CTIV-3: Tokugawa by Sea

Ok here goes. My first turnset in an SG.

Turn 0 (1575AD)
- Look around to see where everything is. Boy this map is big.
- In general it seems that a lot of our earlier cities seem to have a shortage of food. They are very healthy and happy, but they are strugling to grow into their oversized pants. This means slavery is not so effective, but I will leave it for now.
- We are at 70% research, losing -1. I will see what I can do about that.
- Change Walata and Kagoshima to courthouses to help with costs. The border pops will have to wait for a while.
- Fire the engineer in Kyoto. Not sure if he was doing anything special, but I can't see what it is, so make an executive decision.
- Also a scientist in Moscow.. fired.
- Whip the courthouse in Yekateringburg to cut the costs from 10. It has a fair amount of food and will grow back quickly. The distance from the palace is a long way. This is only going to get worse in new cities we take. We will need to be selective and only pick cities that will soon pay for themselves.
- Trade dye to Monte for 8
- Trade cow to Washington for 6
- Renegotiate copper for spices to corn for spices with Huayna. No need to give away copper if we don't need to.
- Trade cow to cyrus for 3.
- Now at +25@70%.
- Take note that if any of the AI's have spare income then you can cancel and renegotiate existing contracts and they will normally give you all their income.

Finally hit enter. I hope I didn't revise too much that you had going on, but there wasn't too much guidance in the last few rounds so I went my way.

Turn 1 (1580AD)
- Printing Press comes in. Now we are +43@70%.
- Next up cannons (Steel)
- I start moving some grenadiers over towards Mansa.
- Tokyo: Grocer -> Observatory to boost science
- Yekateringburg: Courthouse -> Granary to help it grow faster and allow the whip quicker :whipped:
- Yaraslavl: Forge -> Barracks

Turn 2 (1585AD)
- Workers working; Army moving.
- Research to -9@80%; 415 in piggy bank.

IBT: Monte wants Horses for Silk. Sorry no deal. Don't want knights knocking on our door.

Turn 3 (1590AD)
- First grenadiers arrive at Timbuktu to get ready to get Mansa's capital. Need some catapults or cannons to remove the defensive bonuses.

IBT: Alexander asks for gunpowder.. umm.. don't think so.

Turn 4 (1595AD)
- Kyoto: Grenadier -> Catapult
- Edo: Genandier -> Catapult
- Satsuma: Something -> Grenadier

IBT: Mansa Musa treaty is up. We can go to war again with him now.

Turn 5 (1600AD)
- Think about going to war with Mansa, but decide that I will let the next guy decide if 1 catapult is enough. The city is in the fog so I cannot tell what defenses he has.
- Osaka: Grenadier -> Observatory
- Yaroslavl': Barracks -> Grenadier for it's own protection.

Here are the soldiers waiting to go.
Civ4ScreenShot0002Medium.jpg


Left it there. Was going to play 10 when I started but due to this being my first go, took my time to see what's up and it took me longer than expected.

Here's a look at where we stand
Civ4ScreenShot0001Medium.jpg


We have got quite a lead in commerce and manufacturing. Just need to turn that into research and soldiers.
 
IT:

I spend quite a while looking around, because even though I've lurked from the beginning, its been a while since anything much has happened.

Why does Kyoto have Globe Theatre? Shouldn't that be for high-food cities? Anyway, I'll refrain from much MM because everything seems pretty good.


I guess we're trying to finish off Mansa, and I think thats a good idea. In fact, I like it so much, that I just, well, declare war!! My reasoning is that we have one cat, and I think we have enough strength in our units to stay alive without losses. If I need more cats, I can stall and bombard with one, while another (which is already being built) is on its way...

Declare!

Here is what I find in Djenne, their capital...

djennecontents1og.jpg


Turn 1 (1605AD):

We are the second wealthiest!!

wealthies7cz.jpg


Ok, this is not a good sign. A mali cat shows up - I attack with knight, 98.7% chance and LOSE - WTH... why me? I fill in, ya know, trying to be nice - and I get rewarded with this!! I finish the cat off and replace knight with one from Timbuktu.

Well, that was frustrating, but other than that mansa shouldn't be too hard.

Turn 2 (1610AD):

Hatty wants printing press - OUCH... I hate when they ask you for stuff... but I comply because we are pleased and we may want diplo win down the road. She isn't very big so we can take her if she starts to get better...

Well pretty uneventful actually, although I moved two grens in nearby to Djenne. They already have a 64% chance of winning, with 24% left for culture defense and no promotions yet... We should be ok...


Turn 3 (1615AD):

Trade sheep to ceaser for silk...

Took more culture defense off Djenne, will probably attack next turn. Nothing else of interest. I'm going to send a musket and a gren over to mali's island town to the west.

The next person should be able to take it.

Turn 4 (1620AD):

I was able to get the culture defense down to zero with frigates, so I don't need to use the cat for that (and it rhymes). I don't think I'll suicide though - the odds are too good.

The battle of Djenne,

battle17tk.jpg

battle26ii.jpg


And Djenne is ours :D

Kumbi will fall too, and fast.

Argh. I didn't see these cities in the north.

forgotcities3zr.jpg


I would raze the cities in the north..

Turn 5 (1625AD):

Easy prey:

whatsleft8iu.jpg


Even though everything seems to be going fine, I decide to stop here because I think there are some things to talk about.

- After Mansa, should we keep warring? I say yes because we are already ahead in tech and our economy isn't too bad.
- There are lots of empty places on the map. Would it kill us too much to settle some of them to block the AI? The fact that they don't have astro is the only reason they haven't. We are organized too remember.
- Both versaille and our forbid palace have yet to be built. Even though we will expand more, should we build them now to lower costs even more - city maint is still our biggest expense.
- We have some awesome lands at our disposal. If we stopped warring after mansa, and just built and improved, we could easily win a space race. What do you want to shoot for?

Take your pick for next victim if you want:

powergraph0zd.jpg


The Save:

I'm having trouble uploading the save, not a bandwidth issue but something else. I'll post as soon as possible...
 
You can always upload it to the forum "uploaded files" folder ... just, uh, don't ask me how because I haven't done it lately :blush:
 
Well done oldbustedjorn.. I didn't expect his capital to be so lightly defended. Could have taken him 5 shots ago. ;)

I think we should continue with war. The original intention was conquest and I think that will be challenging to achieve. Space race from this dominant position may be too easy.
 
UPDATE:

Turn 0 -- 1625 AD

Are we still at war with Mansa? Time to eliminate him; after that, let's focus on infrastructure.

I start moving some fortified galleons south to pick up troops to ferry north. I also send one Galleon north to the Barb City with a Knight and a Samurai. Kassite is guarded by a Longbow and a Warrior. Mansa has a galley nearby but it's empty.

I hit Enter

Turn 1 -- 1630 AD

St. Pete: Lighthouse > Forbidden Palace. I also consider Yaroslav'l, but it seems to far away from most cities.

Christianity has spread in Kagoshima.

Kumbi Saleh is easily taken by a couple Cover-Promoted Grenadiers.

I start loading up Galleons to attack Northward.

I use a worker from Djenne as a temp fogbuster :)

Aarrgghh, I see a little Mali city to our West. Fortunately I have a loaded galleon nearby, I'll divert.

Turn 2 -- 1635 AD

Steel > Replaceable Parts
Yakutsk: Grenadier > Workboat
Novgorod: Longbowman > Bank

Confucianism has spread in Kyoto.

I raze the Barb City. Looking at Mansa's two cities, I'm going to keep them: they both have resources we can use, why let someone else have them?

Timbuktu is unhappy. I rush Courthouse.

Frigate sinks Mansa's previously-mentioned Galley

Turn 3 -- 1640 AD

Timbuktu: Courthouse > Lighthouse
Taoism has spread in Yakutsk (my goal is to have a different religion spread each turn :crazyeye: )


Turn 4 -- 1645 AD

Walata: Courthouse > Theatre

Awlil falls. I keep it as a western output.


Turn 5 -- 1650 AD

Yaroslav'l: Grenadier > Bank
Vladivostok: Forge > Library
Kagoshima: Courthouse > Forge
Djenne: Starts Theatre, is converted to Judaism
Smolensk: Theatre > Courthouse

Dag, Tadmekka has dropped to size 1. And I've found ANOTHER ice city for Mansa.

Turn 6 -- 1652 AD

Kumbi Selah starts a Theatre

Awdaghost falls. We keep it.

Turn 7 -- 1654 AD

Yakutsk: Workboat > Forge
Awlil starts a Theatre

Wadan is razed

Turn 8 -- 1656 AD

Replaceable Parts comes in. Start Steam Power.

Kyoto: Observatory > Bank
Nagoya: Forge > Harbor

Tadmeka falls easily .. and we can keep it! (Must be because its the Capital). The Mali are no more.

For extra fun, I kill a Barb Archer hanging out nearby.


Ok, I'm pausing here, but I'm going to play another 2 turns later today/tomorrow. I'm going to work on getting all the cities/soldiers/builds more efficent and optimized, and I want to have plenty of time for that.
 
Turn 8 -- 1656 AD (Continued)

Ok, after all the moves are finished and its waiting for "End Turn", I sweep through all the cities.

Kyoto: Building Bank, due in 10. Rushing would kill too much population. Military is outdated (Longbow, Sword + Warrior). Has a Great Artist.

Osaka: Observatory due next turn. Will likely build a Bank next. Military is outdated (Longbow, Pike, and Axe).

Tokyo: Observatory due in 3 turns. I rush it, to be followed with a Bank (queued). Military is severely outdated (Axe, Archer, Warrior).

Edo: Observatory due in 2 turns. Queue up Bank to follow. Military is outdated (Samurai, Pike, Axe, and Warrior)

Satsuma: Grenadier due in 4 turns. I rush, queue up Harbor. City has very little Production. Military is severely outdated (Axe and Archer).

Rostov: Bank due in 4. I rush it. Queue up Drydock. This should be a major naval builder, it has good hammers. Military is outdated (Samurai, Pike, and Axe). Worker is hanging out, I grab him to start a lumbermill.

Kagoshima: Forge due in 22, will rush it next turn (city grows next turn). Queue up Library. Military is severely outdated (Axe, Spear).

Nara: Ah, the Gimp City. Courthouse rushed. Workboat queued (should be rushed at some point). Theatre is partially built, leave it in queue after Workboat. Military is severely outdated (Axe, Spear).

Nagoya: Building Harbor, due in 10. Military is decent, with a Knight, Longbow, Sword, Catapult, and Warrior.

Yakutsk: Forge due in 15, might want to rush in 7-8 turns. Military is decent (Grenadier, Pike, Sword). I queue up a Drydock to follow the Forge because this city is well placed for naval builds.

Moscow: Observatory due in 14, but I interpose a Granary (due in 9) in the queue. Might want to rush in 3-4 turns. Military is severely outdated (Spear, Warrior).

Yekaterinburg: I rush Granary, queue up Forge. Military is severely outdated (Sword, Axe). NEEDS WORKER ASSISTANCE (as do most of the Russian cities on these islands).

St. Petersburg: Building Forbidden Palace, now due in 14. Has a single Pike as a defender.

Yaroslav'l: Bank due in 21 turns. Military is good (Grenadier and Samurai). Currently our Southern Outpost.

Novogorod: Bank due in 7. Military is outdated (longbow and axe).

Vladivostok: Library due in 17, might want to rush in 8-9 turns. Military is weak and old (Axe).

Smolensk: Courthouse rushed, queue up Forge. Military is iffy (two longbows). This city has potential, should let grow a lot (8-10) before rushing again.

Timbuktu: Lighthouse due next turn, Forge queued. City will be a good commerce provider. Military is good (Grenadier and two Knights)

Walata: Just finished Courthouse, has a Theatre due in 30. Military is decent (2 Samurais).

Djenne: Theatre due in 16, rush after it only costs 1 pop. City might be good spot for Versailles. Two grenadiers defending.

Kumbi Saleh: Theatre due next turn, queue up Granary. Military is 3 grenadiers.

Awlil: Theatre due in 37 turns. Military is Grenadier and a Musket.

Awdaghost is in revolt for 2 more turns. Has 2 knights and a grenadier currently present, although one of the knights is going to fog bust between Awdaghost and ...

Tadmekka is in revolt for 3 more turns. Has a grenadier in it, and a Samurai coming to visit.


Troop cleanup still needs to happen. I drop science to 60% to give us +105/turn. I'm going start with Warrior and work up. Warrior in Kyoto and Tokyo upgraded to Pike. Warriors in Edo and Nagoya disbanded. 1 Warrior left in Moscow.


Turn 9 -- 1658 AD

I'm not going to retype all the City: Finished > Started that I described above

After all the builds complete, we go up to +131gpt from +107gpt (although that drops to 129 when I rush the Forge in Kagoshima).

Bring some Workers over from Nagoya to the ol' Russian lands. I also disband both remaining archers.

Turn 10 -- 1660 AD

We trade Sheep to Alex for Incense. Cyrus immediately wants us to cancel our deals with Alex. I point out that he's last on the list and could conceivably be our next target.

GW wants us to convert to Confucianism. I decline.

Awdaghost starts building a Theatre.

Upgrade the Warrior in Moscow to Pike. No more Warriors remain. Spears are next, but I'm not going to get to them to upgrade (not enough cash).


Ok, for the next several turns I'd work on Infrastructure. I'd also recommend waiting for Rifles before we start taking on more conquests, but that's player's choice. Most of the good troops are on the tundra, with some others guarding Mali's old lands.

Here's our World:
ctiv3m9dq.jpg


http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads11/CTIV-3_AD-1660.zip
 
Good work in finishing of Mansa, ChrTh. And starting us along the path to modernising our cities. It is going to cost us a lot to upgrade those soldiers.

I normally work on keeping a decent bank balance and upgrade where I get threatened or simply when the balance is getting too big. That way I don't have to upgrade all and can keep building the military towards our next target. This may need to be modified a bit because I would normally have land access to my cities and could rush soldiers to them. On this map, we would have to ship soldiers around if we get attacked.

I notice you upgraded warriors. I normally just disband them as it costs so much to upgrade them. Never really looked into whether it's efficient or not. The cost of a new soldier (with Universal Sufferage) may be a lot cheaper if you let one turn go into the build.

With upgrading infrastructure in cities, I also will just build only what it needs now or soon and otherwise just build military to keep the domination push going.

My vote for next target would be hatty as that island looks tasty :scan: . I have a tendency to take the strongest opponent first and she is close which will help contain maintenance. I imagine that maintenance is going to become horrendous when we start to get so many cities and so far away.

Would like to hear others thoughts about where to go next.
 
The reason I didn't want to disband all warriors is because some cities were light on troops. Basically, if they have only 2 defenders it's better to upgrade than to disband. Also didn't want to lose some of the promotions (which are kept in the upgrade process). There's no need to go nuts and promote everyone to the max, you'll notice I went up to Pike when I could've done Grenadier. I just wanted to get troops that would be worthwhile; they can be upgraded again later.

In terms of next attack, the two closest Civs are Liz and JC. Liz would be easier as her cities are more compact, however, she is currently working her UU (Minutemen). JC would be harder to conquer, but he's closer to the other Civs (there's a lot of emptiness to the west of Liz) and his UU is long past due. Liz's island would be a great place for Versailles (of course, we might want to hurry up and build it before someone else does :crazyeye: ), but then again building in Roman lands could help too. So there's no easy answer here.
 
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