Canadian Elections!

[Evie]

So they would vote against it? Excellent.

Yep. If Harper gets a minority (and he doesn't bend over four way backward to buy either support from the NDP and LPC - unlikely, but Harper in survival mode...), we either get a second election campaign, or else the GG asks the Liberals to form a government.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

You're the one who brought up reputation!

I brought up respect, which is not the same thing.

I've been reading a variety of news sources and some give Canada glowing marks, and others don't. There are some areas in which Stephen Harper is utterly despised, and I've been on sites where people ask what went wrong with Canada - we used to be so tolerant and non-warlike, and now we're not. This is beyond the usual "everybody in Canada clubs seals for fun" crap I used to contend with while part of Care2 (a mis-named site for many reasons). I don't like being assumed to be a warmonger, or anti-environment, or anything else negative just because that's how Harper is. That's not the reputation I want Canadians to have.

And now we've got international monitors observing the election... and people are relieved, because the way this one's been organized and how the advance polls have had so many things go wrong has left people distrusting it.

Yep. If Harper gets a minority (and he doesn't bend over four way backward to buy either support from the NDP and LPC - unlikely, but Harper in survival mode...), we either get a second election campaign, or else the GG asks the Liberals to form a government.

He'd probably find a few Liberals to bribe to cross the floor, in return for cabinet jobs or something. It's worked before, and it's likelier to be able to find blue Liberals than blue NDP.

I don't know how far we can trust the current GG, as he's a Harper appointee. Mind you, we discovered we couldn't trust the former one either, as she caved when Harper prorogued Parliament.

 

[Zelig]

I brought up respect, which is not the same thing.

Semantics.

I've been reading a variety of news sources and some give Canada glowing marks, and others don't.

Right, some people like Harper, others don't. You obviously fall into the second camp.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Semantics.

Pierre Trudeau. He's the perfect example of a politician who was both hated and loved, and respected no matter whether you liked him or despised him. And he had quite the reputation for arrogance, and also for not taking any BS from the Americans or the Canadian separatists.

Right, some people like Harper, others don't. You obviously fall into the second camp.

Loathing would be a better word.

 

[Antilogic]

So why has the NDP lost its lead over the last month? The CBC tracker has shown them steadily losing ground for awhile.

 

[Zelig]

Pierre Trudeau. He's the perfect example of a politician who was both hated and loved, and respected no matter whether you liked him or despised him.

Lots of people in western Canada don't respect Trudeau.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

So why has the NDP lost its lead over the last month? The CBC tracker has shown them steadily losing ground for awhile.

He supported a Muslim woman's request to take the oath of citizenship while covering her face with a niqab. For various reasons that doesn't sit well with a lot of people.

Lots of people in western Canada don't respect Trudeau.

My grandparents always did, and so did I. I realize that puts me in a small minority in this part of the country.

 

[Evie]

He supported a Muslim woman's request to take the oath of citizenship while covering her face with a niqab. For various reasons that doesn't sit well with a lot of people.

Poor explanation IMO - Trudeau supported it too and he's on the rise.

I think it's simply a matter that Trudeau managed to make himself credible enough for people who were worried about trying out something new and Ontarians worried about Bob Rae to rally to him. THAT put him ahead of the NDP in the polls, and a lot of Anybody-but-Harper vote switched from Orange to Red at that point.

 

[warpus]

The NDP surge from the summer has sort of fizzled out I think. Public perception of Tom Mulclair as "The not Harper guy" has been dropping and Trudeau has also started looking more and more Prime Minister-like, more confident, more able to run a country, not just a boy with a famous name, etc. and Mulclair has been Mulclair. You know what you get with Mulclair, there's nothing new there. I think that there are a lot of left-leaning voters out there who are riding public perception and so are more prone to switch ship from NDP to Liberal or vice versa, depending on the circumstances, strategic voting considerations, etc.

So I think the Liberals just got some good momentum due to all those factors and now they're looking pretty damn good. Trudeau's also been targeting conservative voters in these last couple days and that seems to be working too.

Do I dare say that a Liberal majority is possible, if this keeps up? Not likely, but it actually seems possible now, if conservative and NDP support keeps dropping.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Poor explanation IMO - Trudeau supported it too and he's on the rise.

I think it's simply a matter that Trudeau managed to make himself credible enough for people who were worried about trying out something new and Ontarians worried about Bob Rae to rally to him. THAT put him ahead of the NDP in the polls, and a lot of Anybody-but-Harper vote switched from Orange to Red at that point.

It's one of the reasons. Far from the only one, or the most important one. But don't underestimate what kinds of things can change a voter's mind.

You know what one of the things is that made me decide against supporting Justin Trudeau? The fact that he handles his youngest child in an unsafe way, holding the baby high above his head with only one hand. The slightest miscalculation could result in an injured or dead child. What would be the legal consequences if such a thing happened?

 

[Zelig]

I'm sure it's statistically safer to hold a baby above your head with one hand than to take your baby for a drive in a car.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Read the article, look at the pictures of him holding the baby, and then throw statistics at me.

 

[Zelig]

I don't really care enough to do that. You're free to look up leading causes of infant mortality via accidents yourself if you think it's actually an important issue.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Note that I didn't actually ask you to look up any statistics about this. I couldn't care less about the statistics. What I do care about is that I saw photos of him holding his infant son in a careless, negligent way that could result in injury or death if he miscalculated. Even his wife has misgivings about it.

 

[Zelig]

How do you know that it's careless or negligent if you don't know that it's actually more dangerous than taking the infant for a drive in a car?

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Stop trying to pick fights, 'k? I see enough obtuse people on CBC. You're better than that.

This is not a safe way to hold a baby.

 

[Zelig]

That's not even as bad as I expected, it's clearly for a photo op. I was expecting a shot of him hoisting his baby around on stage or in a crowd or something. I think including children in political campaigns in any capacity is dumb, because they're irrelevant, but that doesn't look particularly dangerous to me.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

I've never had children, but even I know that's dangerous. It doesn't make any difference whether it's on stage or in a crowd. All it takes is one small miscalculation or slip, and BOOM! the kid is on the floor or ground, very likely injured, possibly dead. Trudeau claims that he knows for sure how to do it, but kids are not all the same, and he's not a doctor.

This is stupid, reckless, and even his wife doesn't like it.

 

[Evie]

It's not a particularly uncommon way to hold your baby while playing with him, tho.

Not that I object to voting against Trudeau (far from), and I *probably* wouldn,t hold mine that way.é

 

[Valka D'Ur]

It's not a particularly uncommon way to hold your baby while playing with him, tho.

Do most people do it in the middle of a political rally, with lots of strangers around, where the baby could fall on cement or asphalt or any other hard surface?

Remember how people were appalled when Michael Jackson dangled his baby over the balcony? This is the same kind of thing - showoff and negligent.