C2C: Promotions
- Thread starter ls612
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Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
I considered them more as missions than promotions except that the mission shows as a promotion. So you can have the unit have the "Flee" mission which allows them to run away by moving faster but at a lesser strength. I would have tried to automate the Flee one to have the unit run to the nearest friendly city or defensive point and then heal but it is not easy to code. I used the Fort Garrison one quite a lot. Unfortunately there is not a "select all units that don't gave a mission" button.
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
Ah. I have not actually played, just been looking though the civpedia.
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
Many of these strongly overlap with plans ahead. The Trained-> line sounds much like Size Matters Combat Quality upgrade promos. Overrun is an ability that will be put into play soon that directly counters fortified combat and other bonuses. Though the same concept could simply be expressed as Run Down or Trample or something I have such a concept in the works for Size Matters to take advantage of size differences which is much what this represents. Parrying is an equipment development planned already.
Now, that said, if promotions like these were set to turn off when such combat mod options were ON and replacing them with other types of representations of these effects then it would make sense to be able to have both. Two ways to represent parry could make sense from a mod design point of view.
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
@TB
Well whatever you do you may want to "loot" the PAEV mod for icon/buttons that fit your needs. They seem well done and could be very useful for your project.
Well whatever you do you may want to "loot" the PAEV mod for icon/buttons that fit your needs. They seem well done and could be very useful for your project.
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
I'm not familiar with the mod... what does PAEV stand for?
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
platyping
Sleeping Dragon
Shouldn't hero be before legend.
Although it should be pie's concern
Although it should be pie's concern
LumenAngel
King
or a Fire Emblem-like : only axe can have parryng spear, only spear wan have parrying sword, only sword can have parrying axe.
Favored Ennemy is more like all the "Anti-melee" "Anti-Mounted" promotions.
JosEPh_II
TBS WarLord
Would anyone associated with promotions and their increasing numbers please reconsider the number of Promos in the game now? It's a bewildering array with too much overlapp from too mant choices. It's, impo, oversaturated to the point of it's taking too much gameplay time to promote a unit. And is sucking the fun out of promoting a unit. So after awhile I just stick with a set of promotions and have given up on the mix and match of a thousand combinations. And it's harder to tell what you are really getting from these combos.
It's just too much and is detracting from the Mods appeal.
JosEPh
It's just too much and is detracting from the Mods appeal.
JosEPh
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
I don't know I kinda like the variety of promotions you can get now. You can really build your unit to specify in different areas.
JosEPh_II
TBS WarLord
That was available before 1/2 of these promos now in the game came into being.
It really is too much and needs reduced by 1/3 to 1/2 the # of promos now in this mod.
You can still have diversification but don't have to deal with obfuscation and consternation which are both Fun killers.
If your users stop using what you are making maybe you should consider that your players are giving you the straight lowdown. Therefore revise your defensive thinking and bring the Fun/playability back, even if it means you have to lay aside an idea you like.
Promo pendulum has swung too far.
JosEPh
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
@Joe
Would it help if such promotions were harder to get? Such as requiring say Combat IV or V? That way the average player is limited to what they can get but someone who wants to specialize their unit will need to earn getting the extra choices.
Would it help if such promotions were harder to get? Such as requiring say Combat IV or V? That way the average player is limited to what they can get but someone who wants to specialize their unit will need to earn getting the extra choices.
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
You're not even playing with the extra combat options right? So what promos could you be talking about here? The ones with the violet background?
Most promos I feel are very basic and it's in our best interests to keep them that way.
You'll need to start zeroing in on examples of what you'd change. Just saying, cut the amount of them down isn't really productive. There's really still a number of places where we need more developed just to repair some balance gaps. I'm wondering what specific promotions are causing these feelings.
Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
Example: Anti-throwing and anti-archer why not just anti-ranged?
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
Those violet one taken from RI probably should have higher Combat promotion levels since they are so much better than the standard blue promotions.
JosEPh_II
TBS WarLord
@T-Brd,
I had a nice long list made up but then my ISP went down and I lost it.
And no I'm not using extra Combat Options. I'm not ready to play Squad Leader with C2C BtS. And I really don't want too either.
I use the Violet promotions, those I like for my Mounted units, but the Pawn symbol and down Curving Arrow and such are overlapping duplicates of the basic promos. Why do I need 3 different types of withdrawal? Or 1st strikes? We already had promos that gave 1st strikes or withdrawal. To repeat myself it gets tedious to "specialize" my units all the time.
And what DH said.
Tattoos and the Tattoo Building, when has a Tattoo made a fighting unit better?
I posted a link to Sid Meier's recent interview and his basic tenets for making a Fun replayable game. Perhaps you should read it, maybe Hydro too. It's in the Caveman to Cosmos thread.
EDIT: http://kotaku.com/the-father-of-civilization-584568276 Take a minute to read it.
JosEPh
I had a nice long list made up but then my ISP went down and I lost it.
And no I'm not using extra Combat Options. I'm not ready to play Squad Leader with C2C BtS. And I really don't want too either.I use the Violet promotions, those I like for my Mounted units, but the Pawn symbol and down Curving Arrow and such are overlapping duplicates of the basic promos. Why do I need 3 different types of withdrawal? Or 1st strikes? We already had promos that gave 1st strikes or withdrawal. To repeat myself it gets tedious to "specialize" my units all the time.
And what DH said.
Tattoos and the Tattoo Building, when has a Tattoo made a fighting unit better?
I posted a link to Sid Meier's recent interview and his basic tenets for making a Fun replayable game. Perhaps you should read it, maybe Hydro too. It's in the Caveman to Cosmos thread.
EDIT: http://kotaku.com/the-father-of-civilization-584568276 Take a minute to read it.
JosEPh
Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
I think we should take these back to the RI implementation or at least closer to it. They are all special enhancements to normal promotions. You should make a decision that you want them and use a Great General or in some cases a Great Hunter to get them. They don't have to be national or great wonders I have shown how to make a building act like a national wonder elsewhere so you only build one of each type.
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
Well... something should be done to make them a lot more limited I feel. They greatly imbalance the rest of the promotion scheme such that it makes it simply challenge the player to remember how to access them and ignore every other option since they are far more empowering than any other promos.
The 'downcurving arrow' is a Minor Withdrawal promo. It allows units that can't normally develop any withdrawal the ability to develop some but at a very poor rate. I'm sure you've noticed that the Flanking promos grant much better withdrawal rates. Generally that promo is offered to footsoldiers while the improved withdrawal promotionline (flanking) is offered to mounted units that are already naturally faster.@T-Brd,
I had a nice long list made up but then my ISP went down and I lost it.
I use the Violet promotions, those I like for my Mounted units, but the Pawn symbol and down Curving Arrow and such are overlapping duplicates of the basic promos. Why do I need 3 different types of withdrawal? Or 1st strikes? We already had promos that gave 1st strikes or withdrawal. To repeat myself it gets tedious to "specialize" my units all the time.
And what DH said.
Tattoos and the Tattoo Building, when has a Tattoo made a fighting unit better?
I posted a link to Sid Meier's recent interview and his basic tenets for making a Fun replayable game. Perhaps you should read it, maybe Hydro too. It's in the Caveman to Cosmos thread.
EDIT: http://kotaku.com/the-father-of-civilization-584568276 Take a minute to read it.
JosEPh
The Pawn symbol (Sophistication) is an Anti-Barbarian line. It gives some small basic combat bonus to compensate units that take these promos with some generally improved combat ability since not all opponents are Barbs. It's mostly useful if you're having a lot of problems with barbarians or if your army is primarily assembled to take down barbarian cities.
As for Throwing... they're a totally different combat class to Archery. At least we HAVE a line of promotions against those - we still don't against Explorers so they can sometimes be very powerful simply by the default that you can't specialize units against them.
Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
So! They may be totally different combat classes but you counter both the same way, you hold your shield up, form a tortoise and so on.
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