Alternate History Thread III
- Thread starter Luckymoose
- Start date
Swissempire
Poet Jester
South America stats
Spoiler :
Symphony D.
Deity
Personally I think the Power stats could use tweaking: Russia is effin' huge and it's only got a 5 for size while the UK has a 6? Also, what's up with all of them having equal economies? USA should be upper 4 (economic shifts), UK lower 4 (economic downturns), Germany lower 4 or upper 3 (economic downturns), France lower to upper 4 (economic resurgence), and Russia, Austria, and Japan 3 or less.
Those South American countries also have rather large armies for their status.
Swiss, learn to spell "Competent" properly, damnit.
Those South American countries also have rather large armies for their status.
Swiss, learn to spell "Competent" properly, damnit.
Israelite9191
You should be reading
Gahhh!! I specifically stated before that I would want Super-Belgium! Oh well, I suppose I can always wait till the NES starts and the powers become reservable.
Shadowbound
Incorrugible
- Joined
- Mar 4, 2007
- Messages
- 4,079
I haven't read all of the timeline yet, but I'd like to reserve Bolivia.
jeps
Arcadefire
Azale!!!! I hate you. You made the NES too good to pass up. So I will take Switzerland. That way I'm not major in any way, but can be influential enough. (and who ever has heard of a jewish banker 
)
I didnt have the time to join any other NESes, but I am now inventing an hour called 'staznesIX hour'. It is between 24:00 and 0:01 on 24 hour clocks. (dont worry, I shall devote enough time to this NES.)
)I didnt have the time to join any other NESes, but I am now inventing an hour called 'staznesIX hour'. It is between 24:00 and 0:01 on 24 hour clocks. (dont worry, I shall devote enough time to this NES.)
Swissempire
Poet Jester
Personally, i think everyone else has rather small armies for their status. And low training levels.Those South American countries also have rather large armies for their status.
Luckymoose
The World is Mine
Besides the fact that nations generally don't keep multiple hundred thousand man armies ready.
carmen510
Deity
Another sub-par alternate history...
(Note: Beforehand, Stalin keeps all the brilliant generals, and doesn't have the bad 1941 Soviet army leadership)
1938-
May-
5- Stalin is afraid of Nazi Anschluss and invades Poland with 3,000,000 troops to act as a buffer state. France, Britain, Germany, Italy, and the US condemn this move. In fact, Hitler was planning to invade Poland, but was still building up forces.
7- Soviets reach Czechoslovakian border to the south, and reach Warsaw.
8- Nazi forces begin to shift into Poland. About 500,000 troops and about 6,000 tanks have reached Lodz.
9- Soviets encircle Warsaw with 900,000.
13- Soviets begin urban fighting in Warsaw.
14- About 400,000 Nazis shift into Warsaw.
15- Warsaw's west side is now occupied by the Nazis.
18- Nazis driven out of Warsaw.
20- Soviets occupy Warsaw
23- Soviets reach Lodz.
24- Nazis attack the Soviets in a small 'push'.
26- Soviets drive Nazis back into Lodz.
30- Soviets occupy Lodz.
31- Nazis retreat back into Germany. Soviets get to German border.
June-
1- Skirmishes happen along the border.
3- Germany convinces France and Britain to let the Nazis 'fortify' Czechoslovakia.
4- Nazis pour into Czechoslovakia.
5- Nazis invade and reach Cracow.
6- Cracow taken by Nazis.
7- Soviets declare war on Germany.
8- Britain and France hail Germany as 'defender of Eastern Europe'.
9- Italy, Hungary, Bulgaria, and Italy sign the Axis pact, an alliance of defense. Secretly, they all begin to send propaganda to help fascists win over Eastern Europe, particularly Romania.
10- Polish 'Home Army' resistance group bombs several Soviet checkpoints in Warsaw. Soviets begin a crackdown on every major city in Poland.
14- Romanian Iron Guard Fascist party takes over Romanian parliament. Nazis send troops and supplies to Romania.
16- Romanian king executed. Romania joins the Axis.
17- Monarchy loyalists begin to resist Fascist rule.
19- Soviets invade Romania, and Nazis capture Lodz, now capital of the 'Home Army'
22- Soviets reach Galatz.
23- Soviets seize Galatz.
24- Nazis fortify Bucharest.
Should I continue or just screw it?
(Note: Beforehand, Stalin keeps all the brilliant generals, and doesn't have the bad 1941 Soviet army leadership)
1938-
May-
5- Stalin is afraid of Nazi Anschluss and invades Poland with 3,000,000 troops to act as a buffer state. France, Britain, Germany, Italy, and the US condemn this move. In fact, Hitler was planning to invade Poland, but was still building up forces.
7- Soviets reach Czechoslovakian border to the south, and reach Warsaw.
8- Nazi forces begin to shift into Poland. About 500,000 troops and about 6,000 tanks have reached Lodz.
9- Soviets encircle Warsaw with 900,000.
13- Soviets begin urban fighting in Warsaw.
14- About 400,000 Nazis shift into Warsaw.
15- Warsaw's west side is now occupied by the Nazis.
18- Nazis driven out of Warsaw.
20- Soviets occupy Warsaw
23- Soviets reach Lodz.
24- Nazis attack the Soviets in a small 'push'.
26- Soviets drive Nazis back into Lodz.
30- Soviets occupy Lodz.
31- Nazis retreat back into Germany. Soviets get to German border.
June-
1- Skirmishes happen along the border.
3- Germany convinces France and Britain to let the Nazis 'fortify' Czechoslovakia.
4- Nazis pour into Czechoslovakia.
5- Nazis invade and reach Cracow.
6- Cracow taken by Nazis.
7- Soviets declare war on Germany.
8- Britain and France hail Germany as 'defender of Eastern Europe'.
9- Italy, Hungary, Bulgaria, and Italy sign the Axis pact, an alliance of defense. Secretly, they all begin to send propaganda to help fascists win over Eastern Europe, particularly Romania.
10- Polish 'Home Army' resistance group bombs several Soviet checkpoints in Warsaw. Soviets begin a crackdown on every major city in Poland.
14- Romanian Iron Guard Fascist party takes over Romanian parliament. Nazis send troops and supplies to Romania.
16- Romanian king executed. Romania joins the Axis.
17- Monarchy loyalists begin to resist Fascist rule.
19- Soviets invade Romania, and Nazis capture Lodz, now capital of the 'Home Army'
22- Soviets reach Galatz.
23- Soviets seize Galatz.
24- Nazis fortify Bucharest.
Should I continue or just screw it?
Uhh...read the timeline? Germany needs those kinds of armies to keep its mutinous allies in line, and the rest of the Great Powers are still imperialistic. This is a re-arming period.
Luckymoose
The World is Mine
Not referring to Europe. Just the other countries of the world.
das
Regeneration In Process
a) The pre-1937 Soviet military leadership is often terribly overestimated.
b) The post-1937 Soviet military leadership is often terribly underestimated.
But I'd say that Zhukov, the foremost post-1937 commander, was for all his shortcomings better than Tukhachevsky, the foremost pre-1937 commander. Tukhachevsky had some nice ideas about modern warfare, but the Soviet army never suffered from a lack of theoreticians.
Firstly, why the hell would anyone apart from Mussolini be afraid of the Anschluss? Secondly, how is invading Poland connected with it? And thirdly, why the hell invade a state if you want it to be a buffer state? An invasion would naturally have the opposite effect.
As a matter of fact, Poland was already a buffer state, and that is one of the reasons the Soviets did NOT, as a matter of fact, try to invade it.
Aside from that, I have only to add that such a move would make no sense whatsoever, and would greatly conflict the general Soviet policies of the era. Its not only a risky venture (meaning something that Stalin would almost never allow, not before 1945 anyway), but also an extremelly spontaneous one and a one bound to unite all the potential Soviet enemies. I can't imagine it being done without first securing support from either France or Germany, and as both countries wanted Poland as an ally and were more than a bit wary of the Soviet Union I can't really see them accepting this back in 1938.
*blinks*
The military aspects are more than a bit implausible as well. The Red Army's problems were never as much in the leadership corps as in logistics; they would simply be unable to advance to western Poland and fight off the Germans with such ridicilous ease. That is simply out of the Red Army's realistic reach. The Polish military was also quite formidable; I really doubt that it would be brushed aside so quickly and easily, at best the Soviets could advance to the Curson Line, and even then I'm not sure if the Poles would invite the Germans in.
The war's escalation also apepars quite ridicilous. Czechoslovakia is bad enough; it may be considered a cunning flank maneuver, though the Third Reich wasn't nearly as fond of these as the Second Reich, and rightly so. But Romania is just plain wrong. I honestly can't see either side wanting to waste their resources there. It is totally irrelevant to the war itself.
So, just screw it.
carmen510
Deity
Thanks. 
(Although Romania was supposed to be an Axis footing for an invasion of the Ukraine.)
(Although Romania was supposed to be an Axis footing for an invasion of the Ukraine.)
das
Regeneration In Process
An invasion of the Ukraine would simply be impractical. To prepare it properly will take plenty of time, resources and effort - will take that away from the Polish theatre, where the Soviets would be able to push further. And widening the front when fighting a numerically-superior force goes against the basic military logic. Basically, a straightforward offensive in Poland while the Germans still have the advantage seems like a much more plausible move.
carmen510
Deity
Maybe I should just revise it?
silver 2039
Deity
- Joined
- Jul 26, 2003
- Messages
- 16,208
No drop it. The whole thing is a bad idea. Or just go with a Red Alert type thing.
carmen510
Deity
Which I unfortunately do not own...
Maybe I'll screw up the beginning of civilization and go on from there.
(No Mediterranean, South America Connected to Africa, India hasn't moved and is now a huge island, etc.)
Maybe I'll screw up the beginning of civilization and go on from there.
(No Mediterranean, South America Connected to Africa, India hasn't moved and is now a huge island, etc.)
Rightly so indeed - I can\'t see many reasons for attempting a flank attack on anything but the tactical level of warfare. Strategically, flanking someone means that you
a) divide your forces, enabling the enemy to concentrate against each separate unit and defeat them in detail
b) simply change the line of expectation (if you use your entire army), offering no real change in the relative situation
c) robs you of the possibility of moving on the enemy\'s rear or lines of communications, which would be a far more potent threat and one which would probable be less costly to your own troops
d) waste time
Besides, it\'s not as though Czechoslovakia affords the Nazi Germans any real advantage that Silesia doesn\'t give them.
