April 2021 Update - Patch Notes Discussion

[Linklite]

My cities now get loyalty problems, in a normal game, without eleanor. It happens due to nearby rival diplomat governers. There are no city states within 9 tiles of Faro. A lot of my cities in the border have this -22.

To me this is new. Does this happen because of the April patch? And why?


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I'm mot sure, I can't see anything definitive, but a few options come to mind:

1. There is a hero from another civ nearby, I'm rubbish at recognising the symbols so I can't check who it is, but could they be causing it?
2. Your UI is different to mine, usually my next turn button has an aura to indicate that I'm going to be in a golden era next turn, are you using mods? Could they be interfering?

I've had a curious loyalty situation once since the patch. I took a city Baghdad to the west of an Ethiopian one (Cairo), then a larger city to the south (Uruk). This meant that Cairo was cutoff, surrounded by myself to the west and south by me and Egypt to the east. North was the Mediterranean with another civ on the other side. There were other Ethiopian cities further to the south of Uruk, but all quite a bit smaller than Uruk. I noticed that Cairo had loyalty problems from being cut off and so left it alone while I worked on the others.shortly before I conquered the last Ethiopian city (other than Cairo), Cairo rebelled and became a Free City. I conquered that last city and knocked out Menelik. A while later, Cairo flipped back to Ethiopia and brought back Menelik! It lost loyalty and flipped to me in short order, but still.
Seemed strange that he didn't have the loyalty to keep the city when he had other cities, but was able to flip it back when he had none left.

Other than that, I've not had any odd loyalty issues that I've noticed since the patch.

 

[Zyxpsilon]

I'd have to guess that since Kristina's (Hint = She already excerts more influence than anyone else) Pingala + Victor + Moksha (three versus your single Magnus) are "commonly pressuring" that city within 9 tiles range away & from their combined influence stack.
Normally, this sort of condition is driven by Amani's Emissary promo only but indirectly -- sooooo there must be a newly patched effect we weren't informed about or it is caused by other (Policy card?) less obvious situation(s).
Weird for sure.

 

[Bosque]

I my most recent game (Dramatic Ages) I was using the policy card that gives +4 culture for each wonder and similar loyalty pressure from each wonder. I was accidently putting all my nearby suzerained city states into revolt, and had to switch to another card so I wouldn't convert them all to Free Cities. Perhaps one of the AI civs was running that card?

 

[Linklite]

I'd have to guess that since Kristina's (Hint = She already excerts more influence than anyone else) Pingala + Victor + Moksha (three versus your single Magnus) are "commonly pressuring" that city within 9 tiles range away their combined influence stack.
Normally, this sort of condition is driven by Amani's Emissary promo only but indirectly -- sooooo there must be a newly patched effect we weren't informed about or it is caused by other (Policy card?) less obvious situation(s).
Weird for sure.

Except, only Pingala and Moksha are in range, and Cardiff is showing no decrease I loyalty...plus I was under the impression that loyalty maxed out at 100 and had no further effect, so governors other than Amani should be(almost) purely defensive?

 

[Linklite]

I my most recent game (Dramatic Ages) I was using the policy card that gives +4 culture for each wonder and similar loyalty pressure from each wonder. I was accidently putting all my nearby suzerained city states into revolt, and had to switch to another card so I wouldn't convert them all to Free Cities. Perhaps one of the AI civs was running that card?

That has to be a mod, I pretty sure there isn't a policy card in the plain game that gives loyalty from Wonders?

 

[Melkus]

Seemed strange that he didn't have the loyalty to keep the city when he had other cities, but was able to flip it back when he had none left.

Have seen stuff like this in dramatic ages games: When a free city accumulates loyalty pressure, it doesn't revert back to zero after flipping. Probably not intended (certainly would make more sense to start at zero after each flip). So Menelik had enough loyalty pressure from earlier "loyalty battles" to get his city back.

 

[iammaxhailme]

I'm playing a Mapuche game for the first time since they were first released. I have realized that their unique improvement cannot go on Volcanic Soil. This is pretty annoying considering you really want to build them next to mountain ranges which often have a couple of volcanoes in them.

 

[Linklite]

Have seen stuff like this in dramatic ages games: When a free city accumulates loyalty pressure, it doesn't revert back to zero after flipping. Probably not intended (certainly would make more sense to start at zero after each flip). So Menelik had enough loyalty pressure from earlier "loyalty battles" to get his city back.

So you're saying that it had flipped to Menelik before I arrived on the scene, and that it for some reason remembered that loyalty pressure?

 

[goatdeer]

Except, only Pingala and Moksha are in range, and Cardiff is showing no decrease I loyalty...plus I was under the impression that loyalty maxed out at 100 and had no further effect, so governors other than Amani should be(almost) purely defensive?

Cardiff does not suffer from loyalty pressure because of Statue of Liberty in the area.

Actually, city states in the area are falling like flies, Cardiff just collapsed. And it specifically says 'rival diplomat governers'. As far as I am concerned, Armani only pressures 2 extra loyalty to any city within 9 tiles. There aren't 11 Armani's anywhere near that city. And it is not just that city, All empires, except from Sweden, are slowly collapsing. Some of these cities even have more pressure exerted onto them. Also Korea somehow managed to grab some cities around the Eastern European side of the black sea, while she is all the way over to Siberia and China. There is Georgia and Persia right between them. And she is holding on to three cities, about to grab Venice through loyalty pressure.

It's a very weird game. I just won through diplomatic victory, so I'm not going to see how this will end. I am using mostly UI mods, and about two other mods (Real Strategy and Smoother Difficulty), but they do not intend to affect loyalty pressure as far as I'm concerned and they never have.

 

[Menocchio]

That has to be a mod, I pretty sure there isn't a policy card in the plain game that gives loyalty from Wonders?

Mandala State is part of the game, not a mod, though exclusive to the Dramatic Ages mode.

 

[Melkus]

So you're saying that it had flipped to Menelik before I arrived on the scene, and that it for some reason remembered that loyalty pressure?

Hard to say without knowing the save. I sort of assumed Cairo was an Arab city that fell to the Ethiopians?

But yes, I've seen free cities that remember pressure from earlier loyalty races. (You can see it below the city banner when you click the loyalty icon) And these numbers can get very high when a free city has been stable for a while. So maybe your later pressure was high enough to flip the city, but could not overcome the earlier accumulation. (Edit: I've read it again, even the pressure that the city you conquered put on Cairo may have been enough.)

 

[Pietato]

Cardiff does not suffer from loyalty pressure because of Statue of Liberty in the area.

Actually, city states in the area are falling like flies, Cardiff just collapsed. And it specifically says 'rival diplomat governers'. As far as I am concerned, Armani only pressures 2 extra loyalty to any city within 9 tiles. There aren't 11 Armani's anywhere near that city. And it is not just that city, All empires, except from Sweden, are slowly collapsing. Some of these cities even have more pressure exerted onto them. Also Korea somehow managed to grab some cities around the Eastern European side of the black sea, while she is all the way over to Siberia and China. There is Georgia and Persia right between them. And she is holding on to three cities, about to grab Venice through loyalty pressure.

It's a very weird game. I just won through diplomatic victory, so I'm not going to see how this will end. I am using mostly UI mods, and about two other mods (Real Strategy and Smoother Difficulty), but they do not intend to affect loyalty pressure as far as I'm concerned and they never have.

Is it a new save? Or might be a mod conflict.

Actually, now that you mention it, I remember seeing -24 loyalty for a lot of tiles while searching for settler spots. Maybe something has broken.

 

[Pietato]

Maya/ancestral hall double builder settles just feel so fantastic

It might feel fantastic but it is very bad. Audience Hall is easily the best for the Maya.

 

[Melkus]

It might feel fantastic but it is very bad. Audience Hall is easily the best for the Maya.

At least it's an advantage that's really useful for the Mayan AI.

 

[Bosque]

That has to be a mod, I pretty sure there isn't a policy card in the plain game that gives loyalty from Wonders?

It is a Dramatic Ages Golden Age card available, IIRC, in the classical and medieval ages only.

 

[iammaxhailme]

It might feel fantastic but it is very bad. Audience Hall is easily the best for the Maya.

Yes, playing a Maya game is one of the very few situations where I DON'T build the ancestral hall.

 

[goatdeer]

Is it a new save? Or might be a mod conflict.

Actually, now that you mention it, I remember seeing -24 loyalty for a lot of tiles while searching for settler spots. Maybe something has broken.

I started this game after the patch. Going to start a new game now, I'll keep an eye out.

 

[SammyKhalifa]

At least it's an advantage that's really useful for the Mayan AI.

To be fair I got an extremely lucky map with all 12 possible settle spots within the mayan 6 tile distance being valid spots. I think all except 3 started with two builders. I'm not sure that I had to build or buy another builder the rest of the game

 

[Pietato]

Yes, playing a Maya game is one of the very few situations where I DON'T build the ancestral hall.

Yeah, they are the only ones who I do not build the Ancestral Hall with.

 

[Noble Zarkon]

I just started a new game as Poland and as part of Lithuanian Union the bonus to holy site adjacency has changed from the previous bonus for all districts to a major boost for encampments.

The civ wiki mentions now that Holy Sites receive +1 adjacency from any district, when playing as Poland.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Poland was always that way?

Just started a game as Poland and yes the in game description of Lithuanian Union is incorrect, it has not changed at all!

@charrison FYI