The Speech that won the election

[Leoreth]

Asking others to pay for the removal of illegals because you don't like them is blackmail. Sophistry. I would NEVER let something like that HAPPEN.

 

[Chiteng]

Asking others to pay for the removal of illegals because you don't like them is blackmail. Sophistry. I would NEVER let something like that HAPPEN.

Then vote against it =)
Currently the numbers favor MY argument

 

[Leoreth]

Arguments are not decided by votes, elections are. But it's nice that you admit to your own methods of blackmail, using your vote.

 

[JollyRoger]

I do not understand why Chiteng spends so much time posting here when he could be patrolling the border.

 

[Cutlass]

as much as it takes. I dont think it will be more expensive than the Gulf War

It will be. And all of that money will be wasted. Because, as you would know if you actually cared enough about the issue to learn something about it, only a minority of illegal immigrants get here by walking across the border. So virtually all the money you spend on that is money you just throw away.

Citation needed.
Bear in mind the benchmark here is operational control not total control.

The US has one hell of a lot of border. Most illegals don't cross that border. So the return on investment for all of what you spend on that is terrible waste.

 

[DinoDoc]

The US has one hell of a lot of border. Most illegals don't cross that border. So the return on investment for all of what you spend on that is terrible waste.

You're changing the argument. I asked you where you got the $ figure you cited. Stop attempting to dodge and simply answer the question.

 

[Cutlass]

You're changing the argument. I asked you where you got the $ figure you cited.

By understanding the fact that the task is not doable. And so no amount of money thrown at it will get it done.

 

[DinoDoc]

Citation needed.

 

[Cutlass]

Here ya go. Do some reading.

 

[DinoDoc]

I'm merely curious about the basis for your position and wanted to see what facts backed it up. So far there doesn't seem to be any.

 

[Cutlass]

And there's even less for either the idea that we can close the border, or that it would have any real impact on illegal immigration if we did. It's nothing but a strawman.

 

[Chiteng]

And there's even less for either the idea that we can close the border, or that it would have any real impact on illegal immigration if we did. It's nothing but a strawman.

Deportation means nothing if they can merely re-enter. THAT is why the border needs to be closed

It has the incidental effect of harming the drug trade

Arguments are not decided by votes, elections are. But it's nice that you admit to your own methods of blackmail, using your vote.

Me voting is NOT blackmail. Me threatening someone with dire consequence if I am not
given what I want, would be blackmail.

That is not what I am doing

And there's even less for either the idea that we can close the border, or that it would have any real impact on illegal immigration if we did. It's nothing but a strawman.

I agree, we need to terminate all student visa. ALL.
Until such time that we can track ALL such visa and make sure they actually leave.

Moderator Action: mulit-posts merged
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[Cutlass]

Deportation means nothing if they can merely re-enter. THAT is why the border needs to be closed

It has the incidental effect of harming the drug trade

That would still have no real effect on either issue. Waste of money.

I agree, we need to terminate all student visa. ALL.
Until such time that we can track ALL such visa and make sure they actually leave.

So you will demand the impossible until you've entirely ruined the US. Got it.

 

[Chiteng]

That would still have no real effect on either issue. Waste of money.






So you will demand the impossible until you've entirely ruined the US. Got it.

All I see is you claiming it is immpossible. Other countries do it easily

 

[Cutlass]

All I see is you claiming it is immpossible. Other countries do it easily

Name one that does. Better yet, name a country similar to the US situation that does. There are 2 nations that have more border than the US. Not that many people are interested in sneaking into Russia. Canada only has a land border with the US. China has a lot of land border. But only the North Koreans would sneak in. No nation that is desirable for immigrants is keeping them out by locking down the border.

And it's still a worthless thing to try to do, because it is not the source of the problem.

 

[Leoreth]

Me voting is NOT blackmail. Me threatening someone with dire consequence if I am not
given what I want, would be blackmail.

That is not what I am doing

You threaten to withhold your vote. This is blackmail by your liberal use of the term.

 

[El_Machinae]

I didn't expect overnight results... but 4 years later, I expect results, especially when the national debt has nearly doubled in the meanwhile.

Yeah, I can see that, and you & I are both old enough that the word 'trillions' is still scary.

I wonder what kind of metric we'd use? We all know that the economy is doing poorly, but I've noticed that it always feels like it's doing poorly. I don't like GDP growth, because not very much of GDP growth has trickled down to the median. Employment? Rate of growth of the deficit?

 

[AlpsStranger]

I hope Romney really cracks down on illegals if he's elected. Having the Latino vote in lockstep for the next two generations could be really, really handy.

 

[Chiteng]

You threaten to withhold your vote. This is blackmail by your liberal use of the term.

No that would be extortion and only if the candidate knew I would withhold my vote.
Learn the difference

Name one that does. Better yet, name a country similar to the US situation that does. There are 2 nations that have more border than the US. Not that many people are interested in sneaking into Russia. Canada only has a land border with the US. China has a lot of land border. But only the North Koreans would sneak in. No nation that is desirable for immigrants is keeping them out by locking down the border.

And it's still a worthless thing to try to do, because it is not the source of the problem.

I am not willing to parse. Your argument is that it should not even be attempted.
That is not what I wish to see. We are polarized. I can accept that, so should you.

 

[strijder20]

All I see is you claiming it is immpossible. Other countries do it easily

Yes, Nazi Germany and North Korea were/are pretty effective at keeping their borders closed.