The Michael Jackson trial

[NovaKart]

Lately I've been reading the transcripts of the Michael Jackson trial. I've only read the opening statements so far, those were long enough but the defense makes a pretty compelling case for Michael's innocence, mostly by showing what a con artist the accuser's mother was. I have to look at the wittness statements to see if the defense's case holds up, but I think it will considering that he was found not guilty on all counts.

According to the defense attorney, the mother of the accuser had a lawsuit against JC Penney accusing security guards of beating her and her children and much later she added that she had been sexually assaulted. I read somewhere else that she had been arrested for shoplifting there which is what lead to the supposed incident with the security guards. She got a settlement of over $100,000 from the lawsuit.

She never reported this income to the authorities and was still getting welfare and disability checks. When asked about this in the trial she took the 5th.

She also claimed that George Lopez (star of a popular sitcom for those who don't know) stole $300 from her son's wallet. Why George Lopez would steal money from someone when he's really rich and why a little boy would have $300 in his wallet are both really good questions.

She also had her boys call Jay Leno (late night chat show host) and he could hear her coaching them on what to say on the phone.

Her son had cancer and she went around trying to get money for his treatment but she had full medical coverage through her husband's job.

When she eventually divorced her 1st husband she claimed he was physically abusive to her and the boys and got sole custody.

There's a huge amount of wittness testimony in this case, some from George Lopez, Chris Tucker and Macauley Culkin and I haven't read any of it yet except for some with the accuser's mother and Martin Bashir but so far what I've read really seems to hold up Michae's innocence.

Ironically the accuser's mother, Janet Arvizo married someone named Jay Jackson and her name is now Janet Jackson and that's what she's normally called in the transcripts.

Anyway, what are your thoughts on the trial? You can read the transcripts here :

http://deargavinarvizo.com/category/court-transcripts/

There's 3 pages of links to court documents on the site. It looks like the full transcripts.

 

[MajKira]

Well, I think Mike wasnt innocent as he stood under medic influence while he felt so much pressure
in his fame and also made too many face operations that he looked ugly in the end
but now he died anyway so it doesnt matter much anymore since you cannot arrest dead people other than burying them down under or burn them to ashes

but since hes got soo much money accumulated he would have it rather good in prison too if he still lived

 

[warpus]

We're talking about Jacko again?

The guy was messed in the head. He slept in the same bed as little kids he wasn't related to! If anyone *not* famous did the same, people would be calling for his (or her) head.

That doesn't prove that he did anything sexual with them, but he stepped over the line big time and he saw nothing wrong with that..

 

[BvBPL]

Fame does ugly, ugly things to people. This woman seemed to be enamored with fame and people who have it and it sure looks like her pursuit of it through her children hurt them. Jackson had his own terribly demons to deal with as well. It is really too bad.

 

[SerriaFox]

Not guilty in court of law, is not the same thing a not guilty.

There may have been reasonable doubt, because of the character of the accuser, but that is not the same thing as innocent.

 

[MobBoss]

Two thoughts.

One, Jackson was the one on trial, not the kids mom. If you allow the defense to deflect attention off Jackson and onto the kids mom, then their job is done.

Two, just because you have a butthole mom doesnt mean you cant still be the victim of child abuse from a pedophile.

 

[MjM]

Michael Jackson had intense emotional problems, indicated by his rampant drug use and strange tendencies with children. When he died his body was riddled with needle marks for injections. His rampant addiction to Demerol showed that he was always feeling pain, most likely not physical either. Someone with that much emotional pain was obviously doing something he was very ashamed of.

So I believe the accusations against him based on the way he conducted himself, and the evidence against him.

 

[Terxpahseyton]

We're talking about Jacko again?

The guy was messed in the head. He slept in the same bed as little kids he wasn't related to!

Warpus, this is bullcrap. Please tell me you were sarcastic. Or is this really what the pedophilia hype has achieved?

As to the OP: It sounds like this mother could be a psychopath.

As to the underlying question: It seems quit certain that Jacko had strong emotional problems and a dug problem. But I don't think he was a pedophile. How I perceived the story is that he was a very disturbed and by this weak star who craved for the harmony of a child (which he never had being on tour and practicing music since a child).
But he was no danger to kids or anybody else (according to the version I find most likely).
Rather, he was just the victim of his emotional trouble and very bad management advice which thought it would be great to start a campaign of little "harmless" scandals, but which lead to the perception of Jako as being crazy (which he happened to be a little, but that is not the point, because those scandals and the following media coverage were no correct portrayal of his troubles at all).

 

[warpus]

Warpus, this is bullcrap. Please tell me you were sarcastic.

I wasn't. Who sleeps with 12 year old neighbourhood boys and thinks it's normal?

 

[NetGear]

What I think is that mj was a naive overgrown kid with lots of money. Perfect prey for society.

 

[Terxpahseyton]

I wasn't. Who sleeps with 12 year old neighbourhood boys and thinks it's normal?

What's "normal" is relative and often enough totally arbitrary. So it sucks as a measure of what is "good" or "bad". But if it annoys you if someone is not normal, suit yourself. As long as you leave them alone (I know that that is not your general attitude, but I take what you serve).
But in the by me quoted post you didn't argue just that, but that one would have to be "messed up in the head" to sleep with children in the same bed if they are not his or her own. I could go ahead and vent why this statement is nonsense, but it might be more effective if you just say why that would be so from your POV. But don't say because it is not normal.

 

[NovaKart]

Two thoughts.

One, Jackson was the one on trial, not the kids mom. If you allow the defense to deflect attention off Jackson and onto the kids mom, then their job is done.

Two, just because you have a butthole mom doesnt mean you cant still be the victim of child abuse from a pedophile.

This is a child molestation trial in which there is no physical evidence. Therefore we just have to go by the wittnesses testimony so the credibility of the wittneses such as the mother are very relevant. If she has a history of using the legal system to get money and trying to get money from celebrities then that makes the charges questionable.

Michael Jackson had intense emotional problems, indicated by his rampant drug use and strange tendencies with children. When he died his body was riddled with needle marks for injections. His rampant addiction to Demerol showed that he was always feeling pain, most likely not physical either. Someone with that much emotional pain was obviously doing something he was very ashamed of.

So I believe the accusations against him based on the way he conducted himself, and the evidence against him.

I think many people find him guilty just based on their opinions of Michael Jackson. When I first heard he had been accused I thought he was definitely guitly. When I heard more details about the trial and started to read the transcripts I started to think otherwise.

I do think Michael Jackson, based on how he came across in the Martin Bashir documentary, is someone who doesn't seem to be connected to reality. He's probably been cut off from normal society for so long and he probably has people around him who won't talk straight with him so he probably has little idea of what is or isn't socially appropriate. That doesn't mean he's a child molester though. This is just based on my opinion of how he comes across in interviews, of course I've never met him or anyone who has met him so I could be wrong.

 

[NovaKart]

http://www.flickr.com/photos/paulscheer/sets/72157617373340442/with/3479187330/

I just remembered this Flickr collection of bizarre items from the Neverland auction. It goes to show that money can't buy taste.

 

[Tani Coyote]

I can see why people assume there were sexual interactions, but...

...Michael Jackson had Peter Pan Syndrome. He was a kid trapped in an adult's body. He surrounded himself with kids probably because he got along better with them than adult's. The guy had a private amusement park for goodness sake.

 

[MobBoss]

This is a child molestation trial in which there is no physical evidence. Therefore we just have to go by the wittnesses testimony so the credibility of the wittneses such as the mother are very relevant. If she has a history of using the legal system to get money and trying to get money from celebrities then that makes the charges questionable.

I think many people find him guilty just based on their opinions of Michael Jackson. When I first heard he had been accused I thought he was definitely guitly. When I heard more details about the trial and started to read the transcripts I started to think otherwise.

I do think Michael Jackson, based on how he came across in the Martin Bashir documentary, is someone who doesn't seem to be connected to reality. He's probably been cut off from normal society for so long and he probably has people around him who won't talk straight with him so he probably has little idea of what is or isn't socially appropriate. That doesn't mean he's a child molester though. This is just based on my opinion of how he comes across in interviews, of course I've never met him or anyone who has met him so I could be wrong.

You also have to gauge the lack of evidence against other testimony, like Jacksons own admittance to sleeping in bed with young children 'cause he likes it.

Also, didnt they interview Martin Bashir? I could have sworn that in some interview somewhere along the line he actually said he thought that Jackson may have indeed committed the crimes he was accused of.

 

[NovaKart]

The alledged incidents didn't happen until after the Martin Bashir interview aired so Martin Bashir wasn't around during that time. He did spend 8 months doing the documentary and he did meet the accuser and his family so I think his testimony could have some weight but if he says he thinks MJ may have committed the crimes that doesn't really mean much.

MJ admitting he sleeps in bed with boys is suspicious but not really enough to convict someone.

 

[Tani Coyote]

The fact MJ would admit to sleeping in beds with children would seem suspicious, due to the fact that would only serve to incriminate him further.

It seems he was unaware of the social stigma towards such a thing, that or he just didn't feel that that was wrong.

I'm heavily convinced he was a person who's mind was drastically younger than his body.

 

[Ayn Rand]

I think it doesn't matter whether he was guilty or innocent - the media started ripping him to pieces long before any allegations surfaced, and they would have carried on ripping him to pieces even if he'd lived like an angel.

Obviously a damaged individual - he spent his childhood being chewed up and spat out to satisfy the needs of others, and the record industry. Then his obvious genius made him a target for a society that is in many ways far more weird and twisted than he was, but considers itself the ultimate moral judge of all things.

Frankly I felt sorry for MJ - even if he'd done nothing wrong, they would still have gunned for him until they finally brought him down anyway - all the while hypocritically claiming that it was his fault and he was the bad guy. But it sells newspapers, right?

 

[Tani Coyote]

Frankly I felt sorry for MJ - even if he'd done nothing wrong, they would still have gunned for him until they finally brought him down anyway - all the while hypocritically claiming that it was his fault and he was the bad guy. But it sells newspapers, right?

Of course, he gets the last laugh, because he was rich. And even more laughs because despite all the media sniping, he had a huge increase in sales post-mortem. He still had many fans, even if they weren't as proud of it as before.

So, try again, media!

Though given signs point to him having a child-like mentality, I can't imagine the toll the criticism may have taken on him. Some people can shrug countless vicious attacks off; others can't.

 

[Bestbank Tiger]

MJ was innocent. He made Thriller, man. Thriller.