The Force should go back to sleep permanently

Bkeela

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I made a vow to avoid The Force Awakens. I thought the Dark Side was defeated perfectly well in the original trilogy, so to continue the story as if Luke's triumph and Vader's redemption meant nothing seemed to me contemptible. In a land where someone like Donald Trump could be considered a serious presidential candidate, I wasn't surprised the public lapped this excrement up, but I for one wanted nothing to do with it.

But yesterday Diablo III Season 7 ended, and I found myself high and dry with Civilization VI still seven painful days away. In desperation I bought Endless Space 2 (early access), and although it looked good and held great promise, the learning curve was too steep for the immediate gratification I needed. In a matter of moments my resolve to avoid The Force Awakens crumbled, and I succumbed to the Dark Side of the Force.

I'd heard the film was a shameless rip off of the first installment, and since I actually hated J. J. Abrams for stringing me through the first season of Lost, I should have been prepared for awfulness. Moreover I've felt for a long time that Hollywood/American blockbuster style films were unwatchable. James Cameron and Christopher Nolan could still make something that looked stylish, but uninspired writing let even their films down. I should have been prepared for awfulness.

There were glaring problems with the story: like Rey's absurdly instant Force skills, and yet another fatally flawed super weapon, but it was the many little things that bugged me the most. For example, Finn staggers into the junkyard settlement desperate for water. He soon finds water but there is a giant creature watering itself there. Any sensible person, let alone an anxious one, would approach such a beast with caution. At the least you would place yourself at the furthest possible distance from the creature. Not Finn. He is written to crouch right next to the bulky snout of the monster to drink, just so he can get butted out of the way for a few cheap laughs. I can just imagine average American, chomping on his/her popcorn and as obese as the beast depicted in the film, laughing with delight at Finn's comedy of error.

The only positives I got from the film were the shots of Star Destroyers and the Falcon leaving the atmosphere of Jakku, seeing Han and Chewie again, and Daisy Ridley. The thing that hurts the most, like with the prequels, is it could so easily have been great. Rather than the Empire and the Dark Side seeming to instantly bounce back from what should have been a fatal blow, it could have been about Luke building up the Jedi academy. The first film at least should have been all about Han and Chewie, since Harrison Ford seemed so keen to retire the character. Any new characters should have been bit parts - not the other way around.

If wishes were horses, beggars would ride.
 
I'm not an obese American, can I laugh at Finn being pushed over by the beast too?
 
I'm not an obese American, can I laugh at Finn being pushed over by the beast too?
The defining factor is being American, not obesity. I'm sure there are some very sensible obese people who hated Jar Jar, and spat their popcorn everywhere when they saw him resurrected in Finn.
 
The defining factor is being American, not obesity. I'm sure there are some very sensible obese people who hated Jar Jar, and spat their popcorn everywhere when they saw him resurrected in Finn.

No sensible Americans though, right?
 
I don't think the Force is the problem, so much as it is lousy screenplay writers.
 
Call this the incoherant ramblings of an idiot overweight American if you wish but your characterization of Finn is mistaken.

Calling out Finn for not acting sensible then is ridiculous. He just did something heroically stupid. He saved Poe because in his soul he knew The First Order was wrong. He wanted out and worries about his safety were a distant afterthought. He just threw away his entire life and crash landed on an alien planet with little understanding of what was going on. In that scene he was completely unhinged (and completely dehydrated - we all saw how sweaty he was). He instantly knew what the danger was but in a split second disregarded it. We don't laugh at Finn we laugh because we get it, we get how we can end up in our most chaotic moments doing what we retrospectively understand to be somewhat ridiculous.

And that shows what kind of man Finn is. The kind of man who when pushed to his absolute limit will act with courage to do the right thing, even if it's completely nuts. That's what won Finn over for me and that's what makes me very eager to see what sort of man he will become as he learns to orient himself into his new life. It also gets at one of the most important emotional messages of Star Wars which is to honor and listen to your conscience even when it will lead you somewhere you cannot anticipate.
 
Space muppets with visible sewing lines playing smooth jazz mustn't be defiled!
 
Call this the incoherant ramblings of an idiot overweight American if you wish but your characterization of Finn is mistaken.

Calling out Finn for not acting sensible then is ridiculous. He just did something heroically stupid. He saved Poe because in his soul he knew The First Order was wrong. He wanted out and worries about his safety were a distant afterthought. He just threw away his entire life and crash landed on an alien planet with little understanding of what was going on. In that scene he was completely unhinged (and completely dehydrated - we all saw how sweaty he was). He instantly knew what the danger was but in a split second disregarded it. We don't laugh at Finn we laugh because we get it, we get how we can end up in our most chaotic moments doing what we retrospectively understand to be somewhat ridiculous.

And that shows what kind of man Finn is. The kind of man who when pushed to his absolute limit will act with courage to do the right thing, even if it's completely nuts. That's what won Finn over for me and that's what makes me very eager to see what sort of man he will become as he learns to orient himself into his new life. It also gets at one of the most important emotional messages of Star Wars which is to honor and listen to your conscience even when it will lead you somewhere you cannot anticipate.

I admire your ability to project your own sensibilities into the film, but even if there is more to Finn than meets the eye, there's still the fact the film followed the same formula two previous films have tread. I anticipate that episode 8 shall now be forced to tread the territory of Empire Strikes Back, though with Luke acting as Yoda. After the climax of episode 7, 8 will be forced to have an anti-climax - maybe Finn gets carbonated this time? Then episode 9 must follow Return of the Jedi, but since Rey was already a Jedi master after touching Luke's lightsaber, we'll just have the destruction of a fourth super weapon to look forward to.
 
I admire your ability to project your own sensibilities into the film, but even if there is more to Finn than meets the eye, there's still the fact the film followed the same formula two previous films have tread. I anticipate that episode 8 shall now be forced to tread the territory of Empire Strikes Back, though with Luke acting as Yoda. After the climax of episode 7, 8 will be forced to have an anti-climax - maybe Finn gets carbonated this time? Then episode 9 must follow Return of the Jedi, but since Rey was already a Jedi master after touching Luke's lightsaber, we'll just have the destruction of a fourth super weapon to look forward to.

I hope the First Order follows the New Republic's homebrewing regulations.
 
Rather than the Empire and the Dark Side seeming to instantly bounce back from what should have been a fatal blow, it could have been about Luke building up the Jedi academy. The first film at least should have been all about Han and Chewie, since Harrison Ford seemed so keen to retire the character. Any new characters should have been bit parts - not the other way around.

While I broadly agree with most of what you said, I think a film about Luke setting up an academy sounds like the dullest thing ever. Also, how can you square that with making the film mostly about Han and Chewie?
 
I don't think the Force is the problem, so much as it is lousy screenplay writers.

More like design by Disney committee to cash-in on the nostalgia. If the following movies will be good, it will have Rey turning to the dark side and Emo Solo having a redemption arc. Finn will be wheelchair bound and resent Rey, Chewie will become an alcoholic and will try to reconcile with lightside Emo. Cliche, but at least sensible and emotionally satisfying.
 
Who cares, enjoy the movie or don't.
 
On like 7 being a ripoff 4 or what have you it's like it has the same things in it, but the way they go about it is different

Also complaining about Finn being able to use a lightsaber without training is stupid
 
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I wish some of the political information from the novel Bloodline had made it in, it actually very elegantly explains why the First Order is getting away with what it's getting away with and why The Resistance is so rag tag. But I understand why they avoided all of it given reception to the prequels.
 
if that's the one where it turns out Leia is not somehow made peace with her past and she has stormy relations with aristocrats as well , that's a good yarn , going a good way to make a silk purse from stuff's ears . Otherwise Episode VII is surprisingly good , despite the hopes , most readily apparent in British media , to make George Lucas look like a fool . This ı say , despite it's known that ı fully approve Ridley for all yet unseen .
 
I admire your ability to project your own sensibilities into the film, but even if there is more to Finn than meets the eye, there's still the fact the film followed the same formula two previous films have tread. I anticipate that episode 8 shall now be forced to tread the territory of Empire Strikes Back, though with Luke acting as Yoda. After the climax of episode 7, 8 will be forced to have an anti-climax - maybe Finn gets carbonated this time? Then episode 9 must follow Return of the Jedi, but since Rey was already a Jedi master after touching Luke's lightsaber, we'll just have the destruction of a fourth super weapon to look forward to.
TFA needed to be a little formulaic. It needed to recall the magic that Made the original trilogy work and that the prequel trilogy lacked. It needed to introduce new characters who we both liked and could eventually hold their own against the original characters. It also needed to retell who the old characters are now and recapture their spirit. It needed to set the right tone and pacing. They needed to make the force mystical again after the horrid bodge job they did with midichlorians.

Now that they've earned their stripes they can go on and do things differently. But note that they did set things up in some significantly different ways. Snoke didn't seem at all fazed by the destruction of Starkiller Base and Kylo Ren is a lot different from Vader. I'm actually excited to see how that will turn out.

In the end, when I walked out of the theater, it felt like Star Wars. It felt like the movie my dad took me to see when I was a kid (though to be fair, I did actually go with my dad), and that's something I didn't feel with the prequel trilogy.
 
The only thing that could redeem TFA for me is the theory that Rey is somehow a reincarnation of Vader - absurd as that seems, or else more sensitive with the force than anyone in galatic history. That would explain why she was dumped on Jakku. Snoke and Kylo offer no menace. Luke I would imagine could easily defeat them. But if the trilogy is about avoiding Rey going to the darkside - and if she actually did go to the darkside - then we've got something interesting.
 
In the end, when I walked out of the theater, it felt like Star Wars.
That’s because it was the same damn movie as the first Star Wars.


Force Awakens didn’t have to be scene for scene remake of the first one. The filmmakers could have tried to push the envelope, or at least not made it the same trite story of a poor orphan on a desert planet who blows up a round space station. But they didn’t. They opted to ape the first film, and they deserved every bit of criticism for that choice.
 
I think the Force Awakens should have been about Chewbacca, Han Solo, and Leia opening their own bar and brewing their own brews, while Luke and Yoda go snowboarding. But then this dark side snowboarder shows up and challenges Luke to a race down some crazy mountain, and the winner wins the bar. Luke ends up barely winning but at the end of the movie we find out that Chewbacca was a dark sith lord all along, setting up the stage for Star Wars 8
 
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