v21 bugs and crashes

[Koshling]

A few minor things I noticed that could use some tweaking:

1. The Demographics screen needs some recalibration regarding the Soldier numbers. I don't think 400 population can support 104,000 soldiers.

View attachment 315355

The population reported is incorrect. When you look at the city population (not size) you see a number that scales very non-linearly from city raw size. However, this screen (I think - need to check the code sometime) just totals the raw city sizes. It needs to total the converted population numbers. It's cosmetic, so not something I am going to regard as a priority, but I doubt it's terribly hard to address.

Edit - I take it back. Population is fine. As you initially stated, it's early troop numbers that are amiss.

Edit 2 - it's actually rather hard to address, since the number reported as 'soldiers' is actually 'Power' for the civ in question. This is made up of contributions from population, buildings, and units which are hard to untangle. Not going to mess with it for now. Simplest solution would be to just rename the row 'Power' rather than 'Soldiers' (it's called Power on the graphs tab already).

 

[Korvac]

I have put a fix for this on the SVN.

Do I have to download and figure out how to use the SVN for these changes, or would downloading the latest patch work? Also if I do use the SVN, would my individual alterations be wiped out? I tend to make some changes on my own like taking away obsolete techs from wonders and altering leader traits.

 

[Koshling]

Do I have to download and figure out how to use the SVN for these changes, or would downloading the latest patch work? Also if I do use the SVN, would my individual alterations be wiped out? I tend to make some changes on my own like taking away obsolete techs from wonders and altering leader traits.

Since it's not in the DLL (which is the only thing we issue patches for) that would not help, so it's SVN or wait for v22 I'm afraid. Also, since the SVN updates everything, yes you'd loose any perosnalized changes unless you made copies first and put them back/merged them in afterwards.

 

[BlueTemplar]

Ok. Arbitrary sizes suck though whatever. [For water units] Scaling with map size (not to mention map generation algorithms) make them something of a lottery. We can do something more sensible pretty easily.

With forts serving as canals for ships neither arbitrary sizes nor scaling sizes are a good idea, only if the inner seas can (or are worth to) be connected or not to the main ocean matters (IIRC you can't build a "fort canal" longer than two squares, right?).

And even in the small seas like in my screenshot (but that you can't connect to the main ocean) building boats might serve a purpose : ferrying units (for speed or to bypass an enemy blockade) or invading/bombarding an enemy coastal city "on the other side of the lake". Though I don't really expect you to be able (or just have the time) to code an AI able to understand those subtler uses of water units...

rev 1967 :
When fighting crocodiles, big splashes of blood the whole screen appear filling the whole screen for a split second. It might be a funny "battle feature" instead of a bug, but why does it only happen with crocodiles?

 

[Sgtslick]

Why are you turning off JCs? I've worked hard with DH's help to keep JCs a viable Tile option instead of allowing "idiot" workers to chop them all down! Grrrrr....

The double listing needs fixed. But turning JCs Off weakens the "choices" you have for tile improvements. :/

JosEPh <sigh>

hehe JC fan i see.

I like to restrict automated workers alot. Otherwise i find they sometimes replace improvements in a loop, such as cottage/farm/cottage/farm/cottage/farm etc

I turn off cottages, workshops, windmills, jungle camps, burn forest/jungle/bamboo, forts, if I want something special - such as a jungle camp I will build it manually. It just helps me get the most outta my automated workers. It also allows me to turn on (replace existing improvements) if I want to.

 

[Koshling]

With forts serving as canals for ships neither arbitrary sizes nor scaling sizes are a good idea, only if the inner seas can (or are worth to) be connected or not to the main ocean matters (IIRC you can't build a "fort canal" longer than two squares, right?).

And even in the small seas like in my screenshot (but that you can't connect to the main ocean) building boats might serve a purpose : ferrying units (for speed or to bypass an enemy blockade) or invading/bombarding an enemy coastal city "on the other side of the lake". Though I don't really expect you to be able (or just have the time) to code an AI able to understand those subtler uses of water units...

Actually, having it take accoutn of city/fort connections shouldn't be hard, and I intend to include this. Also want to encourage it to build such bridging forts/cities at some point, though that's a slightly separate matter.

 

[Aevum]

I noticed some major trade value discrepencies with resources, Some the bots don't count to be worth Anything, and others they'll give all they own. For instance. Trade with Hannible.
Diamonds, what will you give me. NOTHING.
Gems, what will you give me:
Pinting press, 900 gold, world map, stone, 9 gold per turn, galley, carvel, galley, carvel....which was pretty much all he owned.
Meanwhile, others won't even consider trading elepahnt workers because "they would have nothing to gain."
really? how about $1000? or those techs you keep nagging me for? lol

 

[strategyonly]

I noticed some major trade value discrepencies with resources, Some the bots don't count to be worth Anything, and others they'll give all they own. For instance. Trade with Hannible.
Diamonds, what will you give me. NOTHING.
Gems, what will you give me:
Pinting press, 900 gold, world map, stone, 9 gold per turn, galley, carvel, galley, carvel....which was pretty much all he owned.
Meanwhile, others won't even consider trading elepahnt workers because "they would have nothing to gain."
really? how about $1000? or those techs you keep nagging me for? lol

I hear ya, i had a weird one also, they asked for only 1 worker and gave me an advanced tech, well DUH!!!

 

[Koshling]

I hear ya, i had a weird one also, they asked for only 1 worker and gave me an advanced tech, well DUH!!!

Nice anecdotes in both cases. Worthless without a save game, since the evaluation is highly context sensitive. Probably indicative of bugs though, so if you'd like them looking at you know what I need...

 

[BlueTemplar]

I had even better : they propose to give me some gold (both lump sum and per turn) against nothing, not even a peace treaty!

 

[Aevum]

Nice anecdotes in both cases. Worthless without a save game, since the evaluation is highly context sensitive. Probably indicative of bugs though, so if you'd like them looking at you know what I need...

Yeah this happened last night while playing multi so i was just speeding along. i mean HELL yeah i robbed hannibal blind lol, we bet dinner on our civ games.
I will see if I have a bu save before i traded or if I can get the same reaction, I will then promptly send a save via carrier bear to you.

Also StratOnly attached is 2 amusing tech quotes i just made for an example.

 

[Koshling]

Also StratOnly attached is 2 amusing tech quotes i just made for an example.

Any Arnie quote is a winner for me

I'll be back

 

[Aevum]

Any Arnie quote is a winner for me

I'll be back

YOU DONT SAY......
see attached

 

[JosEPh_II]

hehe JC fan i see.

I like to restrict automated workers alot. Otherwise i find they sometimes replace improvements in a loop, such as cottage/farm/cottage/farm/cottage/farm etc

I turn off cottages, workshops, windmills, jungle camps, burn forest/jungle/bamboo, forts, if I want something special - such as a jungle camp I will build it manually. It just helps me get the most outta my automated workers. It also allows me to turn on (replace existing improvements) if I want to.

Actually I AM the biggest JC fan in the forum. (even though Vincentz made it, I support and push to keep it a viable tile option any and every time and place I can)

Since I never automate my workers for the very reason you listed; the loopy loops, I micro All my workers.

JosEPh

 

[ls612]

Actually I AM the biggest JC fan in the forum. (even though Vincentz made it, I support and push to keep it a viable tile option any and every time and place I can)

Since I never automate my workers for the very reason you listed; the loopy loops, I micro All my workers.

JosEPh

Koshling did a lot of work recently on stupid automate AI, as well as crappy automate performance. I personally set a few of my workers mid to late game to automate route building, as that is a pain to micro and the AI does it OK for the most part.

 

[Koshling]

Koshling did a lot of work recently on stupid automate AI, as well as crappy automate performance. I personally set a few of my workers mid to late game to automate route building, as that is a pain to micro and the AI does it OK for the most part.

lol. I don't trust the worker automation either. I always micro manage my workers. The work I did on them was just performance. It was (AI) city governor AI I worked on recently for functiomality.

 

[strategyonly]

Is this a kind of weird bug,cause this is happening quite a bit lately, not quite equal to each other, IMO?? (trade)

Also what would cause from one savedgame to have a different color than what i get now, its "White" and the Flag lost its white

 

[Koshling]

Is this a kind of weird bug,cause this is happening quite a bit lately, not quite equal to each other, IMO?? (trade)

Also what would cause from one savedgame to have a different color than what i get now, its "White" and the Flag lost its white

Well, you know what I'm going to ask for, otherwise I can't really comment...

 

[BlueTemplar]

I like what you did with the jungle camps!

 

[strategyonly]

Well, you know what I'm going to ask for, otherwise I can't really comment...

ahahah yeah i keep at it dont i. . .