[RD] War in Gaza News: Pas de Deux

[Senethro]

Is it genocide if the casualties are only in the ten thousands? I feel like maybe if they were deliberate perhaps the casualty rate would be in the hundred of thousands. It's been almost a year after all.

This is the wrong subject for your edgy takes.

 

[Lexicus]

The casualties are in the hundreds of thousands, almost certainly.

 

[Joij21]

The casualties are in the hundreds of thousands, almost certainly.

It very well could be...

Has there been any access for journalists to get deep within Gaza? Or are they currently restricted to the UN aid zones?

 

[Lexicus]

I am not sure, in detail. In broad outline, the Zionists have killed, IIRC, 150+ journalists in Gaza.

My guess is that the current death toll is probably around 200,000, but that's a guess. The truth is we have no idea. I am curious what the US intelligence agencies might know, them and the Israelis would probably have the best estimates from e.g. satellite and aerial photos of destruction in the Strip, but I think we could easily see something like a million dead by next summer if the Zionist entity is not stopped.

 

[Bonyduck Campersang]

Copy pasting from the older thread:

US Health Workers Back From Gaza Calculate Death Toll at 92,000 — at a Minimum

Epidemics and famine are raging across Gaza, they said, and at least 37,000 have already died of starvation.

truthout.org

In an appendix to the letter, the medical workers cite statistics and projections from international experts in order to arrive at their estimate of the death toll, which they caution is — like the official death count of 39,000 Palestinians — also likely a vast undercount.
On top of the official death count, the workers say that the death toll from the famine is likely 37,786 people, a calculation based on estimates from reports by the UN-backed Integrated Food Security Phase Classification (IPC) about Gaza and typical death tolls from the levels of hunger the IPC has found in Gaza.
This is far, far higher than the official estimate of 34 people who have died of starvation so far. The vast discrepancy is due to the impossibility of accounting for all starvation deaths, as health officials are only able to count deaths reported by health facilities — many of which are physically out of reach for starving Palestinians, both because they have been severely weakened and because hospitals in Gaza have been overflowing with patients for months.
“All told, it is highly likely that the death toll from starvation matches or even exceeds the death toll from violence in Gaza,” the medical workers said.
The deaths due to Israel’s starvation campaign include babies who only lived for a week before dying, as families have shared with Defense for Children International-Palestine (DCIP) in testimonies published this week. Parents report having to watch their children slowly waste away, completely unable to help them even when they’re admitted to treatment centers.
This includes seven-day-old Abdulaziz Salem, who only knew life in an incubator after dying on March 2 in Kamal Adwan as his mother was also in critical condition. Salem suffered from jaundice and malnutrition during pregnancy before dying of cardiac arrest and lack of oxygen, DCIP said.
“I could not breastfeed my son because I had no food and I became sick,” his mother told DCIP. She said her family was displaced six times while she was pregnant. “There was no oxygen or baby formula in the hospital. My son died, suffocating and hungry.”
The medical workers additionally estimate that Israel’s blockade on medical treatments and attacks on health care workers have killed at least 5,000 Palestinians so far — again, a low estimate, they emphasize as they say with “absolute certainty” that “no small number” of people with medical conditions like cancer or diabetes have died.
These numbers add up to roughly 92,000 people — roughly 4.2 percent of the entire population of Gaza. The estimates of the death toll don’t include the thousands of Palestinians missing and presumed dead under the rubble.
As the letter says, this is still likely much lower than the true death toll. The medical workers reference a recent estimate from an editorial published in medical journal The Lancet in which public health experts said that, going off death tolls from similar modern conflicts and massacres, the true death toll of Palestinians could be 186,000. This, too, is a low estimate, the researchers said.

 

[Broken_Erika]

American activist shot dead in occupied West Bank​

A 26-year-old American woman has been shot dead in the occupied West Bank during a protest.
Aysenur Ezgi Eygi, who is of Turkish descent, is reported to have been taking part in a protest against Jewish settlement expansion in the town of Beita near Nablus.
Ms Ezgi Eygi was allegedly shot by Israeli troops, according to local media reports. The Israel Defense Forces (IDF) say they are aware of the incident and looking into it.
The American activist was rushed to a hospital in Nablus with a gunshot to the head and was later pronounced dead, AFP news agency reported.

According to reports by Palestinian media, the 26-year-old had been involved in a campaign to protect farmers from Israeli settler violence.
It comes after Israeli forces withdrew from Jenin city and its refugee camp in the occupied West Bank, following a major nine-day operation there.
During the operation, at least 36 Palestinians were killed - 21 from Jenin governorate - the Palestinian health ministry says. Most of the dead have been claimed by armed groups as members, but the ministry says children are also among those killed.
In the past 50 years, Israel has built settlements in the West Bank and East Jerusalem, where more than 700,000 Jews now live.
Settlements are held to be illegal under international law - that is the position of the UN Security Council and the UK government, among others - although Israel rejects this.
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cdx6771gyqzo

 

[Lexicus]

“The United States has shown that we have a long memory when it comes to bringing to justice those responsible for the deaths of American citizens"

-Matthew Miller, US State Department

 

[r16]

mavi Marmara Incident . 8 ships , 32 nationalties , 663 people . Ex-Marine Kenneth O'Keefe organizes the first resistance , humiliates the Israelis . 2nd helicopter comes shooting . 9 Turkish citizens are killed immediately , one more will die after 4 years in a coma . At least two are patently executed . Like the one US citizen killed there , a 19 years old filming with a cell phone or camera . His family sues Ehud Barak in the US courts , the case is rejected after the 20 million dollars deal between New Turkey and Israel , with the attendant attempt to delay the payment to the families for income for others ...

as the woman's head is not covered , it is like basically only the US that will seek justice . Don't mind me if ı say ı don't believe this American person up above .

like 10 deaths , all Turkish , with clear signs of hunting .

 

[Ordnael]

Is referring to Israeli people, affairs, state with the zion appellation akin to nazis dehumanizing their "enemies" through words?
I feel like the zion thingy is being tossed around has a bad connotation, a dirty word for jews, when discussing this war.
Are the Israeli people to be blamed by the actions of Netaniahu's cabinet?

 

[r16]

they are intentionally shooting people , saying "do anything if you can" . Nazis have been ... which is the subject of multiple conspiracies . That there is actual Nazis and their Arab/Muslim partners all over the world should not [be] a justification for Tel Aviv [to] do whatever it pleases . If stuff that happens Africa or some random poor place is against Human Rights and justifies intervention the very same thing that happens in Israeli occupied territories should be the same .

edit: The prepositions eaten by the tablet added in brackets . My English is not that bad .

 

[Gorbles]

Is referring to Israeli people, affairs, state with the zion appellation akin to nazis dehumanizing their "enemies" through words?
I feel like the zion thingy is being tossed around has a bad connotation, a dirty word for jews, when discussing this war.
Are the Israeli people to be blamed by the actions of Netaniahu's cabinet?

"Zionist" is a term used by actual Jewish people who have a specific set of beliefs. You will also see people on social media proudly calling themselves such. It in fact draws a distinction between "Zionist" and "Jewish". This ensures that - unless the person in question is asking questions in order to learn - that anyone intentionally conflating the two tends to be doing so in bad faith.

 

[r16]

that Leftists and Islamists are "bad as" Nazis does not justify "Zionists" conduct an ethnic cleansing in Occupied Palestine .

plus them actual Zionists would have been hounded out of Israel by those of Jews who are supporting the ethnic cleansing . For not being "bad enough" .

 

[Lexicus]

Are the Israeli people to be blamed by the actions of Netaniahu's cabinet?

He's been prime minister for 20 of the last 28 years - who do you think keeps voting him in?

 

[banzay13]

One is the World Zionist Organization (WZO), an international body founded more than a century ago and instrumental in the establishment of the state of Israel. It has a Settlement Division - responsible for managing large areas of the land occupied by Israel since 1967. The division is funded entirely by Israeli public funds and describes itself as an “arm of the Israeli state”.

Israeli outpost settlers rapidly seizing West Bank land

There has been a sharp rise in extremist Israeli settlers taking land from Palestinians, analysis shows.

www.bbc.com

 

[r16]

the new school year starts on Monday . The first lesson in all grades will be one called The Defence of the Country from Çanakkale to Gazze . The founding myth of the Republic starts with the 1915 Gallipoli campaign and it is only natural that would be attacked . Nobody can actually tell that Kemal was a cadet of brilliant prospects when von der Goltz had heard about it and had his name written down for a "neutral position" of being the top commander of all Ottoman Armies in later years . When he "matured" for the job . As part of the German general's bid to create a "better" Ottoman Empire as an equal of the German Reich against the daunting modernization of the Tsarist Russia and even more fear inspiring financial power of Great Britain ... A capable ally that could really help Germans out of tight spots . That's why Kemal was always in trouble , because Ittihad was not ready to touch the real political lepers ; they didn't know the true extent of support von der Goltz had in Berlin . Which was barely above zero , but von der Goltz was bluffing superbly against both Berlin and Ittihad . Kemal was exiled after the Balkan Wars , having survived Enver's plot of career ruination with enough evidence of sorts . Was re-called to a "back water" to train an additional division for the military force the Ittihad was equipping as a bargaining tool to enter the Great War . If you ignore the pro-German Enver , Ittihad tried very hard to join the war against Germany , thinking Greece would join the attacks against Serbia on the side of the Central Powers . Kemal would never have been Atatürk , he would remain as a quaint subversive who demanded Ottoman Empire to become a Republic , quite vocally for the times .

then , you know , the Allies decided to attack . Kemal's proven leadership abilities , starting with Gallipoli , is how he became the JUST ONE SINGLE PERSON who could command the 1919-22 War of Liberation . Say , none of those people who had profitted from various Armenian stuff after 1915 ever volunteered to replace him . Before he commanded the war effort and defeated everyone , to say in a manner of speech . Being the neutral moderate and whatnot ; von der Goltz had died in '16 but the bluff was good .

all this is necessary to understand the oft quoted but wrong claim that the Jews established 2 states in the 20th Century and the second was Israel .

as the anti-Çanakkale effort has mutated . Instead of claiming Mustafa Kemal was just a division commander , under the orders of so many other generals and thus he stole the victory of law abiding faithful Muslims , the story now becomes one where Syrians saved this country in 1915 . There were Arab troops in the area , it is true .

there still would have been not much of problem . If one could believe the first lesson would be about how NATIONS defend their country . New Turkey is the newest Arab nation , welcoming everyone and everybody as long as he/she is not a Turk ; the drift will clearly be one where Palestians supporting Muslim Brotherhood are true Muslims , so they are our brothers , so they and we are one Nation , we as a Nation can't fight in Gazze if New Turkey is Israel's biggest trading partner , we can show our anger only by "resisting" against Israel's proxies , the Turks are such and suddenly Ihvan replaces even New Turkey and we Turks are no more .

gazze is not Turkish territory . Doesn't make us forget there is a visible ethnic cleansing in Gazze , and a not so visible ethnic cleansing in West Bank .

much negative reports about Gen Z . Upto 90% of them is likely not to listen at all to Monday's lesson . 50% of teachers is unlikely to be serious in giving the lesson .

then Israel shoots an American citizen . A member of something translated as Seattle Socialist Initiative and an anti-Trumper . Reportedly working for the same organization Rachel Corrie was . You know , so that 90% of schoolkids will have a deeper understanding of New Turkey claims that Israelis consider the rest of Humanity as pack animals and deserve no kindness and Ihvan people are our brothers ...

diplomacy is talking nicely . Benjamin Netanyahu is an eventual product of the 1973 war . Meaning Moshe Dayan will not be able to tell Netanyahu that his thing about having some random person murdered to increase the quality of a lesson in the country of major personal trading partners so that he could drive all the Palestinians out to a country that would take them is 'ing stupid .

yes , we will see how much vengeance the US State Department will wreak upon Israel . Which in itself is an attempt to improve the quality of the said lesson .

 

[E.man]

Is referring to Israeli people, affairs, state with the zion appellation akin to nazis dehumanizing their "enemies" through words?
I feel like the zion thingy is being tossed around has a bad connotation, a dirty word for jews, when discussing this war.
Are the Israeli people to be blamed by the actions of Netaniahu's cabinet?

No and yes.

No Zionist is not an invented insult. It has a disinct and valid meaning you can look up. If it's got a bad reputation that's on them.

Yes, Israel likes to proclaim its a democracy so Israelis voted in such a way they keep getting Netanyahu.

 

[E.man]

American activist shot dead in occupied West Bank​

A 26-year-old American woman has been shot dead in the occupied West Bank during a protest.
Aysenur Ezgi Eygi, who is of Turkish descent, is reported to have been taking part in a protest against Jewish settlement expansion in the town of Beita near Nablus.
Ms Ezgi Eygi was allegedly shot by Israeli troops, according to local media reports. The Israel Defense Forces (IDF) say they are aware of the incident and looking into it.
The American activist was rushed to a hospital in Nablus with a gunshot to the head and was later pronounced dead, AFP news agency reported.

According to reports by Palestinian media, the 26-year-old had been involved in a campaign to protect farmers from Israeli settler violence.
It comes after Israeli forces withdrew from Jenin city and its refugee camp in the occupied West Bank, following a major nine-day operation there.
During the operation, at least 36 Palestinians were killed - 21 from Jenin governorate - the Palestinian health ministry says. Most of the dead have been claimed by armed groups as members, but the ministry says children are also among those killed.
In the past 50 years, Israel has built settlements in the West Bank and East Jerusalem, where more than 700,000 Jews now live.
Settlements are held to be illegal under international law - that is the position of the UN Security Council and the UK government, among others - although Israel rejects this.
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cdx6771gyqzo

Illegally taking more and more all the time. Zionist settlers burning Palestinian homes and cars and attacking them and then IDF goes and shoots anyone in the head who protests. Is it any wonder there's an opposition?

 

[Klaus Hergersheimer]

No and yes.

No Zionist is not an invented insult. It has a disinct and valid meaning you can look up. If it's got a bad reputation that's on them.

Yes, Israel likes to proclaim its a democracy so Israelis voted in such a way they keep getting Netanyahu.

The term used above was not "Zionist" but specifically "Zionist entity", a phrase used by some Israel critics used to cast doubt on its statehood. That I know of, no one who thinks Israel is a country with diplomatic recognition actually uses it, but I imagine some posters here like to use it to somehow differentiate political sides within Israel itself, a point of view I'm not exactly confident its more frequent users intend for it...

Legitimacy of the State of Israel - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Personally I first heard it when the former Iran leader Mahmoud Ahmedinejad (sp?) visited Columbia University (?) to give some talk and not once actually called Israel "Israel" but an "entity", a point I found odd but I imagine is actually widely accepted in that part of the world. This was in the mid-late 2000s.

 

[Lexicus]

The term used above was not "Zionist" but specifically "Zionist entity", a phrase used by some Israel critics used to cast doubt on its statehood. That I know of, no one who thinks Israel is a country with diplomatic recognition actually uses it, but I imagine some posters here like to use it to somehow differentiate political sides within Israel itself, a point of view I'm not exactly confident its more frequent users intend for it...

Legitimacy of the State of Israel - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Personally I first heard it when the former Iran leader Mahmoud Ahmedinejad (sp?) visited Columbia University (?) to give some talk and not once actually called Israel "Israel" but an "entity", a point I found odd but I imagine is actually widely accepted in that part of the world. This was in the mid-late 2000s.

The so-called "state of Israel" is a criminal occupation of Palestine by terrorists, hope this helps

 

[Yeekim]

The so-called "state of Israel" is a criminal occupation of Palestine by terrorists, hope this helps

As of 2022, 28 of the 193 UN member states do not recognize Israeli sovereignty; the Muslim world accounts for 25 of the 28 non-recognizing countries, with Cuba, North Korea, and Venezuela representing the remainder.

The company you keep does not give you any pause?