The Swastika

[Reno]

So the Finns are very quick to point out that his swastikas have nothing to do with Nazism.

And i repeat it still doesn't.

 

[Verbose]

And i repeat it still doesn't.

And I agree.

 

[Rambuchan]

I have heard of the Swastika being used by the Japanese, Celts and Indians prior to the Nazis adopting it. The Japanese and Celtic references I have heard are simply conversational and I haven't found anything to support them.

I do however know plenty about the Hindu use of the Swastika - I am looking at one now, it's painted on the doorframe of my office. Here's the most succinct and accurate write up to explain further:

"The word Swastika is normally believed to be an amalgam of the words Su and Asati. Su means 'good' and Asati meant 'to exist'.

As per Sanskrit grammer the words Su and Asati when amalgamated into one word become Swasti (as in the case of Su and Aaatam becoming Swagatam meaning welcome). If this derivation of the word Swastika is true, then the literal meaning of the term Swastika would be 'let good-prevail'.

There exist many types of signs which stand for the Swastika. Even the standard version has two forms the one facing the right also called the symbol of- the right hand path and the one facing the left called the symbol of the lefthand path. These two Swastikas are also considered to represent the male and female. There is also a Swastika which is an amalgam of these two types."

Let good prevail!!!

EDIT: You will find that pretty much most Indians around the world, Hindu or not, will think of the above when shown a Swastika and NOT of the Nazi use. I was educated in England and had the message that the Nazis were evil shoved down my throat from a young age. Yet despite this and despite the fact I am not a Hindu Indian, I still think of the ancient Hindu symbol first. People are right to point out that the Swastika may be seen on buildings in India to this day. It is everywhere - motorbike stickers, painted on an elephants flank, on a school girl's exercise book, painted on a tree near where a saddhu (holy man prays), on a Dad's lunch box, on a kite, a T-shirt - it's everywhere and the connotations are hugely benevolent.

 

[Verbose]

Here's a page with some interesting swastikas:

http://www.geocities.com/scocasso/manji/manji01.htm

and:

http://www.answers.com/topic/swastika

 

[Kafka2]

is it still a cross if it has 3 beams? Is it a cross if its two diagonal lines? is it a cross if it has a circle in it? yes!! its a reletivly simple varition considering how widely dispersed the symbol was.

Take a crucifix. Remove one of the points, then turn it upside-down, so it now resembles an inverted "T". To reverse the symbolic meaning, replace the Jesus figure with Ronald McDonald. Instead of having him crucified, have him licking the "T" suggestively. Is it still a crucifix?

It was a dumb comparison.

 

[Verbose]

Take a crucifix. Remove one of the points, then turn it upside-down, so it now resembles an inverted "T". To reverse the symbolic meaning, replace the Jesus figure with Ronald McDonald. Instead of having him crucified, have him licking the "T" suggestively. Is it still a crucifix?

It's still a 'tau'-cross.
(Symbol of St. Anthony, Mithra, Thor and a few others.)

 

[Kafka2]

But is it a crucifix?

No.

 

[Verbose]

Sorry. Double post. (Weird connection problem.)

 

[Verbose]

But is it a crucifix?

No.

They share the distinction of being crosses, and that aspect makes them comparable.
But no, a tau-cross isn't a crucifix without the figure of Christ, just like a 'triskele' isn't a 'tetraskele', the Greek designation for the swastika, though the design concept is similar.

 

[Yoda Power]

When I went to the official Carlsberg museum in Copenhagen two years ago, I saw some old Carlsberg beers pre-ww2. They had swastikas on them. Don't know why though.

 

[sydhe]

We used to have a swastika on Sutton Hall at the University of Oklahoma. I think it's still there. The building dates back before 1923.

 

[Bluemofia]

Didn't Hitler take the Swastika and fliped it and rotated it 45 degrees?

 

[Johann MacLeod]

But is it a crucifix?

No.

a vacuem cleaner would be a crucifix if i stapled a jesus on tom it. i dont understand why your so unwilling to admit the the swatika has thousands of variations-being as its an acient symbol, and one of those variations is on the Manx Flag. that web link clearly shows and state this fact.

 

[Reno]

Didn't Hitler take the Swastika and fliped it and rotated it 45 degrees?

Exactly, and in that form the swastika got it's bad reputation.

 

[Kafka2]

a vacuem cleaner would be a crucifix if i stapled a jesus on tom it. i dont understand why your so unwilling to admit the the swatika has thousands of variations-being as its an acient symbol, and one of those variations is on the Manx Flag. that web link clearly shows and state this fact.

Because the triskelion is the older symbol, and from a different culture, in addition to being significantly different in structure and with a very distinct and seperate symbolism.

Slapping on a triskelion a label attached to a different and later symbol from a different culture is like calling a horse-drawn travois like the plains Indians used "a motorbike". Or calling a Neolithic arrowhead "an ICBM". Or calling the Holy Roman Empire "Germany". It's lazy, ignorant of history, and plain wrong.

And, no- a vacuum cleaner would not be a crucifix if you simply slapped a Jesus on it. The Jesus form would have to be in the crucifixion pose to qualify, in which case the Jesus form is the crucfixion in its own right and the vacuum cleaner is a superfluous addition.

 

[Knight-Dragon]

In Singapore, we have a Buddhist organization called the Red Swastika Society... It's a religious and charity organization, nothing to do with the Nazis...

 

[Fox Mccloud]

I'm just here to give a few links.

http://www.crystalinks.com/swastika.html

It was used by early Christians as an alternative cross to avoid persecution, and by later Christians as a decorative emblem.

Interesting....

http://www.intelinet.org/swastika/swasti01.htm

http://www.kamat.com/indica/culture/sub-cultures/swastika.htm

http://news.indiainfo.com/2005/01/19/1901hindus.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swastika,_Ontario

 

[superisis]

About the swastikas found in churches (such as Hagia Sofia, true not a church anymore, but the swaskikas date from when it was), what did they symbolize?

 

[Bluemofia]

Most likely good luck. At least they are with Native Americans and Hindus.

 

[Jack the Ripper]

Earliest recorded = India.

Why did Hitler adopt it? I have no idea.

Hitler was a pagan