[NFP] Civilization VI: Possible New Civilizations Thread

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I'm fine with all the civs included in Civ6 (although I'd still like to have some gaps filled), but if I were to replace one, this would be Scotland. Not only because there are better options for Celtic civilization (thankfully we already have Gaul), but I also find Scotland's design quite boring: Casus Belli, golf courses, amenities... meh.

Scotland is famous for its very beautiful castles, and there is nothing that references this in the game, maybe if the unique infrastructure was a castle or fortress instead of a golf course, I might like Scotland more. And Casus Belli-related abilities are always boring to me. Hopefully that Scotland will be balanced in April.

Agree on the CB ability. It's my least favorite in the game especially when you take in consideration that John Curtin has even more of an incentive in his ability to liberate cities. Honestly I'd even like it better if it was about declaring Reconquest wars.

I'm fine with the Golf Course though. At least the building on the tile resembles a Scottish house/palace. I'd much rather they change the Highlander and make them less like the Highland regiments found in the British army and more like the Medieval/Renaissance Era highlanders.

 

[Republic of San Montuoso]

I'm fine with all the civs included in Civ6 (although I'd still like to have some gaps filled), but if I were to replace one, this would be Scotland. Not only because there are better options for Celtic civilization (thankfully we already have Gaul), but I also find Scotland's design quite boring: Casus Belli, golf courses, amenities... meh.

Scotland is famous for its very beautiful castles, and there is nothing that references this in the game, maybe if the unique infrastructure was a castle or fortress instead of a golf course, I might like Scotland more. And Casus Belli-related abilities are always boring to me. Hopefully that Scotland will be balanced in April.

I wholeheartidly disagree with you. Except for Robert Bruce (who clearly seems out of touch with the rest of the civ), Scotland is wonderful for me. You say that their ability is "meh", but let's remember that Scotland one of the few science civs that don't rely on "flat bonuses" they'd get whatever they do if they're not too stupid (Korea). The way Scotland works and need to stay happy to become a scientific powerhouse is quite unique and it's probably, from all the scientific civs in the game, one of the best thought.
In this way, the Golf Course, while gimmicky, is truly Scottish and -best that, for example, Canada- synergizes perfectly with Scotland CUA.
The highlander... meh. But, to be honest, except if they have some very unique ability (like Canada's Mountee or Portugal's Nau), I don't factor UU to judge a civ, because I don't really care.

Also, you say that Scotland is famous for its very beautiful castles... First, I find that reducing Scotland to "beautiful castles", while there was beautiful castles pretty much everywhere, would be way more "meh" and not very "unique" in the sense that a castle is pretty much the most basic and representative monument for all medieval Europe. Plus, France already have a castle of its own, so wouldn't it be redundant? At least, the Golf Course is 1) historical 2) visually unique and beautiful 3) synergize with Scotland civ ability 4) in a way, stray themselves from the stereotypical "Scottish castle" we might have. It has been a surprise, and we should have more surprises of this type.

Secondly, the Scottish Enlightment is, basically, what created the modern world. The proportions of discoveries, theories and inventions made by Scots is truly impressive. The only issue I have with this is that it's more a British than Scottish trait... But, if I had to choose between a British England and a British scotland, I'd choose Scotland and their Enlightment over the British Museum or Workshops of the World.

I mean, Canada is stereotipically gimmicky and people complain it's overly Canadian; Scotland is based upon historical elements, but not necessarily the first we thought of, and people complain it's not Scottish enough.

For me, Scotland (except Robert Bruce's ability (and the Highlander, but I'm part of people that consider 90% of unique units irrelevant)) has a brillant design. It's not the design at fault, it's merely its "legitimacy" in the game as yet another British civ in an already crowded Europe (I know talking about "legitimacy" is touchy, but I don't mean that Scotland is irrelevant, on the contrary, but that, in an overcrowded Europe, adding a second British civ seems overfeeding)

 

[Unmitigated Gaul]

I wholeheartidly disagree with you. Except for Robert Bruce (who clearly seems out of touch with the rest of the civ), Scotland is wonderful for me. You say that their ability is "meh", but let's remember that Scotland one of the few science civs that don't rely on "flat bonuses" they'd get whatever they do if they're not too stupid (Korea). The way Scotland works and need to stay happy to become a scientific powerhouse is quite unique and it's probably, from all the scientific civs in the game, one of the best thought.
In this way, the Golf Course, while gimmicky, is truly Scottish and -best that, for example, Canada- synergizes perfectly with Scotland CUA.
The highlander... meh. But, to be honest, except if they have some very unique ability (like Canada's Mountee or Portugal's Nau), I don't factor UU to judge a civ, because I don't really care.

Also, you say that Scotland is famous for its very beautiful castles... First, I find that reducing Scotland to "beautiful castles", while there was beautiful castles pretty much everywhere, would be way more "meh" and not very "unique" in the sense that a castle is pretty much the most basic and representative monument for all medieval Europe. Plus, France already have a castle of its own, so wouldn't it be redundant? At least, the Golf Course is 1) historical 2) visually unique and beautiful 3) synergize with Scotland civ ability 4) in a way, stray themselves from the stereotypical "Scottish castle" we might have. It has been a surprise, and we should have more surprises of this type.

Secondly, the Scottish Enlightment is, basically, what created the modern world. The proportions of discoveries, theories and inventions made by Scots is truly impressive. The only issue I have with this is that it's more a British than Scottish trait... But, if I had to choose between a British England and a British scotland, I'd choose Scotland and their Enlightment over the British Museum or Workshops of the World.

I mean, Canada is stereotipically gimmicky and people complain it's overly Canadian; Scotland is based upon historical elements, but not necessarily the first we thought of, and people complain it's not Canadian enough.

For me, Scotland (except Robert Bruce's ability (and the Highlander, but I'm part of people that consider 90% of unique units irrelevant)) has a brillant design. It's not the design at fault, it's merely its "legitimacy" in the game as yet another British civ in an already crowded Europe (I know talking about "legitimacy" is touchy, but I don't mean that Scotland is irrelevant, on the contrary, but that, in an overcrowded Europe, adding a second British civ seems overfeeding)

I agree. I find Scotlands interplay between science and amenities a lot of fun. I have said many times but if golf course amenities scaled based on tile appeal it would be a big improvement and incentivize more active play from Scotland. Maybe we get that in April?

 

[Zaarin]

And no, they aren't exactly my top picks either, but I suspect the history of both are more interesting than you would give credit if you just dismiss them out of hand.

I'm not dismissing them out of hand; I find Eastern European history in general very interesting and sadly not widely known. I'm just not eager for a bunch of hypernationalist Balkan microstates filling up the roster any more than I am eager for a roster full of postcolonial nations. In fact, if we could just generally keep nation-states of any kind out of the game, that would be grand.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I wholeheartidly disagree with you. Except for Robert Bruce (who clearly seems out of touch with the rest of the civ), Scotland is wonderful for me. You say that their ability is "meh", but let's remember that Scotland one of the few science civs that don't rely on "flat bonuses" they'd get whatever they do if they're not too stupid (Korea). The way Scotland works and need to stay happy to become a scientific powerhouse is quite unique and it's probably, from all the scientific civs in the game, one of the best thought.
In this way, the Golf Course, while gimmicky, is truly Scottish and -best that, for example, Canada- synergizes perfectly with Scotland CUA.
The highlander... meh. But, to be honest, except if they have some very unique ability (like Canada's Mountee or Portugal's Nau), I don't factor UU to judge a civ, because I don't really care.

Great now I want a Medieval Schiltron UU as part of Robert's ability that has a charge to build a Scottish Castle.

I agree. I find Scotlands interplay between science and amenities a lot of fun. I have said many times but if golf course amenities scaled based on tile appeal it would be a big improvement and incentivize more active play from Scotland. Maybe we get that in April?

Except maybe when near water because playing golf near water wouldn't be very appealing. Then again Scotland is filled with lakes, I mean lochs, so I guess it fits.

 

[Republic of San Montuoso]

Except maybe when near water because playing golf near water wouldn't be very appealing. Then again Scotland is filled with lakes, I mean lochs, so I guess it fits.

Are you kidding? Seeing your opponent loosing his ball in the nearby lake is one of the key component of golf fun!

Great now I want a Medieval Schiltron UU as part of Robert's ability that has a charge to build a Scottish Castle.

That would be waaaay better that its current ability and would sound truly Scottish and not British for once... But, once again, except maybe Radio Oranje, it's hard to compete with "most useless and less impactful" LUA.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Are you kidding? Seeing your opponent loosing his ball in the nearby lake is one of the key component of golf fun!

Fair point. I have only played mini-golf and that's accurate.

That would be waaaay better that its current ability and would sound truly Scottish and not British for once... But, once again, except maybe Radio Oranje, it's hard to compete with "most useless and less impactful" LUA.

I at least like to set up domestic trade routes in all my games, to connect all my cities with roads, so I would say Radio Oranje is slightly better.

 

[Zaarin]

I at least like to set up domestic trade routes in all my games, to connect all my cities with roads, so I would say Radio Oranje is slightly better.

The lack of roads until I could hook up railroads hurt in my Portugal game. (Yes, I know Portugal can run domestic routes, but the foreign ones are way more tempting even in the early game--the first civ I can say that is true of.)

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

The lack of roads until I could hook up railroads hurt in my Portugal game. (Yes, I know Portugal can run domestic routes, but the foreign ones are way more tempting even in the early game--the first civ I can say that is true of.)

I haven't gotten far in my Portugal game but so far all of my domestic trade route routes go over water as well. That's what I get for settling all my cities around one bay.

 

[Henri Christophe]

Devs if you see this please avoid islamic era of Persia. Iranians prefer Achaemenid and Sassanian era! We will be forever grateful!

why avoid Islamic era of Persia? Do you mean, after the Islamic Revolution is to early to be a civ.

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

why avoid Islamic era of Persia? Do you mean, after the Islamic Revolution is to early to be a civ.

I believe he means Persia under Ismail I, Nader Shah, Abbas the Great, etc.

 

[Zaarin]

why avoid Islamic era of Persia? Do you mean, after the Islamic Revolution is to early to be a civ.

I suspect his reasoning is that Achaemenid, Arsacid, and Sassanid Persia is a heritage that all Persians can claim, whereas the Islamic empires like the Safavids, Qajars, etc. would exclude Zoroastrian and Eastern Christian Persians (who together make up a pretty significant minority in Iran). Also it's my understanding that the Iranian diaspora sees the Achaemenids and Sassanids in particular as unifying symbols. We won't talk about the fact that the Zoroastrian Sassanids off-and-on persecuted or harbored Eastern Christians based on their perceived relationship with Rome at the moment...

 

[Yudhisthira]

Persia can have 2 leaders thou, one from Zoroastrian Era (preferably Sassanid one) & other from Islamic Era.

 

[Zaarin]

Persia can have 2 leaders thou, one from Zoroastrian Era (preferably Sassanid one) & other from Islamic Era.

Persia is one of the very few civs I think fully deserving of three leaders: an Achaemenid, a Sassanid, and a later Islamic one. Firaxis, unfortunately, seems unaware that Persian history extends past the Achaemenid period.

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

Persia can have 2 leaders thou, one from Zoroastrian Era (preferably Sassanid one) & other from Islamic Era.

Nader Shah for the win!

 

[pokiehl]

Persia can have 2 leaders thou, one from Zoroastrian Era (preferably Sassanid one) & other from Islamic Era.

Don’t really like this idea whatsoever. I’d want them to be separate civs. Pre-Islamic and Islamic Persia have different infrastructures and unit types for their unique components. It would be extremely incongruous to have a Safavid leader with a Satrap’s Court UB for example. Same reason I am 100% in favor of always maintaining the Byzantium and Rome split.

To be honest even Achaemenid and Sasanid Persia won’t mix well as one civ. A part of me is really bothered by the pairidaeza for Persia which features domes, which are much more in line with Sasanid architecture rather than Achaemenid.

 

[Zaarin]

Nader Shah for the win!

And for the other two periods my choices would be either Darius I or Xerxes I and Shapur II.

 

[Zaarin]

Don’t really like this idea whatsoever. I’d want them to be separate civs. Pre-Islamic and Islamic Persia have different infrastructures and unit types for their unique components. It would be extremely incongruous to have a Safavid leader with a Satrap’s Court UB for example. Same reason I am 100% in favor of always maintaining the Byzantium and Rome split.

To be honest even Achaemenid and Sasanid Persia won’t mix well as one civ. A part of me is really bothered by the pairidaeza for Persia which features domes, which are much more in line with Sasanid architecture rather than Achaemenid.

If they'd like to split Persia into two or three civs, I'm on board with that, too...but if the only way to get more Persia is alternate leaders then I'll take it.

 

[Henri Christophe]

Persia can have 2 leaders thou, one from Zoroastrian Era (preferably Sassanid one) & other from Islamic Era.

Persia really deserve to have more leaders, I don't know that much about Persian history, but i'm kind of tired this very old Persian kings and want something more middle ages.

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

Persia really deserve to have more leaders, I don't know that much about Persian history, but i'm kind of tired this very old Persian kings and want something more middle ages.

I don't think that there were many Persian nations in the Middle Ages, though I could be wrong.