China set to launch first Aircraft Carrier

[Gatsby]

I've read that China is developing a Carrier-killing missile, so perhaps it is just for show

 

[GoodGame]

I've always been skeptical of the American pledge to defend Taiwan.

I have no real knowledge in the area, but ti was my impression that the ROC could repel an invasion of Taiwan proper. Were that to ever change, and China were to really press the issue, how much support for a war against China would there be in the west?

If Taiwan is an important lynchpin in defending Korea and Japan, then I suspect that the USA would defend it. At any rate, ARMING Taiwan is big business for the USA.

 

[Skwink]

What we must do is clear. We must sink it.

 

[Hornblower]

If the chinese submarine program is any indicator of sea worthiness then I wouldn't worry. It will sink itself.

 

[Bordz]

As someone else said, it will just be a tech demo to learn the intracasies of producing a Carrier in preparation for the construction of their own original design. They did the same thing with the production of their high speed rail network, the trains that they run on their were originally developed by Siemens I think, however the way the contract was structured was that Siemens had to help the Chinese produce the tech and infrastructure to become self sufficent in any future developments.

Since the ability to domestically produce arms is more considered a national priority and a strategic asset in most countries I suspect that the same case exists with there carriers as above.

 

[Dachs]

That's not necessarily easier unless you have the ability to simultaneously launch a couple thousand missiles from beyond the range that the launch platforms can be attacked.

Target saturation: have enough launch platforms and, in theory, the Navy can't bomb or Tomahawk them all. Plus, there's the element of timing.

 

[Miles Teg]

As has already been hashed over, this is a training carrier, and probably won't be anything more until it's already obsolete. Wired has a really great article about this.

Key points:

The American Pacific fleet is stronger than the PLN will be for a very, very long time. The US Navy as a whole is probably stronger than the rest of the world combined. At very least, we can support twice as many sea-based planes as the rest of the world combined.

We have powerful allies with blue-water navies in the region, such as Japan, South Korea, Australia, India and Thailand. China doesn't. None of them are interested in a Chinese hegemony.

China's navy can't provide it's single carrier with anything like the support network of every American carrier group.

We spend way, way more money on our military than China does. China's military budget is 1.4% of ours.

Did I mention that the US navy is pretty much invincible?

 

[squadbroken]

Yes and I don't understand that either.

When you have the tiger by the tail you are reluctant to let go.

 

[TopGearFanatic]

I have trouble taking the Chinese military seriously after the Top Gun clip.

 

[Whiskey_Lord]

At least they didn't follow it up with the volleyball scene.

 

[IglooDame]

Target saturation: have enough launch platforms and, in theory, the Navy can't bomb or Tomahawk them all. Plus, there's the element of timing.

Except that those launch platforms need a localized target. Shooting "carrier-killer" missiles down the bearing of the nearest AWACS radar source isn't going to accomplish anything.

As for the Chinese, this is another HMS Argus or USS Langley. Comparisons to the German High Seas Fleet are more than a bit of an overreach.

 

[Dragonlord]

How many of you people actually read the article? It says they are planning to eventually build 4 more carriers of their own, this one is only the beginning, sort of to learn how. They are also developing appropriate planes.
One technically inferior carrier is nothing, but how about when they have 5?

Another thing to remember is that a carrier is an almost exclusively offensive weapon. You don't need carriers to defend your own coasts, after all.

Also, why is everyone comparing to the US Navy - thus assuming the Chinese would go heads-up against the US? Why would they do that?

Think instead what the Chinese might do with a strong navy, based around 5 carriers, in their own corner of the world. They may be thinking a carrier fleet would be enough to deter the US from intervening in any regional power plays, especially since they also have a hefty economic club to swing against the US if necessary. You Yanks do remember who holds your national debt, don't you?

So, yes, the Chinese investing in carriers, of all things, is somewhat worrisome. It shows they are thinking offensively.

 

[holy king]

they're projecting their power to the african west coast, i dont see any connection with the usa.

 

[Flying Pig]

I've read that China is developing a Carrier-killing missile, so perhaps it is just for show

We have quite a lot of those: we used to use a very nice one called Exocet but it's old and rubbish now. That terminology is rather misleading - it's not all that hard to sink a carrier if you shoot something big at it, the idea is to stop the enemy getting a bead on the thing and intercepting the missiles if they do.

The slightly humorous aspect is that they don't have naval fixed wing craft to launch from it....yet.

The RN solution to that one was to ask a friend - the USMC at one point, but more likely the French - if they wanted to base their jets on the thing, but I don't know how that would work for the Chinese.

 

[plarq]

PLA Navy will have a hard time against South Korean, Japanese and Taiwanese navy combined.

 

[Patroklos]

Think instead what the Chinese might do with a strong navy, based around 5 carriers, in their own corner of the world. They may be thinking a carrier fleet would be enough to deter the US from intervening in any regional power plays

Five technically inferior mini Chinese carriers would end up with the same fate as one technically inferior Chiese mini carrier. Sunken scrap metal next to a pier, the victims of LGB.

especially since they also have a hefty economic club to swing against the US if necessary. You Yanks do remember who holds your national debt, don't you?

The US weilds a far larger economic club against China than they do against the US. Without the US China has nothing going for it.

So, yes, the Chinese investing in carriers, of all things, is somewhat worrisome. It shows they are thinking offensively.

Your conclusion that carriers are only for offense is not accurate. Carriers can be used to defend your interests in far off parts of the world to. Tactically offensive is not the same thing as strategically offensive.

 

[aronnax]

What we must do is clear. We must sink it.

How very Israeli of you. Olmert would be proud.

The future of Naval warfare lies with submarines. An aircraft carrier, although is still deadly and powerful in terms of both strike-range and strength will be useless without a submarine fleet to protect it.

 

[Patroklos]

Submarines are only good for intel and sea control. They can lob the odd cruise missile here or there but it is a token effort, they are pretty much one trick platforms.

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

China is set to launch its first Aircraft Carrier!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-13693495



So whats the forum opinion of this? Is it a bad idea or good idea on China's part?

I reckon it could be a bad idea because it needlessly antagonises the US. In economic terms the US and China have a good relationship. They pay political lipservice to their respective ideologies, but everyone knows they're pretty tight because of the extensive economic ties.

Why should China start challenging the US militarily by building a dope navy when they have congruous economic interests?

This article is very very misleading.

First, the Chinese didn't build the carrier, it was towed there a few years ago after being sold to them by the Russians. Part of the terms of that sale was the complete removal of all armaments from the ship. Varyag can only ever be used as a training carrier, if even that. That they've chosen to use it as that is what the news is, not that the Chinese have a carrier hulk. When it was towed there most people expected it to be stripped and turned into a shopping mall.

This does not represent blue-water power projection capabilities by the Chinese.

Now it's possible that the Chinese will study the carrier as they repair it, and probably build a carrier at some point in the future based on what they've learned, but Varyag just isn't it.

 

[Flying Pig]

Submarines are only good for intel and sea control. They can lob the odd cruise missile here or there but it is a token effort, they are pretty much one trick platforms.

As far as Aronnax was from the mark, can I advance the little matter of throwing nuclear missles around? That's a pretty important job.