The Release Sucks!!!!!!!

[blue3c]

Ok what about 9 or so. Just curious. yes yes I am just wasting the last 30 min of work here. Yes yes. Spell check. yes yes. Release sucks. Yes yes. need patch. yes yes. Going insane. yes yes. Computer crash yes yes.

 

[Ravenlock]

Ok what about 9 or so. Just curious. yes yes I am just wasting the last 30 min of work here. Yes yes. Spell check. yes yes. Release sucks. Yes yes. need patch. yes yes. Going insane. yes yes. Computer crash yes yes.

Heh. Hang in there, buddy, you'll make it.

 

[BlytZ]

In no particular order:

Frequent crashes/
Along with 3 of my friends, we've been trying to play CIV4 each evening over the internet. Every time we try to at least one of us crashes. If it isn't the software dissapearing, then we are getting a blue screen error, if it isn't a blue screen error it is the pc locking up etc etc

Glitchy map editor/
I'm used to the CIV3 map editor. It works. You point, click and the Bonus grassland appears. With CIV4 you have to make a Game, then attempt to erase the map, which is then covered in ugly smudges from where the old map used to be. It also runs slowly unlike the last editor that was nice and smooth. Many of you will be responding already to this 'but you can change anything, you just need to go to...' I do not care if you can change the unit stats for each individual soldier in the game. I do not want to. I want to make a map, save it, start the game, load it and play it. It is a simple process that was mastered with CIV3, why ruin it?

Pointless unit promotions/
As exciting and 'involving' as including the new promotions truly truly is, why bother? The old ranks worked fine. The only occasions I remember when Modern Armour would face an Archer is because the dumb AI refused to get rid of their Warriors and archers despite it being 2075AD... The new system is just annoying. I do not want my archer to be good at fighting in forest on a rainy day. I want him to have a high defense or a high attack rating, it is simple.

Dumb National Wonders/
Why limit a city to only two National Wonders? I want my capital to be the most powerful thing on earth pumping modern armour out 1 a turn, not some limp average city due to the dumb limit on national wonders. I don't think I really need to go into this one in much detail. It is pointless.

Useless resources/
I do not want marble, I do not want stone. I want oil for tanks, iron for swordsman. Simple, is better. I don't want certain types of resource to improve building production by 50% because it is not simple, it is unlikely I will ever get the resource and the bonus is hardly worth the complication. On the subjects of harvesting resources I cannot see how the game benefits from making mountains useless. In real life they are far from useless for all kinds of reasons, now they are just another vacum in your cities harvesting area, what waste!

Ugly units/
1 unit, 1 health bar. A simple concept that works. I do not feel the new '3 man' infantry squads were worth the time invested in making their 'neat' animations. The ships are ugly and small, the tanks are as boring as ever. The only improvement regards the aircraft which now seem to look more like aircraft eg circling when in intercept mode.

Loss of structered Eras/
Ancient times, Middle Ages, Industrial, Modern. Again a simple concept that worked fine in the past game, the lack of this just turns the Tech tree into one boring blur that I pay little attention of and is simply a distraction rather than a clear technical map.

Why bother with new graphics?/
The graphics are quite pretty, the cities do look better and a lot of the animations are fun to watch HOWEVER the zoom function is the most pointless feature I've seen since the 'helicopter' was introduced in CIV3. I don't want to see the whole globe with a few stars to the left and right, I want to be able to see more than 4 cities on my screen without having to scroll endlessly. This can be confusing and painful to do when traversing a large Empire. Why not keep the simple 2 zoom function? Why is CIV trying to be an RTS? It is not and should not be.

Removing units/
Where are my nuclear submarines? They were fun, hands off! Where are my tactical nukes, they were fun for exactly the same reason the nuclear submarines were, they could not be caught or found by spies, hide them under the ice caps and bring em out when needed! Where is the army unit? That was brilliant fun that allowed you to form truly customised and powerful armies for the end game. Where are my cruise missiles? Loading a transport up with those babies and using them to barrage coastal cities was what used to get me through the night

What have you done to my navy?/
Aircraft Carriers can only carry four units? They can't carry bombers? Transports can only carry 4? Why the hell not? In the name of all things holy... It is as illogical in my mind as it is unhelpful.

Spies/
In CIV3 you bought a spy, you paid it to do things, sometimes it got caught. *claps* it worked fine, was good fun and wasn't glitchy. Now you have to build a unit and send it out to work... but you can only have 4.... and the chances of catching the enemy spies are slim...so slim... so very very slim...
Spies in CIV4 are awful, bloody bloody awful

Railoads/
You can go from one space to another in no time at all allowing for quick transference of troops. Now a maximum of 10 squares!?!?! Why bother? You may be attempting to inject some realistic elements but why do you have to start with ruining an element of the game that made the middle ages painful movement of units dissapear whilst you are happy to leave in historical inacuracies and plain fallacies! eg Nationality of leaders etc

So in summary, I'd rather play CIV3 or snap. If my game isn't crashing it is frustrating the hell out of me by not allowing me to build The Pentagon in Berlin because it already has Iron works and National Epic... well excuse me if suddenly there is no room left in Berlin... There are a few and I mean only a few, good new elements eg Joint technology pursuit in multiplayer and making mountains impassable, the united nations being able to ban nukes and Civics......nope that is it

This rant has not been spell checked for I cannot be bothered.

Many of you may disagree with my complaints and I'm happy for you to detail why in response to my rant. However no one will win me over, change my perspective or in any way make me take back anything I have said above.

I'm an unhappy customer who wishes you had just revised the CIV3 game, ironed out all the bugs, redone the multiplayer to include some of your new ideas, made mountains impassible without making them useless resource wise, included civics etc

I wish I'd never bought the bloody thing

BlytZ

 

[Ravenlock]

In no particular order:

[A LOT OF STUFF]

Many of you may disagree with my complaints and I'm happy for you to detail why in response to my rant. However no one will win me over, change my perspective or in any way make me take back anything I have said above.

I'm an unhappy customer who wishes you had just revised the CIV3 game, ironed out all the bugs, redone the multiplayer to include some of your new ideas, made mountains impassible without making them useless resource wise, included civics etc

I wish I'd never bought the bloody thing

BlytZ

So return it or sell it, if you're never going to like it even if they fix the bugs; only the first two things in your litany of complaints belong in a "technical support" forum anyhow.

I love a lot of the changes they've made to gameplay. The game is more about strategic choices and less about min-maxing every single city. You can't build all your wonders in a city because from a historical standpoint that's ludicrous, and the decisions about which wonders work best together for what you want to accomplish are interesting strategic choices that matter now when they didn't before. I could go through your list, but why bother when you've already predetermined to hate the game?

If you love Civ III, great! It was a very good game, and you can continue playing it at no additional cost. Your complaint is akin to people who rant when an author writes a sequel they don't agree with. It's the author's work, and they're going to write it the way they want. They're not obligated to follow your whims, and you're not obligated to support them with your money.

It's made all the worse by the fact that you could have learned about some of the things you were going to hate BEFORE paying for the game by reading any of the tons of articles out there describing the changes. At least bugs are a legitimate surprise.

EDIT: Sorry, having re-read your list, you only could have learned about some of the changes, probably not all. I doubt any articles detailed the spy changes, troop transport limits, etc. Apologies.

 

[big mazy]

hehehe..no moderator for me...Moderator Action: Unless you stop flaming and watch your language.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889
look,ravenlock,i'm sorry,but we are here shouting out loud at Sid (read somewhere that the "gang" at 2k and people on this project monitor forums for somewhat unhappy customers...hahaha,bunch of dummarses)and his stupid effort to turn this deepest strategy game ever into look-a-like-stupid-little-rts-game and you are talking about
spell check!!!I mean,come on...
BlytZ,agree with you for a lot off things...me to expected for civIV to be somewhat extended vers. of civconq and some of the mods...
...all this talk got me thinking,maybe if he hired some off great moderators from this and similiar forums...we wouldn't have this thread...and then we could talk about making games with love...

 

[zsc]

for anyone claiming that a "LARGE" portion of gamers are having problems with the game, I would like to know where you got that info. I agree that a LARGE number of people are having problems, I can read the number the people/threads in this forum, specifically the tech support section, and on other sites as well. But take a look at the number of threads/posts in the general discussion section alone, granted some of them could be posts about in-game bugs and/or technical problems, but mostly about the game itself (meaning people are actually playing it). At the time of this post, the numbers are:

General Discussion - 136,260
Technical Support - 7,669

Now, my point is NOT that there are that many people playing the game, just that there are a lot of people NOT having TECHNICAL difficulty with the game. Also, I am not arguing that there could be more people having problems with the game, but to say that a large portion are, without any proof, is too premature. By all means, if you are having problems with the game, register, make a post and prove me wrong. That would only help us. If the general public see that a LARGE portion of people are having problems, Firaxis would definitely take more actions (currently at none).

But dont just post about anything, ie. complaints about how this release sucks, which I agree, first release often is the worst release. Post your technical problems, post your specs, people will respond. Even if someone has the exact same problems as you, concur with them, while you're at it, try out the fixes that have/haven't been mentioned. People say they have to rights to complain, do so, but do it constructively, at least in the technical support section. Add to the solutions not the problems.

 

[Prometheus_666]

At the time of this post, the numbers are:

General Discussion - 136,260
Technical Support - 7,669

Now, my point is NOT that there are that many people playing the game, just that there are a lot of people NOT having TECHNICAL difficulty with the game.

Considering that the General Discussion forum has been in use for months, you cannot compare the 2.

Civ IV has been out 2 weeks and already there is 7,500+ posts in the tech forum. By the new year if we see no patch we will be at near 50,000.

Not to say that what you wrote is all wrong but we need to put this into context.

 

[zsc]

Thank you for the reply, I hadn't gone through the general discussion section to see when the posts were made, maybe I should've taken my own advice. But I did some more searching and assuming people who had gotten the games on release date (Oct 25) had started posting threads, the earliest one is on page 55. Now, there were a lot of post asking about the game so I should also factor that in.

Once the patch is release, the number of posts/day should decrease, unless the patch creates even more problems, in that case we'll be seeing a lot more people in the tech forum.

 

[Roach]

Thank you for the reply, I hadn't gone through the general discussion section to see when the posts were made, maybe I should've taken my own advice. But I did some more searching and assuming people who had gotten the games on release date (Oct 25) had started posting threads, the earliest one is on page 55. Now, there were a lot of post asking about the game so I should also factor that in.

LOL, keep in mind there are only about 20 techinical glitches that we can talk about (I have 8 I think). The people in the forum proper have many different things to discuss.

Although if my game worked I doubt I would be talking about it, would be playing it instead. From what I have seen upto 890AD it looks pretty good.

Patch pls pls pls....

 

[Clown2TheLeft]

for anyone claiming that a "LARGE" portion of gamers are having problems with the game, I would like to know where you got that info. I agree that a LARGE number of people are having problems, I can read the number the people/threads in this forum, specifically the tech support section, and on other sites as well. But take a look at the number of threads/posts in the general discussion section alone, granted some of them could be posts about in-game bugs and/or technical problems, but mostly about the game itself (meaning people are actually playing it). At the time of this post, the numbers are:

General Discussion - 136,260
Technical Support - 7,669

This is quite skewed, being as the Bug Reports and Suggestion forums are within the General Discussion header...


If this was a truck, it'd be a factory recall.


Later!

--The Clown to the Left

 

[zsc]

Yea, I just noticed that there are almost 50,000 posts in the Suggestion section and about 3,400 posts in the Bugs section. But 55 pages of postings, factor in the posts by people w/o the game, still means there are a lot of people not having problems.

Now, my point is NOT that there are that many people playing the game, just that there are a lot of people NOT having TECHNICAL difficulty with the game.

Of course, there are people not having problems who are currently playing and have no idea that there any problems at all. But then there are people who have problems and are just looking through the forums. This could go on...and on.

Pretty much, what I was trying to say was that not a LARGE PORTION of people are having problems, at least not yet known. At the moment, we MAY be the minority of Civ 4 owners. Of course, I could be wrong and the majority of people are having problems, but until people start posting their problems and the number increases, the dev is going to see this as a serious problem, but might not be serious enough to "recall".

Since you brought up the truck analogy, unless the automakers (or the lawyers of people sueing them) confirm that there are widespread problems, they're not going to recall every truck of that model(s)/year(s) immediately, the process takes much longer than 2 weeks after release. At least with softwares, patches CAN be released for minor issues, and do-it-yourself fixers can be done to solve/lessen the problems.

This should really be in the general discussion, but I only follow the technical support section.

 

[Ravenlock]

hehehe..no moderator for me...look,ravenlock,i'm sorry,but we are here shouting out loud at Sid (read somewhere that the "gang" at 2k and people on this project monitor forums for somewhat unhappy customers...hahaha,bunch of dummarses)and his stupid effort to turn this deepest strategy game ever into look-a-like-stupid-little-rts-game and you are talking about
spell check!!!I mean,come on...who gives a F***
BlytZ,agree with you for a lot off things...me to expected for civIV to be somewhat extended vers. of civconq and some of the mods...
...all this talk got me thinking,maybe if he hired some off great moderators from this and similiar forums...we wouldn't have this thread...and then we could talk about making games with love...

Look mazy, you jumped into this by being a general jerk about one of my posts, and I responded to you pointing out that your facts were wrong (videogame development is not a gold mine for programmers, release date is usually not within their capability to change so it wasn't "giving in to pressure", etc) and made a comment at the end about how by the way, it's much nicer to talk to you if you bother to write in English.

You ignored all my actual points in that post and have continued to be a general jerk since. Either contribute to the conversation or go write nasty rants to the people who care.

 

[A.J. Caesar]

for anyone claiming that a "LARGE" portion of gamers are having problems with the game, I would like to know where you got that info. I agree that a LARGE number of people are having problems, I can read the number the people/threads in this forum, specifically the tech support section, and on other sites as well. But take a look at the number of threads/posts in the general discussion section alone, granted some of them could be posts about in-game bugs and/or technical problems, but mostly about the game itself (meaning people are actually playing it). At the time of this post, the numbers are:

General Discussion - 136,260
Technical Support - 7,669

Civ forums are not significative : remember that Civ games sold milions of copies so in the forums there is only an infinitesimal portion of the players ( 20000 members is less than 1-2 %)!
Moreover I think that players in the game forums have a more advanced hardware than the typical gamer.

Despite the graphic/system requirements I dont believe that there are people that have not seen major bugs (memory leaks, crashes, ... )
I've read posts in strategic or general discussion forum in which it's considered normal to reboot the system every two turns or play @ 5fps or be unable to save the game.

 

[big mazy]

(1) The developers most likely had no choice as to when to release the game; they hardly ever do. Publishers make those decisions. Developers just try to get the game ready for whatever date has been set.

(2) Clever of you to claim "only serious expansion" could fix it before you even see the patch. Oh wait, no, that's not clever at all. Nevermind.

(3) The graphics look fantastic in my opinion, the opinion of most players, and the opinion of just about everybody who reviewed the game. So I think you'd be in the minority on this one. The gameplay changes are great as well, and so far Civ IV looks like a much less micromanagement-focused, much more open strategy game than Civ III. If you don't like the changes, that's fine, but again you'd be in the minority.

ojjjjjj..ok,if you insist...
1.Ok,agree with you on this,but...it sounds like they are slaves in corp. businnes"...oh,sir,can we finish the game,please...","no,no...we have to make more money,MORE MONEY...".Think that they do have a saying in that,not a last one,but their voice can be heard....
2.Don't no for sure about exp. or patch...but as the problems are growing..he...
it's going to take a serious.....a SERIOUS patch to make this game playable,again....I CAN PLAY the game,that is it starts,but...later development is just pain in the arrs...and,again,yes with my "machine" I expected gliches and lag's,and I was well-prepared,could deal with few of them because this is CIV,but it's just too much...
3.Yeah,well the graph and gameplay...guess it's a matter of taste...and not quite suitable for this part of forum!

you jumped into this by being a general jerk

and have continued to be a general jerk since

Well,moderator...answer the call....or shall I continue with the goat thing?

 

[Old Dood]

Come on Gentlemen....Lets play nice. No need to feed our egos.

Remember the Thread title....The Release Sucks....not each other.

 

[Ravenlock]

ojjjjjj..ok,if you insist...

Thank you. I didn't think civilized discourse was really that much to ask.

1.Ok,agree with you on this,but...it sounds like they are slaves in corp. businnes"...oh,sir,can we finish the game,please...","no,no...we have to make more money,MORE MONEY...".Think that they do have a saying in that,not a last one,but their voice can be heard....

I think you misinterpreted. What I am trying to get across is that developers (programmers) generally actually care about the game they're making. They wouldn't be making it otherwise, because they don't make enough money to make it worth the stress. They're sitting there saying "this feature is going to rock, the players are going to love it!", not "ha ha, by rushing this out the door we can increase profits and screw the customer!" They want people to like the game they made, and given the chance will probably keep working on it until it's the way they wanted to see it.

2.Don't no for sure about exp. or patch...but as the problems are growing..he...
it's going to take a serious.....a SERIOUS patch to make this game playable,again....I CAN PLAY the game,that is it starts,but...later development is just pain in the arrs...and,again,yes with my "machine" I expected gliches and lag's,and I was well-prepared,could deal with few of them because this is CIV,but it's just too much...

I really think the patch will improve the technical issues. I do. I might be an optimistic fool - we'll all find out soon. If you don't like the gameplay, of course, as you say in #3, that is a matter of taste and isn't likely to change, but a lot of that was covered in previews and reviews of the game... buyer beware, etc. Still, if you're really never going to like it, I hope you get your money back.

Well,moderator...answer the call....or shall I continue with the goat thing?

Big differences there, pal. (1) You were the aggressor. (2) "You're being a jerk" is a comment on your behavior and a criticism. The goat thing was just a rude attack. But I'll play nice if you will.

 

[big mazy]

ok,ok...lets call a truce....
..and don't get me wrong,I love some off the new things in the gameplay,but...that zoom is not necesary at all...for instance...and again,tried to play a game,saved and now save is useless,cant get to load the game...ojjjjjj

 

[Old Dood]

I wish I could open a city screen from zoomed out to space mode by just clicking on the city.

 

[minimus]

Firstly the only reason I am in the technical section is to find out how to get this bloody game to work properly so to all those people for who the game is working good luck but unless you think that for those it doesn’t are somehow lying or morons constructive advice would be helpful.

Secondly I have seen games released that need patches for bugs etc many superficial but I have never seen such a varied amount of fundamental problems on a wide selection of PC set-ups and many like my own above the recommended requirements. This does indicate at least for me something a bit more then a few bugs to be rectified by a quick patch (I hope I am wrong).

Thirdly game companies have got in to the habit of releasing to early but when as far as I can see a sizable amount of people are having this much trouble your going have to admit something is wrong. Your driver is out date sorry your bios is wrong you forgot to do this or that, all bull there is a point were you should have a reasonable expectation of playing a game if the box it comes in says you can.

 

[Me=Civ God]

It's appalling that a game riddled with so many huge bugs gets past the testing phase. Not sure exactly who to blame but some sort of an apology and a quick patch are needed to save even some face. Firaxis/Take2 won't gain many new friends here by rushing a beta-product out.

I wouldn't mind the typos or such on Civilopedia etc but the graphics and stability problems that seem to plague a huge amount of people are just not acceptable at all. I particularly enjoy the one which reboots my computer after I load a savegame and click on a unit. Handy feature that...

actually more of a alpha product