amadeus
Bishop of Bio-Dome
Respect for what? Iraq's ''kind diplomatic efforts'' to stall the U.S.?
U.S invading and taking out Iraq's Root of Evil - wrong or right??
- Thread starter Sunny
- Start date
ozscott75
Groper of Sand
No, respect for the intelligence of the average citizen of the world.
The US has said, 'we're gonna invade Iraq.' when the rest of the world asked why the US replied, 'Trust us.'
There have been no concrete reasons given for invasion, yet the US wants the support of the rest of the world.
If the US wants to invade, do it. No-one can stop you. But if you want world support, you have to let us in on the secrets.
WMD = a joke, the largest manufacturer and holder of WMD is the US.
Sunny
Empire Builder
1 and 2. The U.N should ...
- you Americans seem to fail to see the diffrence between U.N forces attacking (with U.S forces included) and U.S forces attacking Iraq. There´s a diffrence you know ....
3. I believe you´re thinking of the Kurds, that´s a hole other issue, they are an oppressed minority in Iraq. Otherwise I agree with you, don´t think the people of Iraq would stand a chance againts Saddams forces ... and I´m not sure if there´s a majority amongst the iraqi people wanting to overtrow Saddam.
As to the "other countries issue", I believe the US have handled the "invading their neighbors"-issue once (Gulf War) and that´s not the reason for attacking Iraq today.
As for your "U.S sanctions" argument I don´t give much ....
Once again, there is a difference between U.N and U.S sanctions ....
What remains are the "starving your people"-argument which I again don't see as a U.S reason for attacking ....
I don't have to make a list (since it would be to long and is not relevant to the thread) over dictantors in other countries starving their people ....
BTW, I think there will be many crying children too if the U.S starts dropping those (missguided) bombs on civilian targets in Iraq ....
bobgote
Trousers
Mmm too true. There are some with opinions to strong to be swayed by reason and logic. I may dislike america, but i will concede a point if convincing argument is made.
Did anyone say anything about hating america? I must've missed it. (For this next bit, I'm assuming from your sudden defensiveness that you are an american yourself). Americans seem to think people are envious of them. This is hardly the case. What you have, few want. I would go into detail (yet again) but I don't want to waste my time, or that of the people who've read it all before.
Anyway, point is, I can't recall a time america did something out of the goodness of it's heart. IMO there's always an alterior motive.
Also, sure, Saddam's a loon, but so are many other world leaders.
G-Man
A One Man's War
Do you expect the US to defend Israel AFTER it's nuked?
Anyway I'm not saying the US should invade Iraq because Israel would like it, but because Saddam is a threat to Israel's existence and to Turkey, Egypt and Jordan's pro western policies. Saddam has proven himself to be a madman. The US isn't obligated to keep the ME as stable as possible, and it's not Israel's war, it's a war the Americans should do if THEY want to keep being a major force in the ME, if THEY want to keep Saddam from attacking their allies and if THEY want to prevent a possible nuclear war.
amadeus
Bishop of Bio-Dome
Of course, ozscott sees "defense" as waiting until your country has been eradicated before you do something to stop them...
Should ? USA HAS TO do this , because the entire world is waiting to share the Iraq : someone would prefer to have a warbase there(guess who), someone wants to share their oil sources(guess who), someone will have an expectation of building their own country(Curds)
Should ? USA HAS TO do this , because the entire world is waiting to share the Iraq : someone would prefer to have a warbase there(guess who), someone wants to share their oil sources(guess who), someone will have an expectation of building their own country(Curds)
Iraq should be eviscerated!
As a message to the rest of mid-east and other nations that share their cultural similarities! This is what happens when you pick a fight with the west.
The US should encourage support from nations that can be trusted to back up words of support, with action. Rules most of nations of the EU out in my opinion.
If you (meaning the respective nations) want to stand by and say it's not our problem, or whine it's all about oil go ahead.
This doesn't change or stop the fact; Saddam is trying to develop nulcuer weapons.
Given the fact he targeted Israel in the past, with scuds. I have no doubt he would try it with a nuke missile.
To borrow a line from Overkill [The Years of Decay] - It's time to to kill!
As a message to the rest of mid-east and other nations that share their cultural similarities! This is what happens when you pick a fight with the west.
The US should encourage support from nations that can be trusted to back up words of support, with action. Rules most of nations of the EU out in my opinion.
If you (meaning the respective nations) want to stand by and say it's not our problem, or whine it's all about oil go ahead.
This doesn't change or stop the fact; Saddam is trying to develop nulcuer weapons.
Given the fact he targeted Israel in the past, with scuds. I have no doubt he would try it with a nuke missile.
To borrow a line from Overkill [The Years of Decay] - It's time to to kill!
amadeus
Bishop of Bio-Dome
I'll give you a hint.
Boom.
Boom.
Q.Why do the people in the middle- east hate America so much?
(honest question)
I here what you are saying rmsharpe,
I'm not anti-Americian at all. I lived ther for two years, travelled all over the country, and loved the people and everything about it.
I understand the postion America holds in the modern world,(which can be mistaken as arrgance).
Although some times i think they fight with a double edged sword.
P.S peace to all.
(honest question)
I here what you are saying rmsharpe,
I'm not anti-Americian at all. I lived ther for two years, travelled all over the country, and loved the people and everything about it.
I understand the postion America holds in the modern world,(which can be mistaken as arrgance).
Although some times i think they fight with a double edged sword.
P.S peace to all.
omichyron
Highly-Pixelated Globe
Morally, I think America has as much of a right to attack Iraq as they do anyone (take that how you want). In actuality, the chances that chemical or biological weapons of some sort could be released mean that the US must be very careful when doing such a thing.
Switch625
I don't care.
First off, welcome to CFC!
Now, to your question.
That's such a large question that I don't think there is an adequate answer for it.
Some "suggestions" I have heard over the years are:
1) Jealousy.
2) Envy.
3) Fear.
4) Revenge.
5) US support of Israel.
Plus others that I can't think of right now. None of these answers are right. You can see elements of all these reasons, but it isn't that simple. There is a huge gap in understanding between the average guy on the street over there and the West. To the typical Moslem, who's only education comes from the Qu'ran, the lifestyle of the western nations is alien. We might as well be from another planet as far as they are concerned.
For example, look at the way they treat women. To our hypothetical Moslem Everyman, it is absolutely normal for women to be treated like that. Forced to hide behind veils and robes, forbidden education, forbidden to move about in public unescorted and forbidden every other freedom and right that the men take for granted. A woman is little more than a head of cattle. It's normal, expected, and (most importantly) it's required by their religion.* Now, they see the freedoms women have in the west and see it as a fundamental threat to their way of life. After all, if their women see how western women live, they might start getting ideas. So, we become an evil affront to Allah that must be destroyed.
That is just one example, not a whole explanation, but I think you see where I am going here.
* I know that according to the Qu'ran it really isn't, but the fundamentalism that is so pervasive over there these days says it is, so it might as well be.
This time i don't think we are going to have a large coalition to invade Iraq.
Just like the gulf war, we start bombing the crap out of the Iraqi army and destroy their airforce they'll give up.
In the gulf war we didn't have alot of smart-bombs. I think 90% of our bombs were dummy bombs.
When we invade Iraq and take 'So Damn Insane' out of power, nothing is going to come back and haunt us.
Oh and i do remember that US Intelligence found out that one of the 9/11 hijackers met with an Iraqi official in Belgrade(i think thats the city)....and i believe Iraqi backed Al-Qaeda.
The g'ment has already stated that they are going to need to draft between 150,000 and 200,000 people for the war.
Our mistake in the Gulf War was not taking out Saddam then.
This time around when we invade and Saddam launches Scud's at Israel i bet my money that Israel is going to jump on Iraq's ass so hard...best of luck to us and the british when we go into Iraq.
It isn't, if its going to happen, its when its going to happen. We're going to invade Iraq and take out Saddam and there's not going to be an repercussion's. And Israel's going to jump on Iraq's ass if Saddam hits them with Scud's its that simple.
Go USA! 
Just like the gulf war, we start bombing the crap out of the Iraqi army and destroy their airforce they'll give up.
In the gulf war we didn't have alot of smart-bombs. I think 90% of our bombs were dummy bombs.
When we invade Iraq and take 'So Damn Insane' out of power, nothing is going to come back and haunt us.
Oh and i do remember that US Intelligence found out that one of the 9/11 hijackers met with an Iraqi official in Belgrade(i think thats the city)....and i believe Iraqi backed Al-Qaeda.
The g'ment has already stated that they are going to need to draft between 150,000 and 200,000 people for the war.
Our mistake in the Gulf War was not taking out Saddam then.
This time around when we invade and Saddam launches Scud's at Israel i bet my money that Israel is going to jump on Iraq's ass so hard...best of luck to us and the british when we go into Iraq.
It isn't, if its going to happen, its when its going to happen. We're going to invade Iraq and take out Saddam and there's not going to be an repercussion's. And Israel's going to jump on Iraq's ass if Saddam hits them with Scud's its that simple.
Go USA! 
Mad Bomber
Commander
Sun Tzu:
1) Yes 90% of the boms were "dumb" boms as opposed to 10% that were "smart". However we dropped very few "dummy" bombs. "dumb" bombs are simply unguided munitions whereas "dummy" are refered to as practice munitions or dud's (unexpoloded ordinance)
2) The reason the USA did not take down Saddam in '91 is that we PROMISED the coalition (namely the Saudies, UAE,, Syria, & Egypt) that regime change was NOT a goal of the invasion. This promise given by GHWB enabled us to use the bases in Saudi Arabia & Turkey.
3) Finally, if a war between US & Iraq does happen & Israel were to be dragged into it, most of the Moslem countries would then side with Iraq and may lead to WW3. So WE (the US) have to think HARD before we decide that we must take this course of action.
1) Yes 90% of the boms were "dumb" boms as opposed to 10% that were "smart". However we dropped very few "dummy" bombs. "dumb" bombs are simply unguided munitions whereas "dummy" are refered to as practice munitions or dud's (unexpoloded ordinance)
2) The reason the USA did not take down Saddam in '91 is that we PROMISED the coalition (namely the Saudies, UAE,, Syria, & Egypt) that regime change was NOT a goal of the invasion. This promise given by GHWB enabled us to use the bases in Saudi Arabia & Turkey.
3) Finally, if a war between US & Iraq does happen & Israel were to be dragged into it, most of the Moslem countries would then side with Iraq and may lead to WW3. So WE (the US) have to think HARD before we decide that we must take this course of action.
Mad Bomber
Commander
Israel may be able to handle the moslem countries, but only with an enormous strain to their military. Think ww3 is impossible? Let's see... Russia just announced it will resume trading with Iraq, violating UN sanctions, if US invades will Russia back Iraq? Also while we are involved with Iraq, North Korea may decide that the timing is right to end the independence of South Korea, possibly backed by China, Vietnam & Malysia? With India on the brink of war with Packistan already & operations continuing in the Balkans & Afghanistan, US forces may be stretched to the breaking point. Germany had the best army in the world during ww2, but they spread their forces too thin, took on too many enemies at once & LOST. I do not want to see those mistakes commited by a Gung-ho US president who did not bother to assess the possible consequences of his decisions. I'm not saying that its impossible to invade Iraq unilaterally, but we need to step back and assess the consequences of doing so.
Never Underestimate your enemy (or those whom might be your enemies).
Never Underestimate your enemy (or those whom might be your enemies).
why in the hell would Vietnam and Malaysia back North Korea in invading South Korea???????
lol Don't compare Nazi Germany's army to the US armed forces. There's no comparison due to a "small change in technology". lol
Do you really think Russia would go to war over Iraq? There would be no point. How much money would russia get from trading with Iraq?
the US is pulling out alot of our forces in the Balkans.
We have a thing called the draft. If our ground troops ever get strained they'll start the draft.
Why is it that most of the people on this forum have a "oh my god, its the end of the world" attitude about every single thing?
No offence, but the 'What If' factor that you just wrote is a little bit to..hollywood.
Maybe that would happen in a movie
lol Don't compare Nazi Germany's army to the US armed forces. There's no comparison due to a "small change in technology". lol
Do you really think Russia would go to war over Iraq? There would be no point. How much money would russia get from trading with Iraq?
the US is pulling out alot of our forces in the Balkans.
We have a thing called the draft. If our ground troops ever get strained they'll start the draft.
Why is it that most of the people on this forum have a "oh my god, its the end of the world" attitude about every single thing?
No offence, but the 'What If' factor that you just wrote is a little bit to..hollywood.
Maybe that would happen in a movie
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