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Why did God create atheists?

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Narz, Jun 17, 2005.

  1. Elrohir

    Elrohir RELATIONAL VALORIZATION

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    It's more like "You are going to go to hell because of what you've done - but you don't have to, just choose not to!" Seems more like a plea to reason than blackmail to me.
     
  2. ironduck

    ironduck Deity

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    I deserve hell? What is this 'hell' you think I deserve, and who are you to cast such judgement on me?
     
  3. FriendlyFire

    FriendlyFire Codex WMDicanious

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    If you have a child would you want your own children to grow up being well, good and honest adults or you allow them to do as they please becomiinf spilot, obnocixious and illbehaved ?
     
  4. ironduck

    ironduck Deity

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    Woah - *I* double speak? You are the one who is telling me about this 'god' who has a plan. I have not seen you show me in any way how this god exists or how he may have a plan of any sort. I'm simply going by what you say. If there is a god and this god knows everything, there is no problem to solve. It's really that simple - you don't need to twist your own logic. If this god knows how to avoid evil why introduce it in the first place? Why make people suffer under it? Sounds like sadism to me.
     
  5. Narz

    Narz keeping it real

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    A plea to reason? If he didn't want us to go to hell why the hell did he create it??

    And don't give me that free-will bunk, that still doesn't explain why He created it. He could've created humans that could fly by willpower instead and given us the free will to choose that or not.

    And on the subject of free will, if God cherishes it so much why don't we have the free-will to leave hell wherever we want?
     
  6. Narz

    Narz keeping it real

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    That has no relation to what you quoted but I'll reply anyway.

    I would want them to be disciplined and strong yes but I wouldn't threaten to put them in the oven if they were bad. :rolleyes:
     
  7. ironduck

    ironduck Deity

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    Since I'm one of the screw-ups I sure would like that :D

    Dude! We need a get-out-of-hell-free card!
     
  8. Quasar1011

    Quasar1011 King of Sylvania

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    No. Basically what I am saying, is that to grasp this concept, you need to think outside your timeline. This can be done, as mathematicians and physicists have demonstrated through string theory. However, we cannot act outside our timeline. God can.

    God still intervenes in our timeline, however, even today. He heals the sick. He changes people's hearts. He rescues people from certain death. None of this is pre-determined. God not only can be in 2 places at the same time, He can be in 2 times at the same place! :crazyeye:
     
  9. vbraun

    vbraun Raytracing

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    Then couldn't he do this to everybody? Has God saved your life? Changed you heart? Heal you if your sick? If so this might be the answer to the common cold! ;) :p
     
  10. Quasar1011

    Quasar1011 King of Sylvania

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    Talk about twisting logic! I have stated my case that God did not introduce evil, but He created the one who did. Why are you upset with God, instead of Satan? Why not blame Satan for "making people suffer under it"? Why not call Satan the sadist? Why do you hate God?
     
  11. ironduck

    ironduck Deity

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    I don't really care how many space-time dimension this god operates in. If he already knows what is going to happen he has a twisted sense of humour not only to not prevent evil, but also to put people in hell if they don't do as he pleases.

    Oh, and how can you claim knowledge of all these times and dimensions your god operates in? Did he tell you?
     
  12. Narz

    Narz keeping it real

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    Ok, taking what you say at face value I have a question... Why doesn't God heal everyone's wounds? What makes some people special enough to have their wounds healed while other writhe in agony and die by the millions?
     
  13. ironduck

    ironduck Deity

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    I have not seen this god you speak of, so I have no idea whether it exists. Therefore I have no emotion whatsoever directed at said god. I do, however, think that you are twisting logic when you say that this god created the entity that created evil, knowing full well that it would do so - and then at the SAME time saying that this god did not create evil through doing so.

    It's basically the same thing as creating a killer robot that will go out and slaughter people and then claiming that you didn't do anything evil by creating this machine and setting it free. Yes, yes, you say that the satan has free will, but the god knew in advance what the satan would do. If my robot had free will, but I knew that it would go out and murder left and right I wouldn't have set it free - that would have been a terrible thing to do.

    Oh, and I don't hate this satan you talk about either for the same reason I don't hate the god you speak of. Actually, I don't hate anyone. It's much too destructive.
     
  14. Quasar1011

    Quasar1011 King of Sylvania

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    No, He couldn't do this to everybody, because everybody doesn't believe in Him, nor follow/obey Him. And before you say "then He's not all-Powerful", remember that God wants people to follow Him and obey Him. God wants to fellowship with us. He loves us as a Father. :) If you want His life-changing benefits, you need to come and fellowship with Him yourself. God does not bless disobedience.
    Yes to all three. I can tell you that once I had a high fever, and I prayed to the Lord Jesus, and the fever left me immediately! :) A lady in my church was recently diagnosed with a tumor on her liver. It caused her to lose a lot of weight. The women of the church prayed over her; she went back to the doctor for a biopsr, and the doctor could find no trace of the tumor! :eek: Then there's my girlfriend, who would tell you that she'd be dead today from alcohol poisoning, if God didn't come and change her heart and save her life!

    But, we digress from the topic... ;)
     
  15. Quasar1011

    Quasar1011 King of Sylvania

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    I am glad to hear that. :)

    Let me ask you something though. Since you believe in neither God nor Satan, and since you do seem to believe that evil exists, what do you think is the origin of evil?
     
  16. Taliesin

    Taliesin Puttin' on the Ritz

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    So can I. Hey, look, I just did it! I did it again! Hahahaha!
     
  17. Narz

    Narz keeping it real

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    So basically it's like this - if you obey and worship me you get special privlages and I bend the laws of reality a bit and if you don't (even if you're an otherwise good person) I'm going to torture you for eternity?

    Sounds like a nice fellow. :)
     
  18. ironduck

    ironduck Deity

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    I don't know whether an abstract concept of evil exist. But what humans (and other conscious creatures I assume) do to others to create suffering is generally known as evil. It's a way of describing a conscious will to cause harm to others.

    I think the more interesting question would be how conscience comes to be.
     
  19. ironduck

    ironduck Deity

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    Quasar, you didn't respond to this yet btw (it's on page 4, I can't double quote inside, but it was a response to a quote by you)

     
  20. vbraun

    vbraun Raytracing

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    Sorry, Everybody that believes in him?
     

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