AG10 - OCC Conquest (Emperor)

[Greebley]

Preturn: Nothing to change. I am unsure on those rifles, but decide to wait and see.

IBT: The rifles do not attack.

1680 AD: I buy espionage for 69 gpt from france.
Artillery->Intelligence Agency

1685 AD:

IBT:
Maya declare war on the french.
Inca declare war on the french.

Build agency and a few more Infantry...

1730 AD: France and Maya are at peace. America is dying out. Soon there we be two huge civs.. possibly the inca... and us.

1740 AD: Plant a spy in the Mayans. They have all speed 1 units... and 155 infantry.

1745 AD: We have enough money to do a careful steal and are reasonably ready for war so I try a careful steal.
It fails but we are not caught. We now have 1 gold.

1750 AD: Well it will be a long time before we can steal again. We should discuss if we want to go to war.

Ok, I am going to pay the the high, high cost for oil with france. 1 gold gets us oil.

Notes:
There are now 3 OCC Civs in the game and two closely balanced super powers.

I built infantry, I felt we needed more. We are still kind of short. Here is a synopsis of our forces

We have an infantry and crusader (or guerrilla) on each of the 7 forts. This leaves us with:
16 Artillery
10 Cavalry
2 Infantry
In the capitol.

In 4 turns we will have 20 Artillery, but 2 infantry per fort would make me feel much better than only 1 as they are much more likely to live. That would add 14 more turns however beyond the 4. I am more in favor of attacking before they have tanks however. I think we need more than 2 infantry for our assault. So maybe 8 turns?

So we should discuss:
1) when do we go to war?
2) Is an infantry and a crusader enough to hold the forts?

Mayan forces currently are:
7 settlers, 4 workers, 1 pike, 6 longbow, 2 Musket, 34 rifle, 164 Infantry, 18 Artillery, 7 Galleon, 5 guerilla.

Pillaging is an option with only 4 workers. Explorers under infantry perhaps?

 

[Greebley]

Here is a picture of the world.

 

[Aggie]

Yes, let's discuss. The Maya have a tremendous number of troops! But good to see that they are at war though. I would indeed wait until we have a wee bit more infantry an I like the explorer idea.

ROSTER (15 turns in peace time, 10 turns when at war):
Aggie
6thgentexan
betazed------out until further notice
Greebley-----holiday from July 24th to August 8th
homeyg------up
Microbe------on deck

 

[microbe]

I would think a single infantry should be OK. They probably won't attack them anyway before tanks.

 

[Aggie]

Yes, let's build a few more infantry (3?) before we start our assault. We should be able to attack the Maya with 5 infantry, our artillery and cavalry in one stack.

 

[Aggie]

I obvousily misread Greebley's turnlog. The Maya aren't at war.

But I see that a few trades with the French can be renewed. Maybe with a MA?

EDIT: I vote to go to war NOW. We could send the complete army of Berlin to a target and the Maya will probably avoid all our troops and go for the city (which takes them through French lands and woulds take 4 turns to reach Berlin). We could also first take a defensive position, but still I think that we are ready for a war now.

I would build a few infra units and then cavalry/artillery. We will lose cavalry in the battles.

 

[Greebley]

Ya, an MA with France shouldn't be hard to get. The two are enemies now. I think they will attack a single infantry; they were willing to attack infantry with rifles in the war with France. I think 3 infantry as Aggie suggested will be better (build 2 more to keep one at home and send 3) makes sense.

I expect they may attack and possibly break through our line. We need to watch out for that. Maybe not though if there are easier targets in france.

We will probably want to switch sides fairly often. Keep them relatively balanced is a good thing and will want to clear out newly settled cities before they grow.

[Edit: We cannot currently build Cavalry as we lack horses and Saltpeter. With an ROP with France we could get a colony on the Salt that would have to be replace by a trade when borders expand]

 

[Aggie]

Well, I think that they won't attack. But we obviously can wait the 6 turns, we waited so long already. But imho it shouldn't be a lot more than that.
I don't know if homeyg is comfortable to start this war, but I think it is possible to hold on and be defensive for four turns before trying to take cities. We should expect to lose 3 cavalry per city. Infantry (though redlined) is tough in a size 12 city.

EDIT: I like to see France and the Maya fight each other. They need to cripple their armies and research pace. Whether we are passive or active soon in this war is less important imho.

 

[homeyg]

Okay, I got it.

Edit: I'm not worried about starting the war. I'm just worried about how to go about carrying out the war.

 

[Greebley]

I think the way to carry it out is to have a decent size stack of Infantry (at least 3), Cavalry (all but a few - let the Mayans attack our line), and artillery (all but 4 or 5). Go to take out towns.

I would also suggest not leaving right away. See what kind of forces you need to repel the mayans on the home front first. Once you are comfortable at handling their attacks then move out.

We really want enough Artillery to knock the AI down to 1 hp. We may not have enough yet. I am not sure.

 

[homeyg]

Alright, I'll play tomorrow. If anything else needs to be discussed, now is the time.

 

[Aggie]

I agree with Greebley with the tactic (3/4 infantry for defense, artillery for getting the units in the Maya cities redlined and maybe even city size <12 or <7 and then cavalry to finish it off).

If you want to attack: just move the complete stack two tiles from a city, preferably on a hill or mountains, but within reach of the city for the cavalry from that spot.

If you want to defend: destroy the tiles in Maya land surrounding our lands with artillery. Don't destroy the complete road to the Maya though, we need it to immediately withdraw to Berlin. Wounded units that can be sent to Berlin in zero turns (over rails) are fully healed next turn. If the Maya come with a stack: soften it up with artillery and let the French do the rest. No need to risk a life of a cavalry on a redlined infantry, unless they are covering tiles with resources in our lands.

We never can have enough artillery. I would not attack with cavalry if you don't get a town redlined with artillery.

If you declare (which you could do immediately), please draw in the French. They will gladly do so. The other AI is too weak to play a role.

EDIT: And don't forget to keep that lone scientist going. Sanitation is not known yet! Same goes for Ironclads (our next tech?)

 

[homeyg]

Turn 0: I declare war on the Mayans. I'm going to see what they send at our Infantry forts. If it's nothing big, I'll move out. We're going to have to pay big $$ to get a MA, so I negotiate for a MPP. I have to pay 47 gold and a WM. Press [enter].

IBT: France is in now in the Modern Ages; that can't be good. Maya sends a stack of doom into nearby French territory, next to one of our forts. Mostly infantry. I'd estimate about 50 units all together.

Turn 1: I move all of our artillery into adjacent fort and let the bombarding begin. Most of the artillery hits, except for two. Only around 1/4 of the SoD has suffered minor damage, so I can't attack it. Hopefully some French tanks will take care of this for me. I send an infantry from the capital to the fort all of the artillery is in to reinforce.

IBT: The French send 3 infantry and a settler, going for that hill square to the west of Berlin. The Mayans retreat the damaged and send in even more replacements. There's a total of around 65 Mayan infantry near and next to the fortress and in French territory.

Turn 2: I bombard all I can. All hit except for 3. I bombarded all of the stack in a rotation sort of deal.

IBT: France delcare war on the Maya? I thought they were already at war. Oh, well. The Mayan troops move farther into French territory. Mayan galleon moves into our waters. Berlin shows that it is starving.

Turn 3: Now that those 60+ Mayan troops are trapped in French territory and are probably going to be destroyed, I think that I should take the opportunity to advance into their territory. I hesitate because our stack is only going to have 2 infantry, but I have one being built in 2 turns. I go ahead and do it. I move east onto a Mayan hill, where the artillery is within reach of 2 cities. If the stack gets killed, it's obviously my head.

IBT: France destroys the Inca. After a lame French attack on the stacks, most of the Mayan troops start to retreat. They realize our troops in their territory. Mayan galleon leaves. None of our stack units get attacked, though (actually none of our units have been attacked).

Turn 4: Shoot, nobody to trade rubber. Our first city target: Uaxactun. I redline all units except 1, which still has 2 hp. I investigate that city just to make sure. I easliy destroy that 2/4 infantry with a 5/5 cavalry losing only 1 hp. The attack procedes. I lose 2 cavalry. Produce a leader and destroy the city. The Mayan SoDs are trapped even further in French and newly opened up German territory. Move the MGL to the fortress. I'll have to wait until next turn to use it.

IBT: Our cavlary used to destroy the city was destroyed by a rifle. We lose our workers that we got from the city. Mayans continue retreating from French territory. Berlin: infantry -> artillery.

Turn 5: I remembered we can't really do anything with the leader, so I fortify it in Berlin. I bombard Tikal, although I don't know if we can take it with our damaged cavalry. Bombarding doesn't go well, so I return all of the damaged cavalry to Berlin to heal. Btw, I sent the newly built infantry to the stack.

IBT: One of the Mayan satcks was completely destroyed, I couldn't tell by what due to the fog of war. The Mayans request our audience? I tell them to go away. Mayans continue to retreat their stacks but they are making little progress. Berlin: artillery -> artillery.

Turn 6: I send artillery to the stack. Still no trades for rubber available. I buy horses and saltpeter from the Frech for 205 gold and a WM. I change to-be-built artillery to a cavalry. I once again bomb Tikal. Not much progress made. I'll wait for cavalry in Berlin to heal before I attempt to attack again.

IBT: I see French tank take out two Mayan infantry from one stack and then get destroyed by an attacking Mayan infantry. Belin: cavalry -> artillery.

Turn 7: I bomb Tikal. I investigate Tikal and it turns out they fortified one of their fricken stacks in the city so it would be impossible to take the city this turn. I don't even think I'll be able to take it at all. I'll try again next turn, though, and if I can't take it then, I'll focus my attention somewhere else. I move all of the healed cavalry to the stack.

IBT: Americans want to territory maps, I say yes. Berlin: artillery -> cavalry.

Turn 8: I bomb Tikal for hopefully the last time. I view the city and most of the units are damaged already. It was no good. I won't be able to attack. There are too many 3/4 and 2/3 infantry (I checked again). Next turn I'll reposition and start attacking Mayapan. Yes, I realize Tikal was on a hill, but I thought it might make life easier if I tried to take it first. I didn't lose any units, though, just bombardment turns.

IBT: Berlin: cavalry -> artillery.

Turn 9: I move all of the stack within range of Mayapan, and I'll have to wait until next turn to take some action. Only 4 infantry and an artillery are stationed there (I investigated).

IBT: I catch a glimpse of a Mayan destroyer as it moves into fog of war. Berlin: artillery -> cavalry.

Turn 10: I successfully bombard and destroy Mayapan with only one casualty, and I salvage a Mayan artillery. Fortify remaining artillery (about 4).

Well, that was pretty easy. The Mayans are basically crumbling before our eyes (even though we only took 2 cities, I think we will be able to take even more the next round). I got this war started and I'll let the next person take it even further.

 

[microbe]

It proves that AI just wouldn't attack fortified infantry before tanks. They don't have tanks right? We should pillage its oil first.

 

[homeyg]

France has tanks but Maya doesn't (I didn't see any within my turns).

 

[Greebley]

Good work Homeyg. I am wondering if the Mayans aren't the main threat anymore. Do we want to switch sides when the MPP expires? I am thinking we do want to do this.

 

[homeyg]

Yes, I think the French are becoming the main super power in this game.

 

[Aggie]

Fantastic job Homeyg!! I agree that we only have one threat left. But that will be the biggest challenge (as long as we don't have an infantry army or panzers). As soon as France makes peace we will be at war with France, with help of the Maya.

EDIT: That MPP wasn't needed. The French would have joined the war without us paying. Now we have to wait 10 turns before we can declare on the French.

ROSTER (15 turns in peace time, 10 turns when at war):
Aggie---------on deck
6thgentexan
betazed------out until further notice
Greebley-----holiday from July 24th to August 8th
homeyg
Microbe------up

 

[microbe]

Got it.

I still think Maya is a threat. We just razed a couple of corrupt cities. We didn't hurt the root of it.

I think the only way to win is to let the two big boys fight each other. I'll continue the war against Maya.

 

[Aggie]

Microbe, sure. The Maya are still a threat. But they lack tanks and could be overrun by the French if we don't watch out. Just continue taking out a few cities and military of the Maya. But as soon as France makes peace we should make (pointy-stick) peace as well and flip the war. MA with the Maya vs the French.

Don't forget the min science run on Sanitation and then Ironclads Good luck, ehm good skill.