While We Wait: Writer's Block & Other Lame Excuses

[erez87]

He is still better than the currently available alternatives. Not that they are much of ones in any practical sense, but I still voted for him just in case. (That and they had reasonably tasty free pastries there, but only if you voted.)

I don't much care for his craaazy stunts and foreign policy, but if it gets him and by extension us so much cheap online publicity, I suppose I shouldn't complain. If history is anything to go by, there are far, far more damaging things a Russian ruler could be doing.

As for domestic politics, there's no question that he is corrupt and self-aggrandising, but so long as he keeps things relatively stable, I'd say he's still exactly what we need at this juncture. "Give this country 20 years of peace and you won't recognise Russia", I feel this applies pretty well now.

You voted for that anti-gay blob? Ew

It's like my republican boyfriend. I just don't get it...

 

[das]

You voted for that anti-gay blob? Ew

It's like my republican boyfriend. I just don't get it...

No offense, but that is far removed from being a truly major issue when it comes to current day Russian politics.

 

[erez87]

No offense, but that is far removed from being a truly major issue when it comes to current day Russian politics.

I bet. That's probably a major part of the problem.

My favorite quote always fits
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both."

apparently the correct one is
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."
but there is no real difference.

 

[das]

I bet. That's probably a major part of the problem.

I'm not sure which problem you are talking about. We sort of have a bunch of those around here.

 

[erez87]

I'm not sure which problem you are talking about. We sort of have a bunch of those around here.

All of them.

And I don't mean gay rights in and on themselves. But rights altogether.

Of course that is all my opinion. No actual knowledge about Russia. Maybe one day I'll have a sudden burst of interest in that country.

 

[Dachs]

What?

First of all, I don't get the connection you're trying to make at all. If you're referring to Canada's politics, we don't really have an internet equivalent of Ron Paul, and if you're referring to our current ruling party, then our Conservatives are of a much less overtly religious bent than those in America. If your description is of the Canadian electorate as a whole, then that characterization makes even less sense.

Second, damnit, why did you bring me into this?

Note: References to Canada made in an international forum can be automatically assumed to bring me into things.

Starlife's Canadian, isn't he? That's the whole reason I said it.

And while Canadian domestic politics aren't very overtly religious, Canadian foreign policy is almost completely crusading neocon craziness and has been since before Harper.

 

[das]

All of them.

And I don't mean gay rights in and on themselves. But rights altogether.

Of course that is all my opinion. No actual knowledge about Russia. Maybe one day I'll have a sudden burst of interest in that country.

Rights altogether are just one problem, though. And a rather second-rate one as far as I'm concerned. We still need to fix our two national classics, idiots and roads, first.

 

[erez87]

Rights altogether are just one problem, though. And a rather second-rate one as far as I'm concerned. We still need to fix our two national classics, idiots and roads, first.

I'm pretty sure there is a statistical connection between growth of rights and lowering of idiocy and buildup of roads. It may not be direct, but I'm pretty sure the two go together with some third "thing". And I doubt mr. Putin to fix the first, and so the rest. But hey what do I know, you're a smart person, you know what should help your country.

Or maybe... Not so. How's inequality in Russia?

Thou I'm one to talk, I live in a growing religious country of racist nutjobs.


How come rights come second to idiots and roads?

 

[Thlayli]

Considering economic growth alone, erez, there's a viable path to growth without political freedoms. That's why das prioritizes roads over rights. Just look at China. That's generally the model that Russia's espousing. However...

Don't you think the perception (or reality) of ubiquitous corruption in Russia hinders Putin's stated goals of economic development? From an outside investment perspective it probably does; outside of the energy industry, and raising capital, people don't go to Russia for much.

I can understand how the Russian psyche is traumatized by experimentation with democracy leading to the collapse of Soviet infrastructure and social services and the rise (or more public rise) of corruption and chaos, which has in turn led to the embrace of Putin, but a successful democracy has positive economic effects as well. Of course, having a vibrant democracy doesn't necessarily rule out ubiquitous corruption; Italy and India are both very democratic, very vibrant, and very corrupt. As per usual, the solution is more complex than the problem.

 

[Dachs]

We still need to fix our two national classics, idiots and roads, first.

I thought the Russian ideal citizen was an idiot - at least in the Athenian sense of "doesn't give a rat's ass about politics".

 

[erez87]

Considering economic growth alone, erez, there's a viable path to growth without political freedoms. That's why das prioritizes roads over rights. Just look at China. That's generally the model that Russia's espousing.

What sort of "growth" it is if most people will never even sense it? It's like our own Bibi show us the average wage and GDP/person growing as if it is a proof to anything.

It's just proof for inequality. The recent recession wasn't bad for American rich - THE GAINED MONEY. The rest lost. So economic grows yeah, but I'm interested in that it will grow for EVERYONE.

 

[das]

I'm pretty sure there is a statistical connection between growth of rights and lowering of idiocy and buildup of roads.

Yes - it goes the other way around than what you seem to imply, though. We need some measure of stability, economic development and a new political elite before we can afford to think about rights.

How come rights come second to idiots and roads?

It's sequential.

And don't diss Israel so much. I may have hated it when I lived there, but I have many fond memories of it now. I still have relatives there, besides.

Considering economic growth alone, erez, there's a viable path to growth without political freedoms. That's why das prioritizes roads over rights. Just look at China. That's generally the model that Russia's espousing. However...

Don't you think the perception (or reality) of ubiquitous corruption in Russia hinders Putin's stated goals of economic development? From an outside investment perspective it probably does; outside of the energy industry, and raising capital, people don't go to Russia for much.

I can understand how the Russian psyche is traumatized by democracy leading to the collapse of Soviet infrastructure and social services and the rise (or more public rise) of corruption and chaos, but a successful democracy has positive economic effects as well.

Essentially I'm thinking of Putin as of a Franco, Pinochet or LKY figure (wide range, I know, but there are some essential similarities in the role they all ended up playing). Transitional period autocrat who would win time for the national psyche to heal, if only through the means of not letting the sort of people who would scar it again with a new dose of "democracy" rise to power.

Corruption certainly hurts the economy, though. Not so much because of foreign investments - to my knowledge we're doing rather better than you are saying when it comes to attracting European investors, though I suppose that might not be all that it's cracked up to be - but as it hurts domestic development. Still, it's my impression Putin keeps it relatively reined in and manageable, which has been the way of doing things here for centuries anyway, as the government is very seldom actually strong enough to crack down (and when it is, that usually becomes legitimately scary for everyone in the country). Corruption isn't somehow going to go away if Putin was removed, but I can see it getting even more out of control.

I thought the Russian ideal citizen was an idiot - at least in the Athenian sense of "doesn't give a rat's ass about politics".

Bah. Should've translated it differently, then. The saying is that Russia has two eternal problems - duraki i dorogi, fools and roads.

 

[erez87]

So what is Russia's inequality mark?

 

[Starlife]

I suppose they were hoping Romney would oppose our government somehow.

In Soviet Russia, government opposes you. (sorry... I had to...)

p.s.: I'm not Canadian, but I'm also not American. I'm Texan.

 

[qoou]

Of course that is all my opinion. No actual knowledge about Russia. Maybe one day I'll have a sudden burst of interest in that country.

.

 

[das]

So what is Russia's inequality mark?

Inequality mark?

If you mean economic inequality, then it is high and growing. Of course, if you think democracy has gotten a bad name in Russia, then you should see redistributive socialism...

 

[Dachs]

p.s.: I'm not Canadian, but I'm also not American. I'm Texan.

My mistake.

 

[erez87]

Inequality mark?

If you mean economic inequality, then it is high and growing. Of course, if you think democracy has gotten a bad name in Russia, then you should see redistributive socialism...

lol.

Yes Economic Inequality. The Gini thing.

High and growing? That can't be good...


and lol noob.

 

[Lord_Iggy]

Starlife's Canadian, isn't he? That's the whole reason I said it.

And while Canadian domestic politics aren't very overtly religious, Canadian foreign policy is almost completely crusading neocon craziness and has been since before Harper.

Before Harper we didn't have a pro-Israel foreign policy, and most of our foreign engagements were NATO or UN peacekeeping (or intervention, or whatever you call moving into areas to try and stop people from killing each other) things... in short I'm not sure what you mean by 'completely crusading neocon craziness'.

And yeah, I couldn't remember where Starlife was from, but it definitely wasn't Canada. Must have been the French user title stuff that led to that assumption.

 

[Masada]

worst discussion of economics evar.