Design: Civics

[Sureshot]

don't wanna crowd thread either, so:

Spoiler :

it could be called a representative democracy (the closest claim to democracy it can make), if it actually represented the populace. but it doesn't, two choices isn't reflective of the populace, and most of the population doesn't even vote for the side that wins (51% for majority, of 65% who actually vote, of those older than 18, who have citizenship, isn't exactly representative).

it's a republic that promotes its status quo and uses immigrants as its workforce (back in the day they called cheap labour slavery). they made immigrants willing participants by making them feel like they don't deserve to be there ("immigration reforms coming, they will be forced to leave and are criminals"), but if they manage to stick around, one day, they'll better their situation (its called castize and dangle an apple, they'll stay but they'll be on their tip-toes)

given that the country was founded by immigrants who murdered and germ warfared its original inhabitants, you'd think the country would be more receptive.. but the status quo requires cheap workers when you want the few to rule

i have a very difficult time differentiating it with the empire of rome, and i always remember that hitler was democratically elected (way to go republics!), the key to rome and nazi germany was broadcasting "we are your friends, we will improve your way of life" before you conquer them

 

[Nikis-Knight]

I don't think it's worth getting into here, but suffice to say we disagree.

 

[Sureshot]

its definately a matter of perspective, in which most people have very concretely defined beliefs (which consequently breeds much disagreement and offense usually), so the whole topic is a bad one to discuss (didn't you know its bad to talk about religion or politics? lol)

 

[H.GrenadeFrenzy]

Does anyone have an opinion about a magocracy government format for civic options......just curious I've mentioned it before but no coversation has been started that I have seen.........thanx

 

[QES]

Does anyone have an opinion about a magocracy government format for civic options......just curious I've mentioned it before but no coversation has been started that I have seen.........thanx

I like the idea of a Magocracy...but then it would have to invovle the spheres of magic in some very direct way. Maybe mana sources provide happiness, and/or gold and hammers? What would the pealty be? I would expect the venel masses would be neglected in the pursuit and power of high-magicks.
-Qes

 

[Sureshot]

i'd think they'd get +% science and +xp for adepts

 

[QES]

i'd think they'd get +% science and +xp for adepts

I think we want to be careful to differentiate science from magic. Exploration, poisions, and mithril working arnt magical. Well, maybe mithril working. But a goodly portion of the techs are not magical in nature, only truly the nodes are magical alone. Something to do with them would be cool. I do like the idea of Bonus XP for adepts.....but they level anyway, where as normal units must fight, so this bonus isnt as big of a deal, just means you have to wait a few more turns if your NOT a magocracy. Maybe a mageocracy has a higher limit of archmages and summoners? 6 or something instead of 3? Or perhaps unlimited?

Perhaps Magocracy : -20% Military production, Ulimited Archmages and summoners, -2 happy for state religion (competition with magic), +1 happy per mana type.

?
-Qes

 

[Nikis-Knight]

Perhaps Magocracy : -20% Military production, Ulimited Archmages and summoners, -2 happy for state religion (competition with magic), +1 happy per mana type.

Sounds like you're trying to make an uber Grigori magic civic.
Don't forget, from .15 on civs will all start with 3 mana.

Magocracy could give slowerr adept xp rate, higher mage/conjurer xp rate, since the powerful mages aren't bothering to train apprentices, they are running the place. +1 happy per mana type would probably be good, though maybe too strong.
Well, maybe +25% production on rituals. Sheaim would love it, but it wouldn't come up much. Getting blood of Phoenix 20 turns sooner may be worth it though.

 

[QES]

Sounds like you're trying to make an uber Grigori magic civic.
Don't forget, from .15 on civs will all start with 3 mana.

Magocracy could give slowerr adept xp rate, higher mage/conjurer xp rate, since the powerful mages aren't bothering to train apprentices, they are running the place. +1 happy per mana type would probably be good, though maybe too strong.
Well, maybe +25% production on rituals. Sheaim would love it, but it wouldn't come up much. Getting blood of Phoenix 20 turns sooner may be worth it though.

I'm cool with something like that. I just dont want the stench of technology pretending its magic .
How about this. Arcane Spellcasters (not druids and priests, etc) provide 2 happy to any city they stay in. Or perhaps 1 happy per level, adept 1, mage 2, and archmage 3 for example. And Sages (the speicialist) produce 1 Hammer per TYPE of magic. This could make mana nodes very valueable. (even more than usual).

On the 3 Resources for each capital. I know I inspired this idea, BUT. I assume that means magic resources? Mana? Isnt that a bit much? Or is the goal that each civ will be allowed to access the highest levels of at least one sphere of magic? Or will they be different types? Or all the same? Its a curiosity of mine now.
-Qes

 

[Xuenay]

On the 3 Resources for each capital. I know I inspired this idea, BUT. I assume that means magic resources? Mana? Isnt that a bit much? Or is the goal that each civ will be allowed to access the highest levels of at least one sphere of magic? Or will they be different types? Or all the same? Its a curiosity of mine now.
-Qes

Remember that in 0.15 you won't even have access to the relevant spell sphere if you don't have the mana for it... if each civ only got one mana, it'd be possible that they'd get locked into just one magic type for the longest of times. That'd be pretty dull.

 

[QES]

Remember that in 0.15 you won't even have access to the relevant spell sphere if you don't have the mana for it... if each civ only got one mana, it'd be possible that they'd get locked into just one magic type for the longest of times. That'd be pretty dull.

Oh i know, thats why im curious as to whether or not they'll be different mana types, or a heavy dose of one type. Like will i get 3 nature? Or a nature a body and a death? 3 Nature lets me use up to level 3 nature spells, awesome, but the rounded out gives me more options. The question is what the buildings purpose (in this regard alone) is.
-Qes

 

[Silverkiss]

They are 3 diferent.

 

[Nikis-Knight]

check the design civilizations thread, it was edited to reflect this.

 

[Bad Player]

Fend for themselves: + 1 unhealthiness in all cities. Only benefit might be ai diplo bonus for using it. Everyone has basic care which has no negative modifiers anyway.

I think fend for themselves should have some kind of bonus to make it attractive to evil civs - maybe +50% undead and demon production?

 

[Kael]

Fend for themselves: + 1 unhealthiness in all cities. Only benefit might be ai diplo bonus for using it. Everyone has basic care which has no negative modifiers anyway.

I think fend for themselves should have some kind of bonus to make it attractive to evil civs - maybe +50% undead and demon production?

Basic care has an upkeep cost, thats its negative.

 

[Bad Player]

But still - good civs can get public healers which is quite good! Evil civs need help in a few areas and I think this is one of them!

 

[Corlindale]

Perhaps we could give a small xp bonus to fresh units with Fend for Themselves? To simulate the fact that people who does manage to survive in more harsh conditions will generally be more tough, social darwinism and all that. Perhaps just a +1 bonus or something.

 

[Bad Player]

Well it needs something imo because both it and to a lesser extent sacrifice the weak are bad civics and punish evil civs while good civs get public healers which is very useful!

The only problem would be that +1 XP, whilst logical for fend for themselves, does tend to copy e.g. apprenticeship and therefore a bit lame. Also sacrifice the weak may need tweaking to be more powerful..

 

[SchpailsMan]

In another thread, someone suggested that under Sacrifice the Weak, friendly living units that die in battle would have a chance to be converted to a Diseased Corpse. Some sort of a Veil-sponsored "survival of the fittest". I think that would be a cool mechanics for the Veil, I do imagine them sending in a lot a "expendable" weaklings in battle, and re-using them afterwards for their Necromantic rituals.

 

[Bad Player]

That sounds reasonable but you would need to have low level creatures that are likely to survive battles (and remember the substantially increased unit cost)...