Analysis of Romney's defeat

[Camikaze]

How much money would the UK save if they cut the monarchy et al out of the budget?

Link to video.

The tourism logic is a bit sketchy, and I'm not entirely sure how he's defining revenue and what he's counting as land, but the general point stands. The royal family isn't just a cost.

 

[Disgustipated]

I really believe he would have never won because he is Mormon. The country is not ready for a non-Christian (Mormans are a cult) President.

Even the liberals were trashing Romney's religion (even though they claim to support freedom of religion). The conservatives hated his religion as well.

I know the foolishness of reading the comments of a news website, but if you look at some of the comments after CNN ran a story about how a Mormon President would change the white house (ran less than 1 week before the election), you'll see how many people feared a Mormon president.

 

[Mr. Dictator]

I really believe he would have never won because he is Mormon. The country is not ready for a non-Christian (Mormans are a cult) President.

And what makes Mormonism significantly more cult-like than Christianity in general?

 

[kochman]

And what makes Mormonism significantly more cult-like than Christianity in general?

The Mormon belief that you become a God yourself after death (provided you were a good mormon), and that you and your wives will then populate your very own planet comes immediately to mind.

Perhaps you should look into these things just a TAD before asking such a blatantly ignorant question.

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

The Mormon belief that you become a God yourself after death (provided you were a good mormon), and that you and your wives will then populate your very own planet comes immediately to mind.

Perhaps you should look into these things just a TAD before asking such a blatantly ignorant question.

Is that really a Mormon tenet? That sounds awesome.

It also sounds like a parody. Like some weird space settlers' religion out of a Heinlein book.

 

[Ajidica]

The Mormon belief that you become a God yourself after death (provided you were a good mormon), and that you and your wives will then populate your very own planet comes immediately to mind.

Really? You mean I get to become an Emperor of a Planet after death?
<Calls nearest Mormon Church>
"Hi. Where do I sign up?"

 

[Mr. Dictator]

The Mormon belief that you become a God yourself after death (provided you were a good mormon), and that you and your wives will then populate your very own planet comes immediately to mind.

Perhaps you should look into these things just a TAD before asking such a blatantly ignorant question.

Yes, yes, but believing a bush can magically talk and a Bronze Age motivational speaker is going to come back to life after two millennia to eradicate evil is totally logical.

 

[downtown]

The Mormon belief that you become a God yourself after death (provided you were a good mormon), and that you and your wives will then populate your very own planet comes immediately to mind.

Perhaps you should look into these things just a TAD before asking such a blatantly ignorant question.

Wife, not wives.

But yeah, Mormons do believe in the idea of eternal progression.

Given the *huge* number of Mormons we have running things in Washington DC, and the years of history we have of Mormons competently serving as Governors, Senators, Congressmen, Diplomats etc, I think the idea that a Mormon president would turn the White House into some Salt Lake Pipeline is totally stupid.

 

[kochman]

Is that really a Mormon tenet? That sounds awesome.

It certainly helps retain good mormon men... See, Romney will be more than President!

Wife, not wives.

But yeah, Mormons do believe in the idea of eternal progression.

Come on, don't act like polygamy doesn't go on, and that the teachings of this aren't based on the idea of having more than one wife.
I know the "official" stance is, monogamy, these days... but...

Yes, yes, but believing a bush can magically talk and a Bronze Age motivational speaker is going to come back to life after two millennia to eradicate evil is totally logical.

That bush part is Judaism, my man.

And, not come back to life... He already came back to life.
He will return to Earth in His spiritual form... and who knows when it will happen, or if that is even the literal prophesy.

 

[downtown]

Come on, don't act like polygamy doesn't go on, and that the teachings of this aren't based on the idea of having more than one wife.
I know the "official" stance is, monogamy, these days... but...
.

No, Polygamy does not go on in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, period. You will excommunicated SO fast for being married to more than one woman. The compounds that continue to practice in Texas, and along the Utah/Arizona border are 100% not affiliated with the main LDS church. Given how rumors of this practice are still persistent despite having not practiced polygamy for about 100 years, the church prosecutes those cases with vigor. It is not part of the program, full stop.

The only thing that could be construed as polygamy is the fact that a man may be "sealed" to another woman *if his wife dies and he remarries*, with the theological understanding that God will sort it out in the end. That's still pretty clearly *not* polygamy though.

Also, the church overwhelmingly struggles to retain men more than women, so it's not like this doctrine helps at all.

Also, if you're a Christian, that bush part is part of the Christian cannon too.

 

[Leoreth]

That bush part is Judaism, my man.

And, not come back to life... He already came back to life.
He will return to Earth in His spiritual form... and who knows when it will happen, or if that is even the literal prophesy.

If it's only part of Judaism, why is the OT part of the Bible?

The point is, more mainstream Christian sects already include very outlandish elements. Singling Mormon beliefs out because people are less familiar with them and therefore less willing to accept them is just arbitrary.

 

[Tee Kay]

I'm more interested in whatever happened to that Mormon presidential candidate in Mali.

 

[kochman]

No, Polygamy does not go on in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, period.

Ok man...

You will excommunicated SO fast for being married to more than one woman. The compounds that continue to practice in Texas, and along the Utah/Arizona border are 100% not affiliated with the main LDS church. Given how rumors of this practice are still persistent despite having not practiced polygamy for about 100 years, the church prosecutes those cases with vigor. It is not part of the program, full stop.

And the "compound" like houses you see? Where each wife gets a wing?
I've known other mormons that would disagree with you.

Also, the church overwhelmingly struggles to retain men more than women, so it's not like this doctrine helps at all.

All churches do, generally...

Also, if you're a Christian, that bush part is part of the Christian cannon too.

Uh, no, not for this Christian. The OT is almost purely analogies and prophesies as far as I am concerned. I don't think there was a snake offering up apples either...

If it's only part of Judaism, why is the OT part of the Bible?

The point is, more mainstream Christian sects already include very outlandish elements.

Sects are not necessarily Christian... Jehovah's Witness, for example...

Singling Mormon beliefs out because people are less familiar with them and therefore less willing to accept them is just arbitrary.

Not really... there are some very basic contradictions. The idea that you become GOD violates so much that Christianity stands for it is unable to be related to Christianity just because Christ is a figure in it.
Christ is also referenced in Islam... as well as Judaism (where I believe it is taught he was a charlatan wizard type character). Not Christian either...

 

[hobbsyoyo]

Wife, not wives.

But yeah, Mormons do believe in the idea of eternal progression.

Given the *huge* number of Mormons we have running things in Washington DC, and the years of history we have of Mormons competently serving as Governors, Senators, Congressmen, Diplomats etc, I think the idea that a Mormon president would turn the White House into some Salt Lake Pipeline is totally stupid.

Yeah, the arguments used to discredit Mormons from office are much the same leveled against Catholics not too long ago and are equally dumb.

The Mormon belief that you become a God yourself after death (provided you were a good mormon), and that you and your wives will then populate your very own planet comes immediately to mind.

Those aren't 'cult-like' beliefs, those aren't even that different from 'mainstream' beliefs - they are just different.

Really, the only thing that separates a 'cult' from a religion in everyday parlance is the number of followers. Because when you get down to it, there isn't that much difference between the belief in the existence of eternal life in peace and happiness in the presence of God and the belief that you will become a God after death.

Christianity was once considered a weird cult and you can draw parallels between the acceptance of Christianity as a mainstream religion and the acceptance of Mormonism as the same.

One other thing, while the ancient Romans could have said that Christianity was a cult with weird practices, Christianity wasn't that much different from other monotheistic beliefs at the time and even contains many tenets, beliefs and stories from the various polytheistic religions.

Really, cult status is really dependent on number of followers and I'm genuinely surprised you singled out some tennets that Mormons hold as evidence of their cult status. You love to lambast other posters for lacking critical analysis and for sticking to firmly held beliefs (which are almost always beliefs you disagree with - thus the attacking) yet here you do it with alarming ease.

Perhaps you should look into these things just a TAD before asking such a blatantly ignorant question.

Oooh condescension. Edgy.

 

[Leoreth]

Sects are not necessarily Christian... Jehovah's Witness, for example...

Which is why I said "Christian sects". Sect is a fairly generic term which can refer to any branch or denomination of Christianity. Catholicism is a Christian sect.

Not really... there are some very basic contradictions. The idea that you become GOD violates so much that Christianity stands for it is unable to be related to Christianity just because Christ is a figure in it.
Christ is also referenced in Islam... as well as Judaism (where I believe it is taught he was a charlatan wizard type character). Not Christian either...

Your post sounded more like a "look what crazy things they believe in" argument.

 

[kochman]

It was a, they believe in things in direct contradiction to what being a Christian, as defined by Christ, means.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

Your post sounded more like a "look what crazy things they believe in" argument.

It plainly was because all religions/sects/cults/whatever that call themselves Chrisitians that don't fit in with his interpretation of what Jesus said makes up Christianity is one of the biggest No True Scotsmen ever. Everything that isn't what he thinks Christianity should be is a cult.

He'll keep attacking them and labeling them cults because to admit anything else would make him less of a true scotsmen as defined by his belief in what the original true scotsmen said.

 

[downtown]

And the "compound" like houses you see? Where each wife gets a wing?
I've known other mormons that would disagree with you.

Those are polygamist fundamentalist groups that have been kicked out of the main church. That has 100% zero to do with LDS Theology or practice.

I'm an administrator in the LDS church, and my father-in-law in a Bishop. I have all the handbooks in my house and it is *super clear* about kicking out any polygamist like, yesterday.

If somebody in rural Texas or whatever wants to start their own creepy ritual and call themselves Mormons, whatever, but that doesn't make them Mormons.

Also, I don't think you get to decide what's Christian and what isn't if you're going to throw out half of the Bible!

 

[kochman]

Those are polygamist fundamentalist groups that have been kicked out of the main church. That has 100% zero to do with LDS Theology or practice.

I'm an administrator in the LDS church, and my father-in-law in a Bishop. I have all the handbooks in my house and it is *super clear* about kicking out any polygamist like, yesterday.

If somebody in rural Texas or whatever wants to start their own creepy ritual and call themselves Mormons, whatever, but that doesn't make them Mormons.

Also, I don't think you get to decide what's Christian and what isn't if you're going to throw out half of the Bible!

Who said I throw it out?
I don't believe in Biblical literalism...

Anyhow, if you are in direct and blatant contradiction to Jesus... you probably aren't a Christian... but that's just my opinion. I could be wrong.

Anyhow, I don't want to spend anymore time bagging on Mormonism... It really doesn't matter to me what someone believes as long as they aren't physically violating others because of it. There are many mysteries out there, my place isn't to rate them.

 

[peter grimes]

@kochman - a friend of mine is a researcher on women's issues in Mormon culture. I've pressed her on the polygamy thing, what with the popularity of a certain TV show. I take her word for it when she tells me that it's a thing of the past. The church has worked very hard to separate itself from that part of its history, and it's succeeded.

And it's made some people very upset. This is where you get the 'fundamentalist' break-away sects. Those are the compounds you might be thinking of. They are not at all affiliated with the Mormon Church. It would be like claiming that when you give money at the collection plate in a Methodist or Lutheran church the Pope Ratzinger gets a cut. Completely and utterly not at all connected.

There's a fascinating book written by Jon Krakauer that touches on some of this. It's called Under the Banner of Heaven. There are some supremely creepy things that he documents, and our old friend Warren Jeffs makes a cameo even before he made national news.

You'll learn quite a lot from the book, and he's such a thorough researcher! I can't recommend it highly enough - even if you have no interest whatsoever in FLDS stuff. It's relevant to the history of the settling of the western US.