Too rich to jail

[JollyRoger]

Judge didn't have an option. Texas (and most other states, I think) have a minimum jail time for these types of offenses and most of them are as ludicrously extreme as this one. Judge had a choice between 20 years or none at all and he picked the latter.

The judge didn't have that extreme of a choice to make. I guess one question is, do me measure the crime (if it is first time dui, he got off with a stiff senetnce) or the results - 4 dead and others injured?

 

[JollyRoger]

Yes, I'd like to see the parents prosecuted.

JR, any chance of a civil suit taking the parents for a bunch of cash?

You know it on its way - will be interesting to see if the parents can distance themselves from the criminal case or if they paid for the lawyer and expert witness.

 

[BvBPL]

Does res judicata function to inform any subsequent civil suit following the criminal trial? I'm not sure of the interplay between the criminal and civil courts in that regard.

This thread is indicative of how having or not having access to legal representation that can result in divergent legal proceedings. JR, do you have any thoughts on how to improve the poor and middle class's access to legal representation?

--

Actually, I'd rather doubt that there would be a civil trial by the survivors of the decadents against the driver and his family. If the family is smart enough to hire a top-gun criminal defense attorney they will also be assuredly canny enough to get in front of the civil trial w/ an early settlement.

--

Quick, somebody check how much money the Couch family gave to Jean Boyd's election campaign.

 

[Berzerker]

hang 'em, hang 'em high

lets see if that reduces drunk driving

just joking

 

[Hygro]

I'm totally okay with this defense so long as the parents get his jail time instead.

And no the argument doesn't work in reverse-wealth situations because they weren't raising him entitledly-rich out of desperation, necessity, or an accidental by product of a harsh reality weighing them down. They weren't reacting (poorly) to unfairness, they were happily partaking.

 

[timtofly]

Do we know what facility they were sending him to? What was the full judgment, besides the probation? It did not sound like he was going straight home, but was being sent to a rehabilitation center.

Seeing as how the burden of fault was given to the parents, having him in some sort of educational center that would counteract the "training" of his parents, and still be a cost to them alone, and not the state would be a more fitting punishment.

 

[KmDubya]

So being a spoiled kid where your parents gave you everything you ever wanted is a legal defense to escape responsibility of your actions? This is a travesty. He should get 20 years in a real prison. Who does he think he is Edward Kennedy?

I don't care that he was only 16, that is old enough to know right from wrong. If at 16 you can't tell right from wrong than society does not need you as part of it. His ruined life in prison would serve as an example for others.

To any decent moral person living with the guilt of taking four lives based on your actions would be debilitating. How would you look at yourself in the mirror every day knowing what you did?

In today's world how do you get that drunk and drive, in fact how do your buddies all hop in the really drunk guy's car and drive away?

 

[timtofly]

Prison in the US while it may limit a person on amassing a fortune for themselves over time, is more of a burden on those who do work hard and pay their taxes allowing such people to be treated in a humane way. It does take away time from a person's life. Inside of prison is not that much different from living in a small community and enjoying or fearing that community. So technically staying in a prison for any amount of time does not "ruin the person", unless he develops a criminal mentality in prison and upon release figures out how to cheat the system even more.

 

[Bootstoots]

Yes, I fully agree that everyone should be judged equally before the law. If this had been a black kid from Dallas drunk driving would we be surprised if he got the full 20 years in prison?

I don't think 20 years in prison is an appropriate penalty in this case. I totally sympathize with the victims and their families - but 20 years basically removes this person from ever being able to be included in society. He'll be out at age 37 and basically unemployable. This is exactly how you design a system to increase recidivism.

As heinous as the crime was, I'd much rather see the person spend far less time in jail -1 year to a 16 year old is like 4 years to someone in middle age. Won't he get enough time to "think about what he's done" if he spends 4 years in prison instead of 20?

All that aside, the real miscarriage here is the overly light sentence. But honestly I'd rather have overly-light sentences than overly harsh ones. All should be applied equally regardless of family wealth, class, color, religion, gender, etc.

I have a similarly mixed opinion on this case, and on what should actually be done with drunk drivers in general (rich or poor). But I do have an idea of what I would do if I were somehow trusted with sentencing people like this.

What I would recommend is a lifetime revocation of his driver's license, backed up with a year or two of prison if he is ever caught driving in the future (and much more if intoxicated). I'm generally a fan of non-prison punishment where possible, and I think it is a waste of resources to imprison drunk drivers who cause fatal accidents. Intoxicated (or otherwise extremely reckless) drivers who kill people don't need to be locked up for decades, since they aren't likely to be a threat if they're not behind the wheel. But they should permanently forfeit their driving privileges.

 

[woody60707]

I'm in general opposed to ever sending kids to jail. While I understand why the internet is raging, the right thing to do isn't sending more rich kids to jail, but to send less poor kids to jail.

 

[DinoDoc]

Yes, I fully agree that everyone should be judged equally before the law. If this had been a black kid from Dallas drunk driving would we be surprised if he got the full 20 years in prison?

I don't think 20 years in prison is an appropriate penalty in this case. I totally sympathize with the victims and their families - but 20 years basically removes this person from ever being able to be included in society. He'll be out at age 37 and basically unemployable. This is exactly how you design a system to increase recidivism.

As heinous as the crime was, I'd much rather see the person spend far less time in jail -1 year to a 16 year old is like 4 years to someone in middle age. Won't he get enough time to "think about what he's done" if he spends 4 years in prison instead of 20?

All that aside, the real miscarriage here is the overly light sentence. But honestly I'd rather have overly-light sentences than overly harsh ones. All should be applied equally regardless of family wealth, class, color, religion, gender, etc.

You are aware that he'd have been eligible for parole in 2 years, yes?

 

[DinoDoc]

I'm in general opposed to ever sending kids to jail. While I understand why the internet is raging, the right thing to do isn't sending more rich kids to jail, but to send less poor kids to jail.

Should they have sent him to bed without supper?

 

[Archbob]

Send him off to be a soldier in the middle-eastern theatre.

 

[caketastydelish]

That is actually probably your least crazy idea

Putting a smiley doesn't change that you're flaming me, and this kind of thing is the very reason I've been posting here much less lately.

 

[Azurian]

I read this article yesterday, the kid suffered from "affluenza".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affluenza.

A civil suit will probably destroy the family fortune.

 

[Crezth]

I'm totally okay with this defense so long as the parents get his jail time instead.

e: just realized the point you were making, ok

 

[Azurian]

The argument: He did not know the difference between right and wrong because he was no taught consequences.

To be charged with manslaughter or murder, you have to know the difference between right and wrong. I think that is why he wasn't charged criminally. He is going to be punished by a big civil court lawsuit.

 

[Antilogic]

Man, blood alcohol three times the legal limit hours after the incident and severely underage for it, driving a vehicle illegally, mowing down people not to mention the guys in the truck who were wounded, the theft...

Yup. Gotta love this double-standard stuff.

 

[Borachio]

It's all relative. What, pray tell, is the right amount of time for taking 4 lives?

Exactly. I don't have any answer to your question.

It would seem society does, though. People seem generally quite happy for the legal system to set certain tariffs for certain crimes - and then, naturally, complain when they think those tariffs are too harsh or too lenient.

So being a spoiled kid where your parents gave you everything you ever wanted is a legal defense to escape responsibility of your actions? This is a travesty. He should get 20 years in a real prison. Who does he think he is Edward Kennedy?

I don't care that he was only 16, that is old enough to know right from wrong. If at 16 you can't tell right from wrong than society does not need you as part of it. His ruined life in prison would serve as an example for others.

To any decent moral person living with the guilt of taking four lives based on your actions would be debilitating. How would you look at yourself in the mirror every day knowing what you did?

In today's world how do you get that drunk and drive, in fact how do your buddies all hop in the really drunk guy's car and drive away?

Just how far is anyone responsible for their own actions? Especially considering that being drunk clouds a person's judgement, distinctly. Which is the whole idea of getting drunk in the first place, isn't it?

Doesn't the wider society also share responsibility? Don't the parents bear a heavy responsibility for the actions of their children? Shouldn't the people surrounding a drunk person bear some responsibility for not preventing him from driving?

I only have questions. No answers.

 

[Kyriakos]

The psychologist also testified the teen was allowed to drink at a very young age and began driving at 13 years old. Defense attorneys argued Couch needed treatment, not jail and suggested a facility that costs almost half a million dollars a year.

At least the physchologist (hopefully) is not working in that 0.5 million dollars/year facility

Well, i don't like this ruling at all, judging by the article anyway. How did he kill 4 people? Was it during an hour or so? I have to assume it went on for a while cause some passengers were thrown (?) out of the vehicle as well.
Something about the web of the law and large animals.