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3rd and 4th Unique Components for VP - Official thread

Discussion in 'Mods Repository' started by pineappledan, Apr 22, 2018.

  1. FoxOfWar

    FoxOfWar Prince

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    Which why I mentioned all of that in the post. Just musing about the civ, heh. I think Austria is in a pretty good place overall.
     
  2. phantomaxl1207

    phantomaxl1207 King

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    Having recently played Indonesia, I have to say that their Uniques feel solid and impactful: from the Free Pincer on Melee Naval Units to the extra Yields to Water Tiles. Indonesia in VP doesn't really have any Coastal benefits from their Uniques otherwise.
     
  3. dylansan

    dylansan Warlord

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    My hubby's been playing Indonesia while I occasionally watch. Neither of us realized the UI was available at sailing until after he reached the Renaissance... oof.

    It doesn't show in the tech tree because there's already five things there, I guess.

    He made good use of the Prau, though. The extra movement made exploring pretty fun. I will add that it doesn't seem like it should be as strong as a Trireme, but that's just my impression of the ship, not an assessment of balance. Though, since it comes earlier, he didn't run into many other units, if any, during his initial exploration. Even if they were weaker, they would generally be able to run from any dangerous fight, I'd imagine, while still being capable in war in groups thanks to Pincer. Just a thought.
     
  4. pineappledan

    pineappledan Deity

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    Were you playing with the improvement recommendations off? the icon should have appeared, suggesting you improve your coast tiles. Oh well.

    I had considered reducing the CS to 13. Not sure if it's necessary though. I also need to update the art for that unit.

    In other news, the Steam mill is moving to 4UC, and VP is adding the White Tower as a main UNW, so we're trading places. Does anyone have any opinions on if/how we should modify the Steam Mill? I know there was some concern over the building being lackluster. I think some science wouldn't go amiss on it, myself
     
  5. amateurgamer88

    amateurgamer88 King

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    Not sure if this is a good idea or even a balanced one or not. I wonder if allowing each Steam Mill also produce 1 Iron can work. Naval Supremacy is a bit hard if you lack Iron so why not give England more options? Just throwing if out there and feel free to tell me if it's a bad idea.
     
  6. phantomaxl1207

    phantomaxl1207 King

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    I would say Steam Mill could use just 1 more ability to put on the level of the Public School UB's.
     
  7. pineappledan

    pineappledan Deity

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  8. amateurgamer88

    amateurgamer88 King

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    Does England really need more Science? With your spies, you should have caught up in techs or at least be able to focus on a certain path while stealing the rest.
     
  9. FoxOfWar

    FoxOfWar Prince

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    How about a small-ish amount of :c5science::c5gold: on building or unit completion, sort of referencing the innovations of industrial revolution?
     
  10. Enrico Swagolo

    Enrico Swagolo Deity

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    I would keep away from Science personally. The UA's Spy steals Techs ( Science ), the UB's current draft has a ton of :c5science: Science per Spy action and another Spy to gather :c5science: Science/techs with, if the UB has some Science as well it'll be too much. 5% :c5production: into Science is like 5-10:c5science: per city somewhere around there, so it'd still not be very gamebreaking, but I feel like going for more Science is a bad idea. Any other yield would be better.

    The problem with the Steam Mill is it's hard to make a very good idea with it. I don't think any yield but :c5production:, :c5gold: or :c5science: fits. Maybe :c5goldenage:, maybe some :c5greatperson: Great People points, but those are less convincing.

    Maybe
    5:c5production:, 1/2 scaler (same)
    4 :c5production: for Manufactory/Coal (almost same, coal +1)
    +2(or 3?):c5production::c5gold: for every tile which contains a Luxury/Strategic resource you have a monopoly of.
    No coal cost

    This way it'd be pretty strong. Different enough from Waag, because it applies to the tiles. I don't know if it's possible or still too same-ish, but I don't think much interesting can be done with this UB.

    Alternatively, maybe something like X(X?)% of :c5gold: purchase cost is converted to :c5production: in the city, X(X?)% of building/unit :c5production: construction cost is converted to :c5gold: in the city which is pretty much what you suggested, but no Science. Science should probably be avoided.

    Just throwing ideas around.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2019
  11. Guynemer

    Guynemer Prince

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    I think production to gold would make more sense, from both a balance standpoint and a history standpoint.
     
  12. phantomaxl1207

    phantomaxl1207 King

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    How about a focus on Engineers? The Steam Mill already has 2 Engineer Slots and a +4 to Manufactories.
     
  13. Enrico Swagolo

    Enrico Swagolo Deity

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    Grande Ecole already boosts Engineers though, and it also is industrial in the same row, but that'd be nice and make sense. The bonus Engineer that you can't and don't want to work in most cities would be better if the Engie was almost always worth working. Or if England had some mechanic like Riad has for Merchants (that works differently?) and provides GE points.
     
  14. pineappledan

    pineappledan Deity

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    Maybe a small amount of science and GEng point on building completion?
     
  15. Enrico Swagolo

    Enrico Swagolo Deity

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    I'm not sure about it. If the amount of the GE points is high it encourages not building buildings before Steam Mill (or sell building > rebuild if it'd work for this one), AI won't understand this and this is a far bigger problem than Progress' bonus (high, but you take this tree early - AI isn't missing out on much, yields didn't scale yet) or Industry opener (AI isn't missing out on much because this gold is generally not worth delaying stuff over at all) or Ironworks (that's one city, and you usually get it before the yields scale a second time). Science is also not well placed unless Gazebo turns White Tower to Culture, not Science as it is.

    What I don't like is a heavy GE focus in this direction that pushes England further tall ever so slightly. I don't think that really fits when it could perhaps be done differently. Is it possible to do a Chaebol and give every Steam Mill +1 :c5greatperson: Great Engineer point for every Steam Mill in the game, and/or GE points to Manufactories?
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2019
  16. phantomaxl1207

    phantomaxl1207 King

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    The reason I suggest Engineers is because Coastal Cities can often be Production starved and Engineers help with that. That and no Civ has an Engineer focus.

    Would it be possible to give Great Engineer points on Trade Route Finish?
     
  17. XxPun12h3rxX

    XxPun12h3rxX Chieftain

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    What about using the steam mill (or i guess the art asset if the name is changed) as a unique replacement for the coal refinery? No civ has that, and theres a lot more to play with there.
     
  18. adan_eslavo

    adan_eslavo Archmage of all Pixels Supporter

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    One guy wrote on my profile hat he have problem with MP.
     
  19. Minh Le

    Minh Le King

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    The Tophet of Carthage does work. It doesnt give culture for unit purchasing.
     
  20. pineappledan

    pineappledan Deity

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    upload_2019-2-17_8-8-2.png
    The Carthage Tophet works perfectly in my game. I got the floaty text and everything.
     

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