bifurcating motivation. Those who can hack it are hacking it better than ever. But anyone else not hacking it is being pushed into docile submission at a very low cost.

Meanwhile the police are, even with the backlash, still highly militarized and identify with preservation of the way of things.

 

[GoodSarmatian]

What would you say this depends on? Spain, Italy? The downside of a collective currency is it doesn't depend so much on Germany any more. I wonder, knowing what they know now, if Germans would prefer to not have joined the euro?

The Euro has lost a lot of value this year, but I think that's mostly insecurity about Greece. The problems in Italy and Spain weren't as prominent and I think if they had a negative impact it was mostly offset by Germany's perceived trustworthyness.
There are plenty of (uninformed) Germans that want to get rid of the Euro. They've been there since day one and the Euro is blamed for price hikes, but if you actually look at inflation rates over the past 40 years, the Euro is about as stable as the D-Mark and 2015 is an outlier.

 

[Takhisis]

Germany would be happy. The German Goethe Institute which is to help Greek learn to speak Germany and prepare them for working inside Germany. German schools private schools which serve Greek students because the Greek education system is a shambles one of the worst rated in Europe. This is the most well thought out and productive winning move by the Greek government.

Greece wont be sanctioned, after all many countries have seized control of other countries banks and seized tens billions of dollars, this happens ALL the time.

Dont worry the Greeks are well know for planned out, calculated, well prepared and thought through such actions. Greece definitely will not find itself on the verge of an economic collapse. But rather Greece will have a "Wirtschaftswunder".

....

Hopefully Greece Plan B is shelved and someone who isn't insane can draw up a new Plan B.

Well, the best plan was not to make Greece join the eurozone and not to give them money everyone knew -or should have known, or shouldn't have hidden that they knew- they'd never be able to repay.

Once enough people are chronically unemployed they'll be motivated to forcibly redistribute the wealth.

So, under this plan, everyone (or, at least, a majority/plurality of people) is impoverished in order to nudge them into a revolution?

 

[Verbose]

Well, the best plan was not to make Greece join the eurozone and not to give them money everyone knew -or should have known, or shouldn't have hidden that they knew- they'd never be able to repay.

No one made Greece join. Rather the opposite. The Greek government was jumping down eveyone's throat to get in at the time.

 

[Nares]

I want to help the US worker by getting rid of menial job availability.

Then what sorts of jobs will be available to the students churned out by the fail-factories we call the American education system.

Think of all the kids leaving college with student loan debt and a dubious degree.

Actually, think of all the inner city kids stuck in genuinely failing schools, many (most) of whom graduate high school lacking the skills needed to enter college, and who then spend multiple semesters taking remedial courses just to bring them up to par.

 

[CavLancer]

The Euro has lost a lot of value this year, but I think that's mostly insecurity about Greece. The problems in Italy and Spain weren't as prominent and I think if they had a negative impact it was mostly offset by Germany's perceived trustworthyness.
There are plenty of (uninformed) Germans that want to get rid of the Euro. They've been there since day one and the Euro is blamed for price hikes, but if you actually look at inflation rates over the past 40 years, the Euro is about as stable as the D-Mark and 2015 is an outlier.

May it profit Germany. Would you say the German government's actions are those of a country which wants to keep the euro? Or perhaps the actions of a government which wants to take the medicine of tossing Greece now rather than when things are worse later? Why are they doing what they're doing?

 

[jackelgull]

Then what sorts of jobs will be available to the students churned out by the fail-factories we call the American education system.

Think of all the kids leaving college with student loan debt and a dubious degree.

Actually, think of all the inner city kids stuck in genuinely failing schools, many (most) of whom graduate high school lacking the skills needed to enter college, and who then spend multiple semesters taking remedial courses just to bring them up to par.

I think Zelig would consider them regrettable but necessary casualties.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

The Euro has lost a lot of value this year, but I think that's mostly insecurity about Greece. The problems in Italy and Spain weren't as prominent and I think if they had a negative impact it was mostly offset by Germany's perceived trustworthyness.
There are plenty of (uninformed) Germans that want to get rid of the Euro. They've been there since day one and the Euro is blamed for price hikes, but if you actually look at inflation rates over the past 40 years, the Euro is about as stable as the D-Mark and 2015 is an outlier.

The problems in Italy and Spain were offset by the bringing in of Greece which promised a new even lower tier of the pyramid was going to form. Once Greece blows out and Spain and Italy recognize that they really are signed on as 'bottom tier forever' I would expect those problems to resurface.