[NFP] Civilization VI: Possible New Civilizations Thread

[Duke William of Normandy]

My general point was that pointing to any one issue as the reason for the Civil War is simplistic. It was a complicated conflict that had many sources. (In case anyone is wondering, I'm not Southern, and I'm not defending the Confederacy. I'm simply pointing out that trying to pin a very complicated war on any one issue is doomed to oversimplification.)

Slavery was the main crux, but other issues such as states' rights, tariffs, federal power, different industries for the North and South, boiling tensions, James Buchanan, etc. had a role to play as well.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Would that be like having Victoria also lead Scotland or India?

More like Kublai leading China considering the seat of power ended up going from Lisbon to Rio de Janeiro for a couple of years.

I don't care for another dual leader but at this point anything could happen. Though she was incapacitated by the time they moved from Portugal to Brazil so it most likely wouldn't happen.

 

[Josephias]

Lisbon still needs to be possibly be replaced. I think there is a possibility it could go to Copenhagen.

It has as well a neat chance for cool CS symbol whether this one (city)

or this one (county)

Altough the county did not include the city proper, I'd favour the county one, as the "round thingies" (lily leaves or hearts) are a curious thing in denmark's royal heraldry (see simplified coat of arms below), shared with friesland.

 

[bbbt]

I'm merely exposing facts... like you or not

and - making abstraction of what slavery means in terms of horror and shame for Humankind - indeed, slaves were treated fairly ... for practical issues mainly ... the same way you don't damage a car or a horse on purpose (and please do not pretend I am defending slavery with this statement) .. even in ancient Roma (where slaves were "cheaper" to obtain) mistreating slaves just because were considered "uncool"

That's utter BS. Read a little about say the sugar plantations of the carribean under Spain and France where slaves were basically worked to death and replaced with new shipments off the boat. Read about say colonial atrocities in Congo under Leopold for abuses of colonialism even beyond explicit 'slavery'. For that matter, do any basic reading about how work animals were treated in the past or even in a lot of areas of the world today if you even think most of the world treats horses like elite racehorses. You are 'stating facts' you are spouting uninformed ignorance.

Moderator Action: This conversation is exactly why we try to keep people on topic. This off topic discussion has turned uncivil and is ruining this thread. Enough of it, get back on topic. leif

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

It has as well a neat chance for cool CS symbol whether this one (city)

or this one (county)

Altough the county did not include the city proper, I'd favour the county one, as the "round thingies" (lily leaves or hearts) are a curious thing in denmark's royal heraldry (see simplified coat of arms below), shared with friesland.

Considering Lisbon's is currently just squiggly lines I guess supposed to represent waves on the ocean it would be a nice needed upgrade.

That simplistic design could also be a hint that it was eventually going to be replaced.

 

[Myomoto]

I would definitely still prefer a proper Denmark civ again. It felt weird in 5 to only have 2 of the 3 Scandinavian countries, and it feels weird now

Either you include just one, or you include all of us.

It's like Huey, Dewey, and Louie...

 

[Josephias]

Considering Lisbon's is currently just squiggly lines I guess supposed to represent waves on the ocean it would be a nice needed upgrade.

That simplistic design could also be a hint that it was eventually going to be replaced.

Indeed they represent the ocean, and they are part of Lisbon's coat actually. They just forgot to put in the ship, and the coolest part, the crows

Edid: just to add a different option on how it could have been, this is the stylized coat used today by the city.

 

[Myomoto]

Indeed they represent the ocean, and they are part of Lisbon's coat actually. They just forgot to put in the ship, and the coolest part, the crows

Edid: just to add a different option on how it could have been, this is the stylized coat used today by the city.

Man, we already had one discussion on guerilla elephants, now you're telling me there are seamen crows?

 

[Josephias]

Man, we already had one discussion on guerilla elephants, now your telling me there are seamen crows?

Shh... don't tell away Portugal's UU so soon

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I would definitely still prefer a proper Denmark civ again. It felt weird in 5 to only have 2 of the 3 Scandinavian countries, and it feels weird now

Either you include just one, or you include all of us.

It's like Huey, Dewey, and Louie...

Magaret leads Denmark, Norway and Sweden in Civ 7.

Indeed they represent the ocean, and they are part of Lisbon's coat actually. They just forgot to put in the ship, and the coolest part, the crows

Edid: just to add a different option on how it could have been, this is the stylized coat used today by the city.

Leaving off the best parts make it even more a reason to eventually replace it.

Shh... don't tell away Portugal's UU so soon

A Nau releasing crows on unsuspecting ships.

 

[Myomoto]

Magaret leads Denmark, Norway and Sweden in Civ 7.

Mmm.. acceptable

 

[Zaarin]

I would definitely still prefer a proper Denmark civ again. It felt weird in 5 to only have 2 of the 3 Scandinavian countries, and it feels weird now

Iceland would like a word.

I don't feel a strong need for all the Scandinavian countries, but I wouldn't mind another shakeup: like Iceland as the "Viking civ" and Margaret-led Denmark as the post-Viking civ in Civ7.

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

Mmm.. acceptable

Yet another landmark in Civilization!

 

[onepurpose]

there is a Kalmar Union civ mod for civ V

 

[Jkchart]

I have to disagree. My complaints are not solely from a historical perspective, though I also have that in mind. Out of all the civs released so far only the Maya have actually been fun to play. The entire pass has felt phoned in to me.

I agree mostly with this on civ designs (and a lot of your comments). I enjoyed the Maya a ton and they were one of my favorite (and best) games of Civ I've played, Gran Colombia...meh not my style. Happy to have Byzantium, but more as an opponent than one to actually play because I just DON'T care for OP dom civs. Ethiopia was also not a favorite of mine because frankly...it's a boring design (the trait name for Menelik is so bizarre for what it does) in addition to being just OP bonuses, though I like them better than those two and was happy to have them back at all. I do like Gaul a LOT because you have to actually think a bit on how to play them. I do actually like Babylon because it forced me to play the game differently for progression (like actively THINK because of the massive science penalty), which was nice for a powerful civ (though yes, flavor wise they are...eh. The Palgum is nice though!).

Very much looking forward to Vietnam since it's going to be a much more restrictive but rewarding way to play like the Maya/Gaul.

 

[Ticio]

sorry for the off-topic, but natives were officially considered subjects of the Spanish Monarchy from the very beginning .. Cristopher Columbus himself pretend the natives to be enslaved , what was rejected by the monarchy .. From the very beginning of America's colonization there were issued laws to protect natives.. (so called "leyes de indias" or "indian laws - see wikipedia for detail) .. well , I say "officially" , I mean that not always these laws were respected (in fact, there was a formalism "se acata pero no se cumple" ≈ "heed, but not accomplished" , meaning the respect to royal authority and the impossibility to carry on the mandate... ), but the fact is that form the very beginning were attempt to protect natives

(being the indians subjects and not susceptible of enslavement , there was a necessity to "import" workforce from Africa.. first by the Portuguese and the Dutch.. later by the English.. the Spanish marginally and in a much lesser level)

Until mid.S.XVIII, America colonization was "reserved" to the Kingdom of Castile , so was uncommon subjects from the other territories (Aragon, Low Countries, Naples, etc.) Anyway , there were not "two categories".. and mixed marriages were common.. despite black legend stuff, the fact is that today , in Latin America (or Hispanoamerica) -unlike anlgo-saxon america- you can find natives and mixed race in every country ...

Maybe my post was a bit confusing. As I tried to say, that all were subjects of the kings of Spain (Spanish so to speak) but they were under different laws.

The criollos had different dutys and rights as "European", the same for the natives americans. But also the rest of the subjects of the king (aragoneses, italians, dutch,etc). I was no saying that they went to america (very few did) but that they had diferents laws too. The americas were under the Castillian Law but had their own laes too.

That could be good or bad, depending on what. It is normally known as the "casta system" but I personally see it as just the traditional feudal system but with greater ways of ascending (The "gracias al sacar" of 1795 for example).

In fact, it has nothing to do with a Caste system.


In fact, it is obvious the native Americans were considered integral part of the Spanish society as they were declared citizens in the first Constitution of 1812 (not the africans blacks for example, that tell you already the differences of social status).

Of course, racism day by day, inequality, forced labor, etc, was a thing and has is resonance in today’s Latin-American societies.

Anyways, the point of the post was to tell why I, personally, think that we have the understanding of America just as 1 continent and not 2.

 

[sweetbrown89]

Observation:

As of the end of NFP, we will still not have no city-states representing Austria, Denmark, or Assyria.

I think at the very least we can expect another city-state expansion next year, even if we don't get any more civs.

If you look at my chart, it’s because that “niche” is already represented by Hungary, Norway, and Sumeria, respectively

I do think Portugal, if anything, could sell a DLC pass by itself.

But, for sake of argument, what would the second frontliner for a second season pass have to be? The Iroquois? Morocco? Denmark?

Also, so far we haven't had a single DLC pack this pass with a new civ. Both of the prior two were anchored with a returning civ (Ethiopia, Babylon). So the strongest argument for a returning civ like Portugal is that the devs are still looking at selling the DLC packs individually as well.

(I really don't want the sixth DLC pack to be Portugal, because the game would still feel incomplete without at least token representation of Austria, Denmark, the western US, Burma, etc. etc. There's still a lot of gaps on the map, even as far as city-states go.)

Um...Gran Colombia, Gaul, and Vietnam are all completely new

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

Um...Gran Colombia, Gaul, and Vietnam are all completely new

Gaul was in Civ 4. The others you're right about.

Edit: Nevermind... They were in Civ 2.

Edit 2: Nevermind... They were called the Celts back then.

 

[Zaarin]

Gaul was in Civ 4. The others you're right about.

Gaul is new. "The Celts" were in Civ4, albeit led by Brennus and Boudicca rather than just the Stereotype Queen.

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

Gaul is new. "The Celts" were in Civ4, albeit led by Brennus and Boudicca rather than just the Stereotype Queen.

Weren't they in Civ 2 as well? Just going off the Civ wiki here.