Consumer Ethics

[_random_]

So recently, my sister put in an order of K-Cups for our Keurig machine. I got a box for myself, liking it stronger than she does, and found the selection of coffees that were both fair-trade and extra bold rather lacking. I wound up getting a strong blend of beans that were likely picked under dubious circumstances. Had I gotten a fair-trade blend, it very likely would have come from a company that also sells non fair-trade coffee, so I'd still wind up indirectly supporting the sorts of labor practices the coffee industry is known for. Then there's the question of how effective fair trade is at curbing these practices.

Pole's coming for this example. It's a fairly specific ones, but I like to think it touches on some broader issues, and I'd be curious to see you folk weigh in on them.

 

[GhostWriter16]

A link on what "Fair-trade" is would be helpful

 

[hobbsyoyo]

Honestly, buy what you want, what tastes good. Call me evil, but I don't care.

 

[Core Imposter]

Fair trade is jousting at windmills afaik.

Q. What would you call someone drinking fair trade coffee in one hand while holding an iphone in the other?

A. Just another liberal.

 

[The_J]

Edit, at above: Invalid, at the end. No, better exaggerated. You'd describe every form of donation as a hypocrisy, if the person only owns a single luxury product. If everyone had that stance, the world would be a totally cruel place.

I'd put the factor "fair trade" as very last argument to consider.
If you can get what you want from an ethical company and you can afford it...then you can think over fair trade or not.
Else...my budget and my taste are more important.

And no, I don't consider me a bad person.

 

[_random_]

Fair trade is jousting at windmills afaik.

Q. What would you call someone drinking fair trade coffee in one hand while holding an iphone in the other?

A. Just another liberal.

See, I know you're trolling here, but I think you raise a valid point. How does one develop a consistent consumer ethic dealing with coffee and fruit and sneakers and electronics? How much effort is it worth, and how responsible are you for what people do with the money you give them? Is consistency really necessary? Isn't cutting back on support for bad labor practices a good thing, even if you don't totally ween yourself?

 

[Core Imposter]

See, I know you're trolling here, but I think you raise a valid point. How does one develop a consistent consumer ethic dealing with coffee and fruit and sneakers and electronics? How much effort is it worth, and how responsible are you for what people do with the money you give them? Is consistency really necessary? Isn't cutting back on support for bad labor practices a good thing, even if you don't totally ween yourself?

Okay, now you have me as a conservative at a disadvantage because this is one place I think government should step in rather than leave everything in the hands of the free market.

And, btw, hidden in the troll's teeth are both treasures and traps, you just have to look in his mouth to see.

 

[cardgame]

Fair trade is jousting at windmills afaik.

Q. What would you call someone drinking fair trade coffee in one hand while holding an iphone in the other?

A. Just another liberal.

Hipster*

 

[classical_hero]

Drinking tea is much more socially responsible.

 

[BvBPL]

Get a small pot (or even better, a French press) and brew your own coffee after buying the beans you want and feel good about buying. K-cups are nice, but real fresh brewed coffee is superior.

 

[Leoreth]

Fair trade is jousting at windmills afaik.

Q. What would you call someone drinking fair trade coffee in one hand while holding an iphone in the other?

A. Just another liberal.

Good point, false conclusion. The solution to this hypocrisy is not to gleefully embrace irresponsible consumerism altogether.

 

[Mise]

See, I know you're trolling here, but I think you raise a valid point. How does one develop a consistent consumer ethic dealing with coffee and fruit and sneakers and electronics? How much effort is it worth, and how responsible are you for what people do with the money you give them? Is consistency really necessary? Isn't cutting back on support for bad labor practices a good thing, even if you don't totally ween yourself?

The more Good you do, the better a person you are, obviously... Consistency is not necessary, but the more consistently good you are, the better a person you are (again, obviously). I'd rather be good most of the time but occasionally accused of hypocrisy by people who are evil all of the time. Even if Fair Trade doesn't work, it at least has a chance of working -- whereas you know that buying from companies with bad labour practices will be bad.

And if you find none of those options morally acceptable, you could always, you know, not drink coffee...

This is a very simple question with a very simple answer. You have listed the poll options from Most Good to Most Bad, morally, so you already know the answer... You're just looking for excuses

 

[Smellincoffee]

Keurig machines in general are problematic for me, because when buying one you automatically reduce your options. To make coffee, you can only buy their little cups that plug into the machine -- their little plastic disposable cups. Filters are simple and made of paper that can be easily recycled.

 

[wolfigor]

my main problem with so called fair trade coffee is well explained by wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_trade_coffee#How_much_reaches_the_farmer.3F

Nobody in the Fairtrade industry is willing to disclose how much extra they charge for their branded coffee, how much of this extra charge reaches the third world, how much reaches the farmers or whether the farmers make a profit from Fairtrade. In four cases it has been possible to find out. One British café chain was passing on less than one percent of the extra charged to the exporting cooperative;[19] in Finland, Valkila, Haaparanta and Niemi[20] found that consumers paid much more for Fairtrade, and that only 11.5% reached the exporter. Kilian, Jones, Pratt and Villalobos[21] talk of US Fairtrade coffee getting $5 per lb extra at retail, of which the exporter would have received only 2%. Mendoza and Bastiaensen[22] calculated that in the UK only 1.6% to 18% of the extra charged for one product line reached the farmer. All these studies assume that the importers paid the full Fairtrade price, which is not necessarily the case.[23] Critics claim that many counter-examples would be needed to show that these are not typical. These calculations may be optimistic, as they do not take into account what happens between the farmer and the exporter.

In principle I would go all the way with fair trade coffee if all the surcharge consumers pay would go to the farmers.
However this is not the case and only a small fraction if any of the extra price tag reaches them.
Fair trade coffee is probably more about marketing and very little about fair prices for the producers

 

[azzaman333]

Buy on taste first.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

In far too many instances, "fair trade" is an oxymoron.

 

[Mise]

So what coffee are you drinking today?

 

[Terxpahseyton]

The more Good you do, the better a person you are, obviously... Consistency is not necessary, but the more consistently good you are, the better a person you are (again, obviously). I'd rather be good most of the time but occasionally accused of hypocrisy by people who are evil all of the time. Even if Fair Trade doesn't work, it at least has a chance of working -- whereas you know that buying from companies with bad labour practices will be bad.

And if you find none of those options morally acceptable, you could always, you know, not drink coffee...

This is a very simple question with a very simple answer. You have listed the poll options from Most Good to Most Bad, morally, so you already know the answer... You're just looking for excuses

I am inclined to embrace this post. On the other hand, "excuses" may at least in theory be sufficient to have no moral obligation. But it to me seems a folly exercise to exactly figure out where the boundary between obligation and the lack thereof is supposed to go. So "the more good you do" seems a well enough criteria.

 

[Tycho Brahe]

I would never buy a Keurig machine, Nespresso, Senseo, or whatever their called. The machines are cheap, but you'll tied to buing the coffee from them for the trest of your life. (The machines life, at least)

It's the same scheme as the printers. The machines are cheap, but the real profit is in the Ink cartridges.

I use a french press, and the coffee is fair trade and organic. (And it tastes good) I don't mind sending an extra dime to the people who actually grow the beans. Just to make a statement that not all consumers always want the cheapest stuff, no matter how it's done.

 

[El_Machinae]

My rule is, if it's a luxury, I should be willing to pay to receive it in an ethical manner. This will cost more, it always costs more.

That said, if I couldn't get my coffee bold enough with a fair trade brand, I'd probably not buy fair trade.

My wife has a Keurig; it generates a lot of waste. Each cup is a 'cup' of plastic, and I have to individually pop them open when they dry to get the grounds out for composting. She now has this plastic mesh instead of a cup, and individual bags of coffee (that look like fat tea bags). They cost less per serving, and are much easier to compost.