Deity Challenge 2 - Byzantium, Continents

[Wargizmo]

82 turns in

Spoiler :

My build was basically tabarnak's 4 city tradition opener.

I sent the warrior staight down to Jerusalim and the scout up to Lhasa, this enabled me to found a pantheon. I took one with nature and settled first city at faith mountain, worked the 10fpt mountain with 2nd citizen. Doing quests for religious city states got me some really good faith generation early without having to build a single shrine. Ended up enhancing at turn 80.

Dudeism
One with nature
Ceremonial burial.
Itinerant preachers
Religious texts
Pagodas
+1 happy per shrine

I took out Maya capital with composite bows around turn 75. Settled city next right to london turn 81. England and Germany dual declared on me the next turn.

National college currently in progress and should be done by turn 90. Still way behind the AI in tech but I'm going to crank out a few unique horsemen and hopefully that will help me take London. Looking forward to seeing my crazy religion spread with both Itinerant preachers and Religious texts.

Screenshot:

 

[Old Peter]

82 turns in

Spoiler :

My build was basically tabarnak's 4 city tradition opener.

I sent the warrior staight down to Jerusalim and the scout up to Lhasa, this enabled me to found a pantheon. I took one with nature and settled first city at faith mountain, worked the 10fpt mountain with 2nd citizen. Doing quests for religious city states got me some really good faith generation early without having to build a single shrine. Ended up enhancing at turn 80.

Dudeism
One with nature
Ceremonial burial.
Itinerant preachers
Religious texts
Pagodas
+1 happy per shrine

I took out Maya capital with composite bows around turn 75. Settled city next right to london turn 81. England and Germany dual declared on me the next turn.

National college currently in progress and should be done by turn 90. Still way behind the AI in tech but I'm going to crank out a few unique horsemen and hopefully that will help me take London. Looking forward to seeing my crazy religion spread with both Itinerant preachers and Religious texts.

Screenshot:

Not bad Wargizmo . I am 151 turns in. Very fun map. Pretty hard. Thanks a lot for it .

We will see if I survive now

 

[Hammer Rabbi]

ragequit at t80.

Spoiler :

settled on the hill everyone likes, saw there wasnt much desert to make best use of DF so i got a pantheon at t 20 or so and took Festivals. founded on t70 (tithe and monasteries--saving bonus for 2 enhancers, never tried that before). 2nd city on the coastal wine to the southeast. never got a 3rd city as germany settled 2 cites right on my border, both 4 tiles from cap. was going for the Kailash spot but he between us. shouldve done first city up there. pacal dow'd on 58 but germany never did. when settled his 2nd city right up on me i dowd him to clear them out. i had 6 comps and 2 archers and 1 warrior (waiting on the phract to be built). i bled him before the dow but on the very next turn he rush bought a warrior. his settler had been escorted with necht so one was stationed in that city too. lost 2 comps in 2 turns and another settler appeared in the background. it was so frustrating i rage quit. i also got a very slow start as i only had 1 worker the whole time. barbs thwarted my CS worker steals by being present at every CS so the workers holed up in the city the whole time.

will try again after this headache goes away. the game didnt give it to me but it didnt help my play either.

 

[Hpuk]

What do you mean by saving bonus for 2 enhancers?
You can take an enhancer when you found the religion with Byzantine, am I misunderstanding your wording somehow?

 

[Moriarte]

Up to turn 86 here. Going to pause for a bit and think on what to do next. Basically, i neglected religion, Dromons and diplomacy from turn 0. Settled three cities and started building archers everywhere. By turn 65 i had 6 of them. Pacal didn't like the fact that i stole 2 workers from 2 different (religious) CS and DoW'ed me. So did Elizabeth. She never shown up though, except for odd scout or archer, guess she is busy fighting Harun.

So, i concentrated on fighting my way towards Palenque. Pacal acted a freak and kept sending his units to 'swim in front of Byzanthian composites'. Well, that costs him a game.. Only 6 CBs & 2 warriors were needed for 'Mayan campaign', and i have to confess, this is the smallest Deity army ever (for me).

It looks like i am in a good position to defend what i have (for now at least), and, maybe, another coastal city can be planted north of Constantinople, to secure land to the left of mountain range, and to be able to buy Caravels.

Another option would be to trick Bismark into attacking Harun (with 3 luxes) and attack Bismark few turns after that. Decisions, decisions..

10 turns to full tradition.

Spoiler :

Well done reviving the challenge, BWS.

 

[Hammer Rabbi]

What do you mean by saving bonus for 2 enhancers?
You can take an enhancer when you found the religion with Byzantine, am I misunderstanding your wording somehow?

i could have taken a pantheon/founder/follower bonus but it wouldnt let me take Itinerant when I founded. it was listed in the bonus list but when i chose it it reset all my choices and made me choose again. i think i have to wait til I enhance to have access to them so i was going to save it. ive only played Byz a couple times so her UA is pretty new to me.

 

[beezany]

Great! Thanks BWS!

Thank you for starting the series! I'm glad that (most of) you folks are enjoying the map.

Since we are learning, not all just trying to win on our own. What is the right way to approach this map?

My thoughts on the map and strategy:

Spoiler :

I liked this map because it had a lot to offer without being "cheesy," which fit the spirit of the Deity Challenge as the Pilgrim originally described it. There's enough faith generation available to make the UA useful, but it requires investment in difficult terrain, and there's religious competition from the Maya. There's a lot of room to expand and a great natural border to the north but a weak flank toward the Maya. There's enough space to make Liberty vs Tradition a viable choice. There's plenty of gold to fund whatever you want. There's enough food, jungle, and mountain to fuel a strong science game, enough faith and defensive terrain to turtle up for culture.

The one common thread I see here, which I missed when I played, is that the Maya are serious rivals who you need to keep in check. I was too worried about Germany, and thought Pacal was a solid friend, right up until he swiped my 4th city. I probably should have been plotting to backstab him from the beginning, instead of thinking how to placate him.

i could have taken a pantheon/founder/follower bonus but it wouldnt let me take Itinerant when I founded. it was listed in the bonus list but when i chose it it reset all my choices and made me choose again. i think i have to wait til I enhance to have access to them so i was going to save it. ive only played Byz a couple times so her UA is pretty new to me.

Oh, that's unfortunate. It sounds like you ran into a glitch. I founded my religion with Itinerant Preachers. Sorry your game didn't turn out well. Mine was a disappointment too.

 

[Hammer Rabbi]

another random thing i learned. barb camps can be cleared by buying the tile it is in (i already knew this) but one of the CSs needed that camp cleared for the quest and instead of attacking it i simply bought the tile. well, doing it that way didnt get the CS quest for me. it simply erased it as a quest and friend status hadnt changed. kind of a bummer too. i had stolen a worker from almaty and was still pretty far in the red with them and was hoping it would get me back to even.

and im going to try and replicate that founding thing. im pretty sure i didnt hit 'close' instead of 'found religion' but if i can get IP from founding that is just awesome. i still havent even decided on a VC yet, which is why im losing early focus on what path im taking. part of me wants to make some good naval battles but Englands SotL's are beastly. id need to beeline for her by land. havent even seen the other continent yet.

twice now ive been just at 500g to buy a settler and seen units at my border ready to dow. both times ive rush bought archers instead. i only had 3 and didnt think it was enough. i just cant seem to get 4 cities going by t60.

 

[beezany]

Yeah, I also recently learned the one about barbarian camps. In my case, I settled a new city over a camp and lost the CS quest.

 

[budweiser]

When I play the next session, I will do t42-80 or 100 and see if I can kill one guy on the map. At t42 I have 2 archers and 1 warrior only plus an archer scout.

What do people think about taking 2 pantheons on this map?

I took festivals first. I think I want to take Holy warriors because fpt is pretty good here and cataphracts are an option.

 

[Wargizmo]

i could have taken a pantheon/founder/follower bonus but it wouldnt let me take Itinerant when I founded. it was listed in the bonus list but when i chose it it reset all my choices and made me choose again. i think i have to wait til I enhance to have access to them so i was going to save it. ive only played Byz a couple times so her UA is pretty new to me.

That sounds like a bug. I took IP without any problems when founding

 

[Tabarnak]

What do people think about taking 2 pantheons on this map?

I haven't played the map yet, but i'm sure that taking 2 pantheons is often a bad idea. Religious Texts very early(from extra belief) combined with another belief taking his power from a raw number of cities(both from yours and AIs, like ceremonial burial) make Byzantines pretty powerful witht the right map.

 

[Wargizmo]

I think on deity the dual enhancer is kind of essential, the AI is so aggressive with prophets, in my game Maya sent 2 great prophets into my area, but because of the dual enhancer it was like pissing into the ocean.

I also like going happiness for all the follower beliefs (pagodas & a passive happy like +1 to shrines) because the AI doesn't really get any benefit from it (since it already has unlimited happiness on deity).

Anyway I'm up to turn 114.

Spoiler :

I barely took london, I was literally surrounded by English troops and I only had 2 composite bows and 1 Cataphract left, which was just enough to take the city after I'd been wearing it down for ages. I'm still at war with Germany but so far they're not really a threat, but it's going to be very hard to take any cities off them so my next target will be the maya again, likely when I have Xbows. I have a friendship with Harun and will hopefully get a research agreement going soon.

My happiness went in the toilet when I captured London, because I had to sell most of my luxuries off to Harun to fuel the war. Taking all those happiness policies with religion turned out to be a pretty good idea.

I built a university in my cap and rush bought one in the jungle/faith city. Currently unlocking renaissance with astronomy, which will arrive with plenty of time before 7th policy (my culture is garbage)

London built Petra for some weird reason (they only have 1 desert tile) and the amphitheatre was destroyed so it's almost useless lol. At least no one else has it I suppose.

I need to get a Caravel and start finding more trading partners ASAP, because I've got way too many spare luxuries and horses that Harun doesn't want.

 

[Old Peter]

I am at turn 191 now. It is not an easy map, because the neighbours are strong, and especially those on the other islands!

I am going for a domination victory (I think that is most fun) and it wont be easy to stop the others from a scientific victory.

 

[EEE_BOY]

I haven't played the map yet, but i'm sure that taking 2 pantheons is often a bad idea. Religious Texts very early(from extra belief) combined with another belief taking his power from a raw number of cities(both from yours and AIs, like ceremonial burial) make Byzantines pretty powerful witht the right map.

what about two founder beliefs? the +15 CS resting point can be chosen which normally not favourable if other powerful founder belief is available

Spoiler :

Given the number of religius CS on the map. this founder belief is also powerful to keep them ally

 

[beezany]

This looks like a good game for military strategy lessons. It looks like more folks attacked their neighbors here than in Deity Challenge 1, and in retrospect I probably should have too. So a few questions for those of you who did attack:

• Who (and when) did you attack?
• How did you choose your first target?
• Did you choose the biggest threat or the easiest target?
• How did you prepare for war?
• What did you bring to the fight?
• Did you accomplish what you wanted?
• Did you run into any problems?

 

[EEE_BOY]

This looks like a good game for military strategy lessons. It looks like more folks attacked their neighbors here than in Deity Challenge 1, and in retrospect I probably should have too. So a few questions for those of you who did attack:

• Who (and when) did you attack?
• How did you choose your first target?
• Did you choose the biggest threat or the easiest target?
• How did you prepare for war?
• What did you bring to the fight?
• Did you accomplish what you wanted?
• Did you run into any problems?

Spoiler :

CBs rush Pacal
the terrain is flat land near Maya. as England is blocked by mountain and Germany has forests surrounding.
built only archors and settlers after a shine a monument and a granery. steal a worker and cash buy another worker
as I was preparing England and Germany DoW so Pacal ends up as friends and the cash cow.

 

[ense7en]

Not off to a good start, as usual.

Pacal attacked me.
I've repelled him, and upgraded all my archers into Composite Bowmen.
Was moving them toward his cap when Elizabeth decided to DoW me.
Awesome, now i have to deal with her from the opposite direction.
It looks like Palenque just bought or built walls too, so it'll be way tougher to dent his cap.

I think i'm going to have to make peace with Pacal and deal with Lizzy, which is really going to hurt me longterm (but losing a city to Lizzy is worse obviously).

Germany is spamming cities like wild. I really hate playing against Germany. Seriously, every game they plant two billion cities with reckless abandon.

I am having to waste units just to try to block his settler from coming and settling right beside me.

Based on others screenshots, i am WAY behind where i need to be...not looking good for me.

Spoiler :

 

[budweiser]

Here is a screen shot at t86.

Spoiler :

I backstabbed Pacal after I took his money in trade deals.

Sometimes my troops endup just out of position and I go in a turn too early. This happened here, The battle of Palenque was a see-saw affair and the city changed hands multiple time. I sustained a few cbow losses. Finally the muscle of the cataphracts was too much for Pacal's light shooters. The screen shot shows me in firm grasp of the city (I think).

I got the third religion and I chose Holy Catphracts for 150, Alex. I'm making 15 or 17 ftp.

4 of my own cities are in place now and I will try and tech up a bit while my army continues to grab as much land as I can in the south.

 

[budweiser]

• Who (and when) did you attack?
  
  Spoiler :

  I attacked Pacal as soon as my cbows were ready, around t75 to t80
  
  
• How did you choose your first target?
  
  Spoiler :

  Once my scouts revealed the opening terrain, it was clear early that Pacal could be a target. The others were separated by dense terrain, but not him.
  
  
  
• Did you choose the biggest threat or the easiest target?
  
  Spoiler :

  Easiest percieved target.
  
  
• How did you prepare for war?
  
  Spoiler :

  Sold and borrowed as much as I could to get stuff faster. Hard built archers, cash bought all settlers and paid to upgrade cbows. Faith boought Cataphracts.
  
  
• What did you bring to the fight?
  
  Spoiler :

  4 or 5 cbows, 2 warrior, 1 cataphract, 2 more cataphracts came in later.
  
  
• Did you accomplish what you wanted?
  
  Spoiler :

  So far.
  
  
• Did you run into any problems?
  
  Spoiler :

  I took some losses and lost turns. I ended up in a position where I was trying to beat down the city while he still had an army in the field.

I put my answers in the quote section.