ridjack
Emperor
- Joined
- Mar 12, 2017
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- 1,000
Thank you for that; I'd be curious to see the discussion around this change. Any chance you (or anyone else) knows when that happened?
(7-1) New Beta Version
- Thread starter Gazebo
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Thank you for that; I'd be curious to see the discussion around this change. Any chance you (or anyone else) knows when that happened?
Heinz_Guderian
Prince
It was removed like a year ago or so because it was deemed it was easy for human players to abuse it. I added it back because I like options, and because the buffer zone for trade deals got changed to +/- 10 instead of 50, so lump sum makes it more flexible.
It's a fairly massive nerf indeed. The problem was that the previous version was just a massive source of abuse (Give me all your money for this one luxury, done, declare war and you got the money and your resource back)
You can still do flat gold peace deals. But nothing else. Perhaps flat gold deals should be for friends?
Basically flat gold is just now there as a buffer and to upgrade and invest in buildings. It has zero trade value. Iron and Horses are now used more or less as flat gold to fix deals into the acceptable range.
You can still do flat gold peace deals. But nothing else. Perhaps flat gold deals should be for friends?
Basically flat gold is just now there as a buffer and to upgrade and invest in buildings. It has zero trade value. Iron and Horses are now used more or less as flat gold to fix deals into the acceptable range.
I think that is an exaggeration. You can still trade your massive economic advantage into trade benefits through GPT deals, money hasn't suddenly become useless or anything.... it just requires time to milk advantage out of your deals instead of getting a major boost all at once.
You could get gold as needed or on demand. Now you can't. I would call that a nerf, scale of nerf is apparently individual. It's not like it broke the system entirely but it did make it more inconvenient, previously you could just trade for flat gold to upgrade and build or finish those events etc that popped up. Now you have to save and plan. Which was riskier before since your gold could be stolen, but now cant be.
ridjack
Emperor
- Joined
- Mar 12, 2017
- Messages
- 1,000
Isn't this exactly how it used to be? Or was that just vanilla?
The balance issues are, for once, of less concern to me than the feel and flavor. It makes less than zero sense for gold not to be used for trading, IMHO. I'll probably just go ahead and re-enable it with the advice from the person above, but as a general thing I don't think it's a good look for newcomers to VP.
You can still do flat gold for single shot things, like tech trading. You just can't get flat gold for long term things. And I'm not sure why you would be able to? Why does it make sense to get all the money for something up front rather than over the 50 turns you get the thing for.
I think I'll add an option to reenable the BNW behavior.
The problem is that if flat Gold is enabled for friends, you can do the following:
1) Trade lots of resources/etc. for their flat Gold
2) End Declaration of Friendship
3) Wait 10 turns to evade the backstab timer
4) Declare war and get everything back
Not as exploitable as without a DoF, but still exploitable.
This change was actually made by ilteroi, as the AI kept offering lots of flat Gold for resources.
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Isn't that an instant effect trade? Why is that bad?
For resources, sorry. Mixed up the two issues.
Heinz_Guderian
Prince
I like the balance with lump sum, because you get more gold if you go for the /turn gold, but you get less gold but sooner with the lump sum. Obviously early on the lump sum is probably stronger but it is at least somewhat of a tradeoff.
BiteInTheMark
Deity
There is a message for getting a military unit from CS, but it's often sticked together with other messages into one icon.
If you try to build a wonder and someone else finished it first, you definitely get a message. If someone else have constructed a wonder, you should at least get a "meooooo" sound, but can't say if it's always an icon, cause I mainly ignore them.
AndreyK
King
Previous turn I have bought silk from Iroquois and truffles from Maya - didn't get WLKD and they shown in lists of imported resources from appropriate AI, but not in general list of imports
Heinz_Guderian
Prince
I get this issue aswell. I buy a lux and dont get them, but I can buy them again and them it usually works
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