Change the system

[JohnRM]

I read a statistic the other that says that among poor communities, one of the only ways to pay for college and "get out" is to join the army. Now that we are fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan many of the soldiers there are from the poorest places in America. We seem to have dumped our wars on the poorest people in our country, the people with the smallest amount to fight for are doing all the fighting. These people who live in hell, go over to fight for the right to...stay in the sqaulor? Meanwhile, the corporations who benefit from the war and the rich people who own these corporations line their pockets with money made from the 2,500 American soldiers who have been killed in the fighting. These soulless corporate machines who don't really see anything in all the death and destruction except another dollar to be made. The politicians on all sides who are corrupt, who blatantly take bribes from corporations, sit there and talk about liberation and freedom and justice? It makes me sick to see these white collar *******s, who have never had to sacrifice anything and who have never known hardship to sit there and talk about how we should "deal with the situation". In my home state it's amazing the wealth divide, the town next to mine is one of the richest in America while if you drove 40 minutes away you would be in the middle of the most dangerous and poor city in America. The system needs to change, it needs to change now!

China, Cuba, North Korea, Vietnam, and a small number of other places in this world are looking for you.

 

[amadeus]

It may not be eradicated completely from humans to try to take advantage of others, but I think in the past it was close, the hunter-gatherers had a lifestyle where there was no organized violence, and lived without authority. It would take a lot of change and time, but again, one can hope.

The average lifespan was probably about 30. There was no electricity, no running water, no abundance of food, no medicine or treatment for injuries, and virtually no intellectual stimulation of any kind.

I'd even question whether you'd call it humanity or not, because it resembles the life of animals.

 

[blackheart]

wow what is this "change the system" thread... people in poor communities are probably there for a REASON! living off welfare is not a way to live if you are in a poor community it is probably because you, or your parents grandparents and further back were lazy and if the military is the only way out, than so be it. People need to think that if the military will get you into college you need to join for the sake of your future children

I resent that. I am poor because my parents immigrated here for a better life and work 40+ hours a week in a meatpacking plant to make a living, so don't get off calling the poor lazy or welfare leeches.

 

[ainwood]

Moderator Action: Before this discussion gets off-track, please refrain from suggesting that anyone who is poor is on welfare, and anyone who isn't is corrupt.

Unfortunately, one view was suggested in the OP, the other in response. Lets not degrade it further.

 

[amadeus]

I resent that. I am poor because my parents immigrated here for a better life and work 40+ hours a week in a meatpacking plant to make a living, so don't get off calling the poor lazy or welfare leeches.

I know you don't personally subscribe to this viewpoint I'm about to put forward, but I'll put it there for anyone else that actually does: don't get off calling the economy a zero-sum game where the rich used force, coercion, or other unethical practices to achieve success.

 

[malclave]

We seem to have dumped our wars on the poorest people in our country, the people with the smallest amount to fight for are doing all the fighting. These people who live in hell, go over to fight for the right to...stay in the sqaulor?

http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Dec2005/d20051213mythfact.pdf

Excerpt:

Myth: The Military attracts disproportionately from poor or underprivileged youth.
Fact: Military recruits mirror the US population and are solidly middle class.
A recent report shows that more recruits come from middle income families, with far fewer drawn from poorer families (Figure 2). Youth from upper income families are represented at almost exactly their fair share.

 

[blackheart]

I know you don't personally subscribe to this viewpoint I'm about to put forward, but I'll put it there for anyone else that actually does: don't get off calling the economy a zero-sum game where the rich used force, coercion, or other unethical practices to achieve success.

I hear that sometimes, and personally I laugh when people think the man is keeping them down. Of course it holds a little truth because people with rich parents have a higher stepping stone in life, but skill and dedication can even things out. That's the great thing about America: people have opportunities and chances.

 

[tomsnowman123]

The average lifespan was probably about 30. There was no electricity, no running water, no abundance of food, no medicine or treatment for injuries, and virtually no intellectual stimulation of any kind.

I'd even question whether you'd call it humanity or not, because it resembles the life of animals.

Don't worry, if I were to live that lifestyle, I would allow some technology.

I hear that sometimes, and personally I laugh when people think the man is keeping them down. Of course it holds a little truth because people with rich parents have a higher stepping stone in life, but skill and dedication can even things out. That's the great thing about America: people have opportunities and chances.

It's just that the rich have more opportunities and more chances.

 

[IglooDame]

http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Dec2005/d20051213mythfact.pdf

Excerpt:

Hey, let's not let facts get in the way of a solid rant, here.

 

[bhsup]

I read a statistic the other that says that among poor communities, one of the only ways to pay for college and "get out" is to join the army.

Alternatively, if you live in the State of Missouri, be sure to obtain a decent grade point average and the State will pay for your higher education.

(Which, by the way, is how it should be done. State level, not Federal level. Three cheers for federalism!)

 

[tomsnowman123]

Alternatively, if you live in the State of Missouri, be sure to obtain a decent grade point average and the State will pay for your higher education.

(Which, by the way, is how it should be done. State level, not Federal level. Three cheers for federalism!)

That's one step in the right direction. I think schools should be given over to local control at the level of the classroom and individual school. And at least for now, higher education should be publicly financed (hooray for my home town!).

 

[Erik Mesoy]

Breathe deep, zeon252...

'The system' is rotting. Witness the INDUCE Act, the CDA-COPA-CIPA series, the Digital Millennium Copyright Act, Microsoft's effectively unfettered right to spy on their users, for a start. (You don't own a Windows computer. It is literally impossible.) Continue with the consent-less spyware/malware forcible installed by major companies such as Sony, and the rejection of the Net Neutrality act.
This is classic.
" the more misperceptions held by the respondent, the more likely it was that s/he [...] depended on commercial television for news." I have a dozen others like that.

There's a huge mass of unwillingly uninformed voters out there, and they constitute inertia.

 

[Samson]

http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Dec2005/d20051213mythfact.pdf

Man that uses some confusing statistics. You have to wonder if they are not trying to hide the true picture behind obsure stats.

Percentage recruits vs. 18 - 24 year olds? Do they really mean that 25% of 18 - 24 year olds in the Downscale / Lower Mid / Midscale socio/economic groups are in the milatry? That is huge.

 

[Bozo Erectus]

Just this morning I found out that someone I used to work with will soon be deployed to Iraq. The poor kid is a victim of the American Dream, which these days, really is just a dream. He generated so much debt trying to make the dream a reality, by going to college, that he had no option but to join up to have his debt wiped clean.

So this bright, intelligent young man may, god forbid, lose his life or one of his limbs, fighting a war for Haliburton, because his pursuit of an education rendered him a pauper.

The American Reality is beginning to eclipse the American Dream.

 

[joycem10]

Just a point on the first post. I went through both college and law school on loans, grants and scholarships. So can anyone else with decent grades regardless of that individual's economic background.

 

[Bozo Erectus]

Sadly Joycem, thats complete bullcrap.

 

[IglooDame]

Well, I suppose one solution is to have a social-status requirement in order to enlist in the military. If your parent(s) don't make $35K/year, sorry, you can't sign up.

 

[joycem10]

Sadly Joycem, thats complete bullcrap.

Then explain how I managed to do it.

 

[Bozo Erectus]

Then explain how I managed to do it.

During that period of time, were you trying to support a family? Or were you being supported by your family?

 

[IglooDame]

During that period of time, were you trying to support a family? Or were you being supported by your family?

So this kid started a family and then went to college?