SirMediocrity
Prince
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Personally, I feel like someone such as Hezekiah or Josiah would be cool leaders for a Hebrew or Judean civ (Hezekiah especially, as he is known for being one of Judah's most "righteous" rulers).
[NFP] Civilization VI: Possible New Civilizations Thread
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Lord Lakely
Idea Fountain
Saul is probably the best choice of the Israeli leaders, by default.
For abilities I would just give the Hebrews a map to the nearest Natural Wonder, bonus faith from discovering Natural Wonders and City States, and bonus appeal in cities that have at least one Natural Wonder or World Wonder (bonuses stack) inside their borders.
He's really not? We can start with the fact that we have extra-Biblical sources that confirm that Hezekiah existed and was a highly effective ruler; we can combine that with the fact that the Bible agrees he was a highly effective ruler. It makes him probably the best choice for pre-Classical Judah that we have.
That seems a little strange to me. Is it because on TSL they'd start next to the Dead Sea? They're hardly the only civ to start next to a Natural Wonder on TSL...
Thenewwwguy
Deity
Interestingly, in the specific file that kinda confirmed Kublai, I believe he leads Vietnam. This could be from simply bug fixing or some code testing, but what if the game mode which comes with that pack is some play on randomly assigning leaders to civs, or something like that
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It was probably a simplified file name for Kublai and Vietnam.
Thenewwwguy
Deity
Gran Colombia is near Roraima, India would spawn relatively near Everest (and Kailash if you play with terra mirabilis)
Khmer start near Tonle Sap (again, not sure if that’s a terra mirabilis wonder) and Ha Long Bay
France is somewhat near Matterhorn, Mapuche near Torres del Paine, Ethiopia isn’t too far away on TSL from Kilamanajaro. Arabia/Egypt should be somewhat near Eye of the Sahara, among other Sahara based wonders, both in the base game and Terra Mirabilis
And Maya start near Ik-Kil
asked a friend who understands programming and file organization and that’s not what he said, but he could’ve been wrong
They're practically right on top of Sahara el-Beyda.
Aside from the fact that "leaders by merit of conquest" has never really been a thing in Civ, I consider Kublai having a 0% chance of leading Vietnam, considering the Mongol conquest of Vietnam failed. Three times.
Well Kublai Khan never ruled Vietnam. He's literally even more of a Korean ruler than a Vietnamese one.
From the looks of it it's simply a not very creative name for an expansion. KublaiKhan_Vietnam being the name of the expansion where you could have, IDK, Ethiopia_Cults for the last one and so on.
AntSou
Deity
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That cannot be the case because a similar file exists for Ethiopia, which reads:
So if that were the case the format would be Menelik_Ethiopia_
Xefjord
Prince
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I have returned after the long nap to discover Vietnam is soft confirmed. This pleases the Xefjord.
I do kind of hope they pick someone else other than the Trung sisters though. I get that it is an easy diversity pick. But there is so many other competent and interesting leaders out of Vietnam as well. My boi Le Loi is pretty much King Arthur.
I do kind of hope they pick someone else other than the Trung sisters though. I get that it is an easy diversity pick. But there is so many other competent and interesting leaders out of Vietnam as well. My boi Le Loi is pretty much King Arthur.
Lord Lakely
Idea Fountain
In terms of recognisable names? Yes, either him, Salomé or Herod spring to mind. Hezekiah I personally don't know and would for the most part be a surprise choice for Civ 6 at least. I need to look him up though before I comment more though.
Wandering tribes of Israel/Promised Land hybrid ability. Most modded abilities I've seen people slap onto Israel usually amount to tons of gold and faith from desert tiles which seems really uninspired (not to mention Mali exist). But I like the idea of having a land-based Maori and Israeli lore definitely lends itself to that idea.
Besides, the Jewish religion is so interwoven with Hebrew culture, to a point the culture itself is refered to as Jewish, that I don't really have any qualms towards tapping a bit of mythos into their design.
Why would Kublai Khan lead Vietnam. Why? Even if the Yuan Dynasty controlled the lands of the Nam Viet, wouldn't it make sense to have, you know, a Vietnamese person lead them instead as opposed to a Mongol warlord/Chinese Emperor.
That would be like adding Augustus in the game... as a leader for Egypt.
I love the idea of Salome Alexandra, but of course she's a completely different era. Hezekiah is described as the greatest king of Judah by the Bible. He restored the Temple, resisted Sennacherib, and purged corruption. Archaeological records confirm that he made Judah a power in the region.
I see. I'd see them as more of an agricultural, Faith-based turtle civ myself, if Judah, or an economic, Faith-based turtle civ if Judea, but yeah, I see where you're going with that.
Worse, because Augustus succeeded at conquering Egypt; Kublai failed to conquer Vietnam. (I mean, they made Vietnam pay tribute, sure, but the Vietnamese pretty roundly rebuffed their actual invasion.)
Kublai's invasions failed. Vietnam fought it off and then became a Yuan tributary. Which is basically a way of saving face on both sides. Yuan could conquer Vietnam, but it would cost them dearly. Both sides knew it so Vietnam stayed fully independent, but paid the lipservice of being a tributary so that Kublai wouldn't be forced to actually go through with the conquest just to make good on his and his empire's name.
Same. The girls are fine and pretty famous even in Vietnam, but historically speaking, they were nothing but a small footnote in history, nor Vietnamese. It's best to think of them as more akin to the imagined Biblical origins of various European nations. Not exactly much to write on them historically other than the fact they failed and got singled out when Vietnam came into being as one of the very few records of non-Chinese and anti-Chinese something happening in the rough geographic area where Vietnamese ethnogenesis would eventually take place.
Maybe that's why they took it out to fix the file.
I agree there is no way that he'll lead Vietnam, considering we're not even 100% sure if he'll lead China.
Lord Lakely
Idea Fountain
I mean, i think Trung Trac would be an excellent choice, in fact? Specifically because of the massive cultural legacy they currently possess in Vietnam proper. Not a single Vietnamese person would be annoyed if they got repped by a Trung sister.
It would be a gimmick if Firaxis added BOTH Sisters as ONE leader though.
It would be a gimmick if Firaxis added BOTH Sisters as ONE leader though.
I mean, they are culturally significant, but their association with Vietnam and Vietnamese is a founding myth.
In reality, they were of a different culture which got supplanted by Vietnamese over the span of the next millenium. Eventually the folk tradition equated them with Vietnamese themselves but it's the same sort of story as that of Huns and Hungarians slowly being seen as one and the same people in common consciousness despite it being a completely ahistoric folktale. As I said, if you want to strike off Vietnam from the list of civilisations in the game, they're a fair choice. It's just if you want to teach people a thing or two about the local history, it would be much better to pick someone who's actually Vietnamese and accomplished and maybe leaving the Zheng sisters for unique abilities or other side-note references.
In reality, they were of a different culture which got supplanted by Vietnamese over the span of the next millenium. Eventually the folk tradition equated them with Vietnamese themselves but it's the same sort of story as that of Huns and Hungarians slowly being seen as one and the same people in common consciousness despite it being a completely ahistoric folktale. As I said, if you want to strike off Vietnam from the list of civilisations in the game, they're a fair choice. It's just if you want to teach people a thing or two about the local history, it would be much better to pick someone who's actually Vietnamese and accomplished and maybe leaving the Zheng sisters for unique abilities or other side-note references.
8housesofelixir
Emperor
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Technically every Qing ruler after Hong Taiji was the co-leader of both China and Mongolia, and after Yongzheng Emperor they were all technically the co-leader of Tibet as well.
For the Trung sisters, I think historically speaking they are similar to, say, Dido and Tomyris. Vietnam also have lots of other significant rulers, they are not that a decisive choice - we also have, for instance, as Thenewwwguy mentioned, the Vietnam Emperors that fought with Kublai.
Thenewwwguy
Deity
I wasn’t suggesting that Kublai would lead vietnam—in fact, in the contrary, right there, I noted that it was probably used for some bug fixing or code checking purposes
Can you imagine the ire they’d draw? that literally makes no sense. Ppl would be so pissed off that vietnam doesn’t show up, let alone them intentionally making us think that they’d add vietnam and then not doing it.
Why are they not considered Vietnamese? Do you mean ethnically they aren't Vietnamese or is it the fact that they were born into Chinese occupation and the actual state called Vietnam didn't appear until later?I mean, they are culturally significant, but their association with Vietnam and Vietnamese is a founding myth.
In reality, they were of a different culture which got supplanted by Vietnamese over the span of the next millenium. Eventually the folk tradition equated them with Vietnamese themselves but it's the same sort of story as that of Huns and Hungarians slowly being seen as one and the same people in common consciousness despite it being a completely ahistoric folktale. As I said, if you want to strike off Vietnam from the list of civilisations in the game, they're a fair choice. It's just if you want to teach people a thing or two about the local history, it would be much better to pick someone who's actually Vietnamese and accomplished and maybe leaving the Zheng sisters for unique abilities or other side-note references.
Even if that's the case that didn't stop Seondeok from appearing and leading a unified Korea.
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