An update from Firaxis about the Colonization patch

[Aardvark Fury]

3) Rebalance map generation away from Tobacco? It is annoying to only see one or two cotton or sugar resources across the entire map.

QUOTE]

Actually, I don't remember seeing much of the Silver resource on any of the maps either. It might be nice to include more silver deposits on the map as silver mined in New Spain was certainly a major contributor to the wealth of the Spanish empire during the 16th and 17th centuries.

 

[Tinkerbell]

A patch!!!! Thanks Pete Murray & Firaxis.

My suggestions:

I really likes the old education system, where a player had to place the expert colonist in the school as a teacher. Just add that the free colonist who gets the training must get experice (to train a lumberjack, have an expert lumberjack teaching and a free colonist lumberjacking).
The charme of this system is that a player has to think ahead in training, since the production of lumber decreases at the moment a training starts (free colonist working in stead of expert lumberjack).
Last, have training time fixed. Easy jobs 4 turns, medium jobs 6 turns and highly educated jobs 8 turns.

Have every indian village train max 1 european.

A Galleon can carry 6 units/cargo of 1 treassure.

Find a way to sell (not buy) stuff the king has banned.
And let the king wait some more before asking for a tax raise after I refuesed the last one.

Oh, and Pete, did I say thanks for the patch and the announcement about it?
THANKS!

 

[NHJ BV]

Great to see a patch underway. Vive la revolucion!

 

[cephalo]

A patch!!!! Thanks Pete Murray & Firaxis.

My suggestions:

I really likes the old education system, where a player had to place the expert colonist in the school as a teacher. Just add that the free colonist who gets the training must get experice (to train a lumberjack, have an expert lumberjack teaching and a free colonist lumberjacking).
The charme of this system is that a player has to think ahead in training, since the production of lumber decreases at the moment a training starts (free colonist working in stead of expert lumberjack).
Last, have training time fixed. Easy jobs 4 turns, medium jobs 6 turns and highly educated jobs 8 turns.

Have every indian village train max 1 european.

A Galleon can carry 6 units/cargo of 1 treassure.

Find a way to sell (not buy) stuff the king has banned.
And let the king wait some more before asking for a tax raise after I refuesed the last one.

Oh, and Pete, did I say thanks for the patch and the announcement about it?
THANKS!

I agree on all points. I especially like the education suggestion. Much more fun, and with the indian villages only training one, then the schools become more important.

 

[Big Mark]

The colonies simply did not have the facilities needed to build men-of-war because before declaring independence, they relied on the navy of the mother country for protection.

Actually, that is not true. Ships-of-the-line were being built in the New World prior to when the British colonies revolted in the 1770s. Most notably, Havana was a major shipbuilding port for Spain. They had built 80-gun SOLs in Havana in the 1760s, and 3-deck SOLs (MOW equivalents -- there was no real warship larger than a SOL) prior to the French Revolution.

The British colonies were turning out 44-gun two-deckers prior to the American Revolution (Falkland and America come to mind) as well as frigates. The French also built a proto-frigate or two prior to losing Canada in the Seven Years War (French and Indian Wars for you Amero-centric types). I say proto-frigates, because the true frigate emerged late as a warship type -- between the 1740s and 1760s. Prior to that small two-deckers filled that role.

The main reason the Colonies did not build SOLs during the American Revolution was more due to European intervention than inability to build them. The Continental Navy had laid down three, but abandoned two after French entry into the war made them unnecessary. Also those puppies were expensive to run, and the revolutionary nations (starting with the British colonies in the 1770s through the French and Spanish colonies as late as the 1820s) all had one common characteristic. Regardless of the potential wealth of the new nation, the revolutionary governments were all broke.

At one time American commissioners in Europe attempted to buy used SOLs from various European powers. They failed primarily because the nations that they were negotiating with (France, the Netherlands, Sweden and Denmark) thought that they might be involved in a war fighting Britain and wanted to hold onto their ships for their own use.

 

[prolefeed]

Need to raise the exploration points per square discovered for small maps -- you can explore an entire small map, be picky about which FFs you take, and still not have anywhere near enough exploration points to get Lewis and Clark. All the other quasi-tech trees make it possible to get all the FF, so I'm assuming this is an overlooked bug.

 

[Dale]

I've never had a problem getting most/all exploration FF's, and still having some points left over.

 

[CustodianV131]

Glad to see a patch is on the way! I must say I stopped playing it quite a while back, with the patch I'll give it another go.

With Dale's outstanding work it became much better already, but it felt like Firaxis had turned its back on it. Glad to see that's not the case, even with all the time and work going into Civilization 5

 

[prolefeed]

Re this: "With Dale's outstanding work it became much better already, but it felt like Firaxis had turned its back on it. Glad to see that's not the case, even with all the time and work going into Civilization 5"

Assuming Civ 5 incorporates the more innovative aspects of CivCol (in particular the specialized units), it makes sense to try working out the bugs in this game, since anyone posting here is acting in effect as a free beta tester.

Plus, the "not pissing off your most loyal customers" factor ...

 

[Dale]

I think it'll be a while before CivV is heard of. Civ4 is still going very strong, and with the PR damage of CivCol I feel they may head into the realm of new IP to lure new customers in before ducking back in to sequel an existing game (whether it's Civ or not). That's just my gut feeling.

 

[Sarek]

with the PR damage of CivCol I feel they may head into the realm of new IP to lure new customers

New IP...meaning?

 

[player1 fanatic]

Intellectual Property.

Dale probably ment they'll try first to make new game with new brand name. Not something related in any way to Civilization franchise (even if it would be game of similar genre).


P.S.
Of course, that's all just speculation on Dale's part.

 

[Öjevind Lång]

Actually, that is not true. Ships-of-the-line were being built in the New World prior to when the British colonies revolted in the 1770s. Most notably, Havana was a major shipbuilding port for Spain. They had built 80-gun SOLs in Havana in the 1760s, and 3-deck SOLs (MOW equivalents -- there was no real warship larger than a SOL) prior to the French Revolution.

The British colonies were turning out 44-gun two-deckers prior to the American Revolution (Falkland and America come to mind) as well as frigates. The French also built a proto-frigate or two prior to losing Canada in the Seven Years War (French and Indian Wars for you Amero-centric types). I say proto-frigates, because the true frigate emerged late as a warship type -- between the 1740s and 1760s. Prior to that small two-deckers filled that role.

The main reason the Colonies did not build SOLs during the American Revolution was more due to European intervention than inability to build them. The Continental Navy had laid down three, but abandoned two after French entry into the war made them unnecessary. Also those puppies were expensive to run, and the revolutionary nations (starting with the British colonies in the 1770s through the French and Spanish colonies as late as the 1820s) all had one common characteristic. Regardless of the potential wealth of the new nation, the revolutionary governments were all broke.

At one time American commissioners in Europe attempted to buy used SOLs from various European powers. They failed primarily because the nations that they were negotiating with (France, the Netherlands, Sweden and Denmark) thought that they might be involved in a war fighting Britain and wanted to hold onto their ships for their own use.

That's interesting information - thank you! Still, the point remains that the Colonizopedia shouldn't claim that the art of building men-of-war was a "secret" which the mother country ensured that the colonists didn't know. Ridiculous statement.

 

[Jeckel]

Hmm, if this patch fixes the dang passifist Colonial AIs, I may accually play this game again.

 

[CustodianV131]

I think it'll be a while before CivV is heard of. Civ4 is still going very strong, and with the PR damage of CivCol I feel they may head into the realm of new IP to lure new customers in before ducking back in to sequel an existing game (whether it's Civ or not). That's just my gut feeling.

Hmm Take Two needs a big hit. I do feel Civ V is coming just because of that. Its the biggest seller Firaxis can put on the market. Ah isn't it great "these troubled economic times"! DRINK!

 

[Big Mark]

That's interesting information - thank you! Still, the point remains that the Colonizopedia shouldn't claim that the art of building men-of-war was a "secret" which the mother country ensured that the colonists didn't know. Ridiculous statement.

As ridiculous as the difference between cannon and artillery. But WTH, it is an easy play-balance short-cut.

There were "secret" weapons during the period covered during the game (frigates, copper bottoming, and carronades for example), but the did not remain secret for long after being introduced. In fact it is more accurate to describe them as "new" rather than "secret." They were soon imitated (with varying degrees of success) generally within a few years of introduction. But no one had opsec in the sense it existed during the 20th century.

 

[Bad Brett]

Finally!

Education

- Education time should not increase
- Education should not require that you have gold available the turn the student is about to graduate

Suggestion:

- Schools/colleges/universites convert gold into books, let's say 5 gold per book. This cost could increase for every school (like corruption in Civ IV), for example:

Cost Per School/College/Univeristy = 5 gold * number of books produced + # of Schools + 2*# of Colleges + 3*# of Universities.

School:
Ore Miner 15 turns (1 teacher, 45 books)

College:
Ore Miner 8 turns (2 teachers, 45 books)
Blacksmith 15 turns (2 teachers, 90 books)

Univesity:
Ore Miner 5 turns (3 teachers, 45 books)
Blacksmith 10 turns (3 teachers, 90 books)
Statesman 15 turns (3 teachers, 135 books)

If there's no gold available, the schools just don't produce any books that turn. This system would make it very hard to make a big working empire but not impossible.

Terrain
- Add the missing terrain types (savannah, swamp)
- Add resources hidden under forest. This will make people cut down more trees to find valuable resources which is both fun and historically accurate, since North America was covered in forest a few hundred years back.

Diplomacy
- Let the kings have relations to each other that affects the players attitudes towards each other
- Let indians fight with other indians

Extra spices
- A colonist that plant tobacco should have a small chance of turning into a Master Tobacco Planter
- Some kind of quests that makes scouting a bit more interesting
- Hidden resources under forest

 

[r_rolo1]

I still think that the whole LB feature needs to be revamped. LB are responsible for too much stuff in game that don't join well together ( let me see.... why do popping borders would make the king join guns to kill the governor? Technically it is the King's empire that is expanding Or why does getting FF via LB would be even considered? Colonies can't have great men that aren't revolutionaries? And it doesn't even make the slightest sense: until rebelion, they are assets of the Kings empire, right ? Why join guns to kill a governor that joins a group of great minds that are working for his empire ? ). That makes LB management the biggest concern in game by far, a thing that definitely determines the way you play in a overwhelming way ( as if only having only one victory condition was not enough ), a thing that is atleast unintuitive, just to not use stronger words....

That is my greatest peeve with CivCol .And it seems that it will not go away so soon .......

 

[Antilogic]

The British colonies were turning out 44-gun two-deckers prior to the American Revolution (Falkland and America come to mind) as well as frigates. The French also built a proto-frigate or two prior to losing Canada in the Seven Years War (French and Indian Wars for you Amero-centric types). I say proto-frigates, because the true frigate emerged late as a warship type -- between the 1740s and 1760s. Prior to that small two-deckers filled that role.

The main reason the Colonies did not build SOLs during the American Revolution was more due to European intervention than inability to build them. The Continental Navy had laid down three, but abandoned two after French entry into the war made them unnecessary. Also those puppies were expensive to run, and the revolutionary nations (starting with the British colonies in the 1770s through the French and Spanish colonies as late as the 1820s) all had one common characteristic. Regardless of the potential wealth of the new nation, the revolutionary governments were all broke.

Now there is the naked truth--money is always an issue.

Besides, think about it: all the resources required for ship-building were found in America, like timbers tall and strong enough to be made into hulls and masts, iron for forging cannons, etc. What was holding them back was the finances. Same reason why USA's modern battleships aren't in active service right now, but can be reactivated if necessary.


EDIT: I forgot to mention my idea: add a gold resource to the map. Unlike silver mines, which give you an initially valuable resource to trade to Europe, mining gold adds cash directly to your treasury, no shipping to Europe required.

 

[Codeman]

I would like to see more than one market for Europe. You should be able to at least sail to the European nations sponsoring settelments in the New World.

Each European nation would have different market values for goods; bought and sold. There could be greater chance for privateer to capture your shipments to/from European nations not sponsoring your settlemnent; chances could increase/decrease based on that king's diplomatic relations with your king.

Just some thoughts to add a little spice...