civver_764
Deity
No it's not 'obviously' fake, and your emotional response hurts your credibility. Why not present the counter evidence and let it speak for itself instead of using language like this?
What if your race is the dumbest of them all?
- Thread starter Ryika
- Start date
^TBH, civver, claiming that most sub-saharan countries have an average IQ of... >70... (!) seems a bit suspect/unreal.
The stuff in Europe, US, and far east, also look ridiculous. I can personally note the glaring bizzareness in the case of England, and Greece being so much lower than most of western Europe seems falsified too, given virtually all people here go to university and greek students routinely win pan-euro contests in science and/or become members of foreign uni faculties. Compare with England, where many do not even attend uni (granted, this can be for other reasons too, eg working class culture and/or unis not being free in England).
The stuff in Europe, US, and far east, also look ridiculous. I can personally note the glaring bizzareness in the case of England, and Greece being so much lower than most of western Europe seems falsified too, given virtually all people here go to university and greek students routinely win pan-euro contests in science and/or become members of foreign uni faculties. Compare with England, where many do not even attend uni (granted, this can be for other reasons too, eg working class culture and/or unis not being free in England).
civver_764
Deity
I wasn't making any claims, simply presenting the data.
Ryika
Lazy Wannabe Artista
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Just shows that university is worthless as a tool for IQ-building.
Ryika
Lazy Wannabe Artista
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No, Unis are fine, their purpose is just not there to increase your IQ, it's to get you the information you need for advanced jobs. As such, the amount of people going to University really doesn't tell you much about the intelligence of the people in the country, for that, how good the basic schools are, is most likely a much more important factor.I know. We should close unis and open IQ centers
Also, Greece can't be that intelligent, if they were, they'd not need payments from the EU all the time!
Archon_Wing
Vote for me or die
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"If you're so smart, why are you the one giving me money?"
Ryika
Lazy Wannabe Artista
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And I accept your surrender.^If you want to trade cheap shots, i can remind you of being a teen and thus not knowing what you are talking about.
But i won't do it, and will move on
- Ramsay Bolton
bernie14
Filter Manipulator
or that one is better or superior..... are you a social darwinist?.... thats the point.....do you think it is more acceptable to say "there may be cognitive differences among descendants of ancestral populations that have been scientifically corroborated by genetic studies"? because a racist is just going to take that as "yeah...science just proved that black people be stupid"...
yung.carl.jung
Hey Bird! I'm Morose & Lugubrious
yung.carl.jung
Hey Bird! I'm Morose & Lugubrious
Sorry everyone for the necro, but this was very much needed. We have to clear this up, I cannot let this stand as "fact". First off, let us examine the source of this IQ map:
These numbers came from a work carried out from 2002 to 2006 by Richard Lynn, a British Professor of Psychology, and Tatu Vanhanen, a Finnish Professor of Political Science, who conducted IQ studies in more than 80 countries.
Richard and Tatu argues that differences in national income are correlated with differences in the average national intelligence quotient (IQ). They further argue that differences in average national IQs constitute one important factor, but not the only one, contributing to differences in national wealth and rates of economic growth.
These results are controversial and have caused much debate, they must be interpreted with extreme caution.
Sources:
“IQ and global inequality” is a book written by psychologist Richard Lynn and political scientist
Tatu Vanhanen. It was published in 2006 as a follow-up to 2002s “IQ and the Wealth of Nations”. It
deals with global EQ in relation to economic development. Flynn and Vanhanen develop the thesis,
that countries with a higher average intelligence score generally develop stronger economies (Lynn
and Vanhanen 2006). The average IQ of a nation is shown in relation to a British mean of 100 with
a standard variation of 15. I will focus on one key aspect of the book which brought the authors a
lot of criticism: The average IQ of sub-Saharan nations. Lynn has been publishing on this topic
since the 1970s, a lot of his research material has been cited in the 1994 book “The Bell Curve” by
psychologist Richard J. Hernnstein, which has been both praised and strongly criticised by U.S.
American academia, among others Noam Chomsky (Chomsky 1972). Throughout multiple
publications Lynn arrives at an average IQ of 68 or 67 for Africans living in sub-Saharan countries
(Lynn and Vanhanen 2006). As a comparison, predominantly “white” countries all scored above 100
and “east-Asian” countries score even higher on average (Lynn and Vanhanen 2006).
(me)
One of the most pragmatic responses to Lynn's body of work was published by three
researchers from the Dutch University of Amsterdam in the year 2010. Under the name of
“A systematic literature review of the average IQ of sub-saharan Africans” the team consisting of
Jelte M. Wicherts, Conor V. Dolan and Han L.J. Van der Maas analysed data of African students
performing on a multitude of different IQ tests. They arrive at an average of 82 (Wicherts, Dolan
and Van der Maas 2010). They also criticise his methodology:
(me again)
"For instance, Lynn and Vanhanen (2006) accorded a national IQ of 69 to Nigeria on the
basis of three samples (Fahrmeier, 1975; Ferron, 1965; Wober, 1969), but they did not
consider other relevant published studies that indicated that average IQ in Nigeria is
considerably higher than 70 (Maqsud, 1980a,b; Nenty & Dinero, 1981; Okunrotifa, 1976).
DISCUSSING LYNN'S WORKS ON RACE IN RELATION TO IQ 6
As Lynn rightly remarked during the 2006 conference of the International Society for
Intelligence Research (ISIR), performing a literature review involves making a lot of
choices. Nonetheless, an important drawback of Lynn (and Vanhanen)'s reviews of the
literature is that they are unsystematic.” (Wicherts et al, 2010)
Lynn decided to respond directly and published “The average IQ of sub-Saharan African:
Comments on Wicherts, Dolan and van der Maas” together with Gerhard Meisenberg. In this paper,
Lynn criticises the sampling of the trio (Lynn and Meisenberg 2010). He goes on to say that the IQ
tests they reviewed were carefully picked and that the students in question were elite students and
therefore not representative (Lynn & Meisenberg 2010). Lynn lists sources that focus heavily on
mathematical and reading ability and arrives at the same average of 68. He foregoes the Progressive
Matrices test developed by John C. Raven, a multiple choice test that focus on the reasoning of the
test-taker (Raven 1936). In the Raven test, sub-Saharan Africans scored notably better.
In February 2010 the three researchers from the University of Amsterdam replied yet
again in a paper titled “Another failure to replicate Lynn's estimate of an average IQ of sub
Saharan Africans”. They take note of Lynn's criticism and instead use a cluster of random samples
this time, yet arrive at the same average of 82. (Wicherts et al 2010). They criticise Lynn's
methodology and his conscious omitting of unfavourable data. (Wicherts et al 2010). There has yet
to come a direct response from Lynn."
(me again, sorry for the masturbatory post, but this saves a lot of work)
These numbers came from a work carried out from 2002 to 2006 by Richard Lynn, a British Professor of Psychology, and Tatu Vanhanen, a Finnish Professor of Political Science, who conducted IQ studies in more than 80 countries.
Richard and Tatu argues that differences in national income are correlated with differences in the average national intelligence quotient (IQ). They further argue that differences in average national IQs constitute one important factor, but not the only one, contributing to differences in national wealth and rates of economic growth.
These results are controversial and have caused much debate, they must be interpreted with extreme caution.
Sources:
- IQ and the Wealth of Nations (2006)
- IQ and Global Inequality (2002)
- Studies of national cognitive ability (Wikiwand)
“IQ and global inequality” is a book written by psychologist Richard Lynn and political scientist
Tatu Vanhanen. It was published in 2006 as a follow-up to 2002s “IQ and the Wealth of Nations”. It
deals with global EQ in relation to economic development. Flynn and Vanhanen develop the thesis,
that countries with a higher average intelligence score generally develop stronger economies (Lynn
and Vanhanen 2006). The average IQ of a nation is shown in relation to a British mean of 100 with
a standard variation of 15. I will focus on one key aspect of the book which brought the authors a
lot of criticism: The average IQ of sub-Saharan nations. Lynn has been publishing on this topic
since the 1970s, a lot of his research material has been cited in the 1994 book “The Bell Curve” by
psychologist Richard J. Hernnstein, which has been both praised and strongly criticised by U.S.
American academia, among others Noam Chomsky (Chomsky 1972). Throughout multiple
publications Lynn arrives at an average IQ of 68 or 67 for Africans living in sub-Saharan countries
(Lynn and Vanhanen 2006). As a comparison, predominantly “white” countries all scored above 100
and “east-Asian” countries score even higher on average (Lynn and Vanhanen 2006).
(me)
One of the most pragmatic responses to Lynn's body of work was published by three
researchers from the Dutch University of Amsterdam in the year 2010. Under the name of
“A systematic literature review of the average IQ of sub-saharan Africans” the team consisting of
Jelte M. Wicherts, Conor V. Dolan and Han L.J. Van der Maas analysed data of African students
performing on a multitude of different IQ tests. They arrive at an average of 82 (Wicherts, Dolan
and Van der Maas 2010). They also criticise his methodology:
(me again)
"For instance, Lynn and Vanhanen (2006) accorded a national IQ of 69 to Nigeria on the
basis of three samples (Fahrmeier, 1975; Ferron, 1965; Wober, 1969), but they did not
consider other relevant published studies that indicated that average IQ in Nigeria is
considerably higher than 70 (Maqsud, 1980a,b; Nenty & Dinero, 1981; Okunrotifa, 1976).
DISCUSSING LYNN'S WORKS ON RACE IN RELATION TO IQ 6
As Lynn rightly remarked during the 2006 conference of the International Society for
Intelligence Research (ISIR), performing a literature review involves making a lot of
choices. Nonetheless, an important drawback of Lynn (and Vanhanen)'s reviews of the
literature is that they are unsystematic.” (Wicherts et al, 2010)
Lynn decided to respond directly and published “The average IQ of sub-Saharan African:
Comments on Wicherts, Dolan and van der Maas” together with Gerhard Meisenberg. In this paper,
Lynn criticises the sampling of the trio (Lynn and Meisenberg 2010). He goes on to say that the IQ
tests they reviewed were carefully picked and that the students in question were elite students and
therefore not representative (Lynn & Meisenberg 2010). Lynn lists sources that focus heavily on
mathematical and reading ability and arrives at the same average of 68. He foregoes the Progressive
Matrices test developed by John C. Raven, a multiple choice test that focus on the reasoning of the
test-taker (Raven 1936). In the Raven test, sub-Saharan Africans scored notably better.
In February 2010 the three researchers from the University of Amsterdam replied yet
again in a paper titled “Another failure to replicate Lynn's estimate of an average IQ of sub
Saharan Africans”. They take note of Lynn's criticism and instead use a cluster of random samples
this time, yet arrive at the same average of 82. (Wicherts et al 2010). They criticise Lynn's
methodology and his conscious omitting of unfavourable data. (Wicherts et al 2010). There has yet
to come a direct response from Lynn."
(me again, sorry for the masturbatory post, but this saves a lot of work)
yung.carl.jung
Hey Bird! I'm Morose & Lugubrious
To summarize, in short:
Lynn often used faulty methodology and sampling to achieve his biased results
Even after trying 3 times, using Lynn's criticism, various teams of researchers failed to achieve results that were anywhere near Lynn's
Lynn is a known white supremacist and reveices funding for his biased research from the Pioneer Fund and similiar organizations
(Rushton, who headed Pioneer until 2012, spoke at conferences of the American Renaissance (AR) magazine, in which he has also published articles.[37] Anti-racist Searchlight Magazine described one such AR conference as a "veritable 'who's who' of American white supremacy."[38]
Hampton University sociology professor Steven J. Rosenthal described the fund in 1995 as a "Nazi endowment specializing in production of justifications for eugenics since 1937, the Pioneer Fund is embedded in a network of right-wing foundations, think tanks, religious fundamentalists, and global anti-Communist coalitions".[39])
I rest my case.
If anyone is interested why sub saharan Africans score so low in IQ compared to Europeans or Asians (about ~82-85 compared to >100) I will gladly elaborate.
Lynn often used faulty methodology and sampling to achieve his biased results
Even after trying 3 times, using Lynn's criticism, various teams of researchers failed to achieve results that were anywhere near Lynn's
Lynn is a known white supremacist and reveices funding for his biased research from the Pioneer Fund and similiar organizations
(Rushton, who headed Pioneer until 2012, spoke at conferences of the American Renaissance (AR) magazine, in which he has also published articles.[37] Anti-racist Searchlight Magazine described one such AR conference as a "veritable 'who's who' of American white supremacy."[38]
Hampton University sociology professor Steven J. Rosenthal described the fund in 1995 as a "Nazi endowment specializing in production of justifications for eugenics since 1937, the Pioneer Fund is embedded in a network of right-wing foundations, think tanks, religious fundamentalists, and global anti-Communist coalitions".[39])
I rest my case.
If anyone is interested why sub saharan Africans score so low in IQ compared to Europeans or Asians (about ~82-85 compared to >100) I will gladly elaborate.
Manfred Belheim
Moaner Lisa
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I find it notable that all these white supremacists think that "asians" are smarter than them.
GoodSarmatian
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Why don't you just attach your paper ? 
When I saw the map I first thought it's either from some unreputable source, or the way they measured IQ was pretty flawed because it correlates pretty well with education infrastructure.
Italy weirds me out, Mongolia having a higher IQ than most of Europe is slightly bizarre, and North Korea is "proof" that it is "racial".
The best explanation is that Zheng He's fleet visited Italy and made a lot of children.
When I saw the map I first thought it's either from some unreputable source, or the way they measured IQ was pretty flawed because it correlates pretty well with education infrastructure.
Italy weirds me out, Mongolia having a higher IQ than most of Europe is slightly bizarre, and North Korea is "proof" that it is "racial".
The best explanation is that Zheng He's fleet visited Italy and made a lot of children.
Last edited:
Oh, you could have said this ludicrous map of 'iq' had that hack from Finland behind it. Isn't he the one with the infamous (and more than just cartoonish in how foaming at the mouth they are) anti-greek opinions? Some people should just opt for jobs in the circus instead of playing professor, in fields like 'sociology' which they diminish all the more by being part of it. Seems like in some such countries being a (funny little) racist allows for a path in academia in this kind of non-scientific field, unlike with most of the european/american world.
yung.carl.jung
Hey Bird! I'm Morose & Lugubrious
Agreed. What is even more ironic is that Jews often score the highest on those IQ tests. I personally think it's some sort of elaborate ****old fetish: "Jews are controlling our media, destroying white civilization and encouraging us to mix races.. And all we can do is stand back and watch (in awe)."
Why don't you just attach your paper ?
Whe I saw the map I forst thought it's either from some unreputable source, or the way they measured IQ was pretty flawed because it correlates pretty well with education infrastructure.
Italy weirds me out, Mongolia having a higher IQ than most of Europe is slightly bizarre, and North Korea is "proof" that it is "racial".
The best explanation is that Zheng He's fleet visited Italy and made a lot of children.
I did not attach the paper because I'm a pansy and don't want everyone to know my Uni / My name / My adress / My E-Mail and so forth. All of these have to go on the paper, and I'm not in the mood to edit a .PDF.
The greatest thing about Lynn's research is that for Croatia, he used data from the 1950s to generate the average national IQ
Precisely him.
GoodSarmatian
Jokerfied Western Male
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Well, the Greeks aren't what they used to be since their bloodlines got pollutd by Slavs and Turks...
Neither are the germans, same reason amirite
No, it is garbage. You should look for some of his quotes, the person is really a clown.
Of course - as you obviously also mean - slavs and turks aren't braindead either. Moreover, it is debatable how many actual turks do exist in the overall region (i mean they seem to be heavily descended from anatolians and balkans in the first place; the turkic people weren't that many in Anatolia).
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