Who is using Trump?

[Narz]

You don't have to be a conspiracy theorist to know DT is not really in charge. So the question is, who is? Why him and what's their agenda? Detaining exchange students at airports? Silencing the EPA and Forest Service? Building a wall on the Mexican border? This stuff is too dumb. Why? What's really going on?

 

[sophie]

Don't forget Bannon was just appointed to the National Security Council. And the Head of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and the Director of Intelligence were both removed.

Gee, I wonder who's behind all of this?

 

[Synobun]

You don't have to be a conspiracy theorist to know the moon landings were faked.

 

[Agent327]

No. But you would have to be quite dumb. Which seems to set the tone here:

You don't have to be a conspiracy theorist to know DT is not really in charge. So the question is, who is?( ...)This stuff is too dumb. Why? What's really going on?

A really dumb conspiracy.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Silencing the EPA and Forest Service?

Welcome to what Canada went through, at least partially, during what many non-right-wing voters are now calling the "Dark Decade" of Stephen Harper.

People protesting logging, pipelines, pollution, fracking? Terrorists, according to Harper. People out participating in the Boxing Day bird count or birdwatching any other time, they notice an oil leak or other pollution, and take a picture of it? Terrorists.

He didn't quite get around to labeling people like me who sign petitions and write letters and are on the email list of the Council of Canadians as terrorists, but if he'd won in 2015, it was probably coming.

The Conservative Party of Canada (aka Reformacons) decided to muzzle the federal scientists to the point where they were not allowed to speak to media without permission - and getting that permission sometimes took months, if it was even granted at all. At international conferences, they had minders to make sure they didn't speak without permission. And back in 2006, one of the federal scientists wrote a science fiction novel... and was prevented from attending his own book launch. The then-Environment Minister, Rona Ambrose - who is the current interim leader of this party - was too stupid/paranoid to understand the difference between a novel and a scientific paper. Actually, maybe she was just being the petty, ignorant twit she is.

And then came the time when the Reformacons decided the federal libraries - containing decades' worth of data and reports in hard copy - were too inconvenient to keep around (don't want anyone comparing conditions from decade to decade and concluding that the oilsands and fracking were wrecking things past reclamation), so they trashed them. Literally threw them in a dumpster and set them on fire. They claimed that the information was scanned and saved on computers, but if anyone seriously believes that, they are welcome to buy the ocean front property I'm selling outside my front window (I live in a landlocked province).

We kicked the Reformacons out in 2015, the country is finally making some headway toward undoing Harper's decade-long mess... and then Trump gets elected in the U.S. and the Reformacons and Western separatists here are giddy with delight.

My advice about any online information about the environment? Copy it and archive it in a safe place that is not on a government or university server. Better yet, make hard copies. You never know when you might really need that information and it will be gone.


As for who is pulling Trump's strings... it has to be someone. Or else the right-wing in the U.S. has deliberately elected a sociopath who needs to be in a mental hospital getting treatment. Trump's nickname on the Canadian news pages is "Nero" - or sometimes it's "Caligula". In either case, your country now has a madman as a leader, and it's having world-wide repercussions.

Thanks a lot.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

This question could be taken two ways. In the specific, there is no question that Dingbat Don dances to Steve Bannon's tune, and Bannon is out to wreck the country so it can be "rebuilt better than ever." He has openly stated that it is too late for repair, only a full teardown restart can "fix the problems." That's his version of "drain the swamp," a complete failure of government at the hands of a 'new revolution.'

In the more general, Dingbat Don is being used by every dingbat in the country. Try telling a devotee of a fake news site that they are parroting nonsense...when the billionaire president believes the same nonsense. Try telling a white nationalist that their ideas are totally out of step with modern times...when 'their guy' is the choice of the vast majority of Americans. Yes, I know that didn't happen, but back up one sentence. So, all those people are using Dingbat Don like a talisman to empower their demand for their world view to be accepted.

 

[warpus]

Looks like his wife is using him for fame and money. Maybe his friends are using him for similar reasons too.

 

[Absolution]

Some journalists in Israel point out Sheldon Adelson as an "interest-bearer" or "man behind" the presidency of Trump (same as he clearly is for Nethanyahu).
I wonder how do you Americans see this statement, since I have absolutely no idea of Adelson's agendas and influences in the US.

 

[Hakim]

A powerful and mighty rich model train lover and his cookie store owner daughter:

https://www.theatlantic.com/politic...what-the-powerful-mercers-really-want/514529/

 

[Neonanocyborgasm]

Don't forget Bannon was just appointed to the National Security Council. And the Head of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and the Director of Intelligence were both removed.

Gee, I wonder who's behind all of this?

Bannon is like Goebbels. He's the cunning propaganda minister and manipulator that is overjoyed at being at such a high rank of power, especially since he hasn't done anything to deserve even less. He's finally getting to implement all the crazy nationalist agendas he's been dreaming about. I wouldn't be surprised if this whole weekend confusion at the airports was deliberate in order to distract from his new appointment. Now he has the power of information on any enemies that may align against him. And he already doubtless has many. And he now has more advance knowledge of secrets than even the spymaster or the Marshall of the nation!

 

[Gigaz]

I must say that I'm completely puzzled by what's going on inside the Trump Administration...
Whose idea was the travel ban? Who participated in crafting the executive order and could have voiced concerns? What was the ultimate goal behind it, and do they think they are achieving it? Or is it already a failure?

 

[Neonanocyborgasm]

I must say that I'm completely puzzled by what's going on inside the Trump Administration...
Whose idea was the travel ban? Who participated in crafting the executive order and could have voiced concerns? What was the ultimate goal behind it, and do they think they are achieving it? Or is it already a failure?

All indications are that it was written by Bannon and maybe also Miller. There's an article in Atlantic where the language of several executive orders were reviewed. They all sound like someone wrote them without any experience or knowledge of the issues they contained. They were not reviewed by the relevant federal departments. They often don't make sense, conflicting themselves. Bannon seems like the most likely author. He has no legal or political experience. I suspect he hands them to Trump who signs them immediately without reading them, because he's too lazy and his attention span too short.

As for the goal, it's threefold. One is to entice the Trump fan club. He promised them a ban on Muslim immigration and he's delivering. It doesn't matter whether it succeeds or later fails due to judicial or congressional review. His fans will cheer and continue to support him. Second, it's to test how far he car rule by decree. Every so often, he'll issue more decrees. Some will work, some may not. Some way work partially but not totally. When decrees are partially reversed, people will breathe a sigh of relief, because they've raised the bar on how much they're willing to put up with tyrannical decrees. Slowly, this will increase Trump's power. Third, it may all be entirely a distraction from far more nefarious deeds, such as placing Wormtongue (Bannon) in the privileged position of getting intelligence briefings so that he can thwart any enemies against him.

 

[Gigaz]

All indications are that it was written by Bannon and maybe also Miller. There's an article in Atlantic where the language of several executive orders were reviewed. They all sound like someone wrote them without any experience or knowledge of the issues they contained. They were not reviewed by the relevant federal departments. They often don't make sense, conflicting themselves. Bannon seems like the most likely author. He has no legal or political experience. I suspect he hands them to Trump who signs them immediately without reading them, because he's too lazy and his attention span too short.

As for the goal, it's threefold. One is to entice the Trump fan club. He promised them a ban on Muslim immigration and he's delivering. It doesn't matter whether it succeeds or later fails due to judicial or congressional review. His fans will cheer and continue to support him. Second, it's to test how far he car rule by decree. Every so often, he'll issue more decrees. Some will work, some may not. Some way work partially but not totally. When decrees are partially reversed, people will breathe a sigh of relief, because they've raised the bar on how much they're willing to put up with tyrannical decrees. Slowly, this will increase Trump's power. Third, it may all be entirely a distraction from far more nefarious deeds, such as placing Wormtongue (Bannon) in the privileged position of getting intelligence briefings so that he can thwart any enemies against him.

Meh, I'm unconvinced. If Trump or Bannon want to make themselves popular, they're largely failing at that. If there are strategic objectives, then they are apparently bested by Trumps personal business interests, hence the omission of Saudi Arabia, Turkey or Egypt in the travel ban. The only thing he is apparently achieving is that a revolt against his rule becomes more likely. And if he wants to provoke that for some reason, it's a terrible gamble.

 

[Gigaz]

And here we go:
Eliot A. Cohen, Neoconservative professor and Bush counselor, writes an opinion which is basically a thinly veiled call for a putsch.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politic...can-history/514868/?google_editors_picks=true

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Meh, I'm unconvinced. If Trump or Bannon want to make themselves popular, they're largely failing at that. If there are strategic objectives, then they are apparently bested by Trumps personal business interests, hence the omission of Saudi Arabia, Turkey or Egypt in the travel ban. The only thing he is apparently achieving is that a revolt against his rule becomes more likely. And if he wants to provoke that for some reason, it's a terrible gamble.

It isn't "make themselves popular," its enhancement of their position with the group that are already followers and is rapidly approaching outright thrall status. Which gives you more power, fifty one percent of the population liking you, or thirty percent of the population willing to see their neighbors hauled off to prison at your command? It only takes one brownshirt per block to get the ball rolling.

On Breitbart the stopping of a half baked order that looks like it was written out on a cocktail napkin is being loudly explained as "a dangerous judge with a liberal agenda blocking Trump's efforts to defend the country by deporting terrorists." There is no mention that the order as written was a hash of nonsense. No mention that it actually was a wide miss on the whole terrorist subject. No mention that anyone but a handful of terrorists was ever affected and no mention that anyone but "stupid *******s that don't see the dangerous realities" took any issue with it at all.

The message is clearly that "The man of the people is trying, but the elites are blocking the will of the people, it is time to rise up and fight." And any message that conflicts with that is sourced back to "the lamestream media" so immediately discounted by the faithful. It isn't a "revolt against his rule" that is being provoked. The opposition is trying to use courts and legislation. The revolt they are provoking is a revolt in their support.

 

[Gigaz]

It isn't "make themselves popular," its enhancement of their position with the group that are already followers and is rapidly approaching outright thrall status. Which gives you more power, fifty one percent of the population liking you, or thirty percent of the population willing to see their neighbors hauled off to prison at your command? It only takes one brownshirt per block to get the ball rolling.

On Breitbart the stopping of a half baked order that looks like it was written out on a cocktail napkin is being loudly explained as "a dangerous judge with a liberal agenda blocking Trump's efforts to defend the country by deporting terrorists." There is no mention that the order as written was a hash of nonsense. No mention that it actually was a wide miss on the whole terrorist subject. No mention that anyone but a handful of terrorists was ever affected and no mention that anyone but "stupid *******s that don't see the dangerous realities" took any issue with it at all.

The message is clearly that "The man of the people is trying, but the elites are blocking the will of the people, it is time to rise up and fight." And any message that conflicts with that is sourced back to "the lamestream media" so immediately discounted by the faithful. It isn't a "revolt against his rule" that is being provoked. The opposition is trying to use courts and legislation. The revolt they are provoking is a revolt in their support.

I can actually see this working out inside Bannons bubble. Even if there were 30% who would be willing to kill and die for Trump (probably more like 2-10%), they are distributed so unevenly that they would not control the cities, the means of production, the media, the army and so on. Even if this ends in a violent revolution, the Trump/Bannon side can't win.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

If there are a hundred people in a room, and thirty, or ten, or even two of them are willing to kill or die, they control the room. Unless there are others in the room willing to kill or die in standing up to them. Hitler's brownshirts weren't a majority, or anything close to a majority, and they did just fine.

 

[Gigaz]

The Nazi party was better organized by orders of magnitude than Trumps supporters. Also Hitler himself escalated his radical policies slowly over years. What would Trump/Bannon do if the army and the CIA conspire with democrats and republicans to end this madness? I mean, they take Breitbart off the internet, they enact a curfew and have some tanks patrol the street, and thats basically it. There would be no revolution because there would be no organization.

 

[Old Hippy]

The Nazi party was better organized by orders of magnitude than Trumps supporters. Also Hitler himself escalated his radical policies slowly over years. What would Trump/Bannon do if the army and the CIA conspire with democrats and republicans to end this madness? I mean, they take Breitbart off the internet, they enact a curfew and have some tanks patrol the street, and thats basically it. There would be no revolution because there would be no organization.

that just explains how a revolution would work by organization.....
most likely organised by Trump/Bannon to latter have a purge of all dissenting parties

 

[Timsup2nothin]

The Nazi party was better organized by orders of magnitude than Trumps supporters.

In 1933?

Also Hitler himself escalated his radical policies slowly over years.

You think Bannon started yesterday?

What would Trump/Bannon do if the army and the CIA conspire with democrats and republicans to end this madness?

The same thing Hitler would have done if the Wehrmacht had taken out the Brownshirts...but the point is that the Wehrmacht didn't and the army likely wouldn't either.

I mean, they take Breitbart off the internet, they enact a curfew and have some tanks patrol the street, and thats basically it.

Who is this "they"? The builder of Breitbart is on the National Security Council. The President of the United States is a devoted Breitbart reader.

There would be no revolution because there would be no organization.

Keep on believing.

I've been trolling Breitbart to see how many people think that in places like California where the local government is "abetting the illegals against the feds" that it would be a good idea to have "some sort of federally controlled police auxiliary" maybe reporting to someone on the security council like, I dunno, Steve Bannon. Even in California the number of gun toting wingnuts who would jump to sign up is far from zero, and the number who recognize that "some sort of police auxiliary reporting to Steve Bannon and cracking down on the undesirables" is intentionally an exact corollary to the Brownshirts, circa 1935, is pretty much zero.

If the law can't "lock her up" Bannon's hoard is eager to be deputized to do it.

California's state government? They willfully enacted "a recipe for massive vote fraud," you can ask any Breitbart reader including Donny Dingbat and they will swear to it. Obviously a hoard of federally authorized enforcers is the only solution there.

This "dangerous liberal judge" blocking our movement from deporting terrorists? It's time for "the movement" to usurp the corrupted rule of law and replace such judges, clearly.

I would love to be believing with you, but frankly I'm not.