Differences between Chinese and Western education systems

[Crezth]

Chinese education is great, especially the social sciences. Chinese students know aaaaall about Tiananmen Square the the horrors of the Cultural Revolution. Or is it that they don't? I forget it, propaganda can be confusing.

 

[pi-r8]

Let us get something clear, I agree that America's education system in terms of comprehension skills is sorely lacking, which is why our math and science grades make us look stupid in comparison to Asians. (I'm Chinese, and my parents more or less agree)

HOWEVER, that is only half of the equation. America's education system has an emphasis on creativity skills. And that is of major importance. This is the reason why America was, and still is in many areas, the world's giant of R&D, and of technology. Americans have been indoctrinated to be creative, allowing us to think up of new inventions, business models, and encouraged us to be curious of the world around us.

On the opposite side, Asians would most likely succeed well in analytical fields, such as accountants, economists, etc. because those jobs require very little creativity.

Yeah I noticed this when I was in graduate school. The first year asian students are way ahead of the first year american students, because they've taken so many more science and math classes. However, The american students are still better able to do research, because we've had more experience tackling open ended questions like "what problem should we work on? What kind of experiment should we design to examine that problem?" It also helps that all the research papers are in English, of course.

 

[Teeninvestor]

I concede that maybe the China of Deng (and Jiang) became more open to the international economy. But, you know, so did Italy under Mussolini. That doesn't keep China from being a reactive, developmental state under Deng! And anyway, Deng found, in ancient Chinese autocracy and racial nationalism, a way to repress the masses. All I'm saying is that he's not a hero, or anything.

Well, its pretty tough bringing an agarian country on the edge of starvation to a modern, industrialized, competitive country, no? I regard a guy who literally saved and enriched the lives of one fifth of humanity as a pretty big hero.

 

[Teeninvestor]

I concede that maybe the China of Deng (and Jiang) became more open to the international economy. But, you know, so did Italy under Mussolini. That doesn't keep China from being a reactive, developmental state under Deng! And anyway, Deng found, in ancient Chinese autocracy and racial nationalism, a way to repress the masses. All I'm saying is that he's not a hero, or anything.

Well, its pretty tough bringing an agarian country on the edge of starvation to a modern, industrialized, competitive country, no?

Yeah I noticed this when I was in graduate school. The first year asian students are way ahead of the first year american students, because they've taken so many more science and math classes. However, The american students are still better able to do research, because we've had more experience tackling open ended questions like "what problem should we work on? What kind of experiment should we design to examine that problem?" It also helps that all the research papers are in English, of course.

Speaking of which, what would you guys think is the ideal education system??? I think it should incorporate elements of each. For starters, i think there should a bigger emphasis on rewarding the better students(to promote competition) as well as making parents play a bigger role. As some of you have pointed out, this parental intervention isn't everything. But a limited parental intervention can really help a student out.

As far as I am aware in my area, asian students are relatively well-rounded. Of course, most asians I refer to are 2nd generation(or 1.5, pour moi).

 

[SS-18 ICBM]

Back in the Philippines there was a heavy (some might say total) emphasis on rote learning. I remember memorizing dates and regurgitating them on tests. Now, I wouldn't say rote learning is completely wrong, especially at lower levels. However, it is often more important to understand what you are learning. I'm finding the high school evaluation system here in Ontario better. That, I think, is one major weakness of the education system in the East as opposed to the West.

 

[aronnax]

Bah the Asian education System, or at least the Singaporean and Korean Education System is base on Darwin's Survival of the Fittest Ideal. One matter how hard you study, no matter how well you do, the education system will split the losers who will become janitors and hawker cooks from the winners, who become CEOs and Doctors.

The O level examination is the perfect example. It is a national examination (of usually 7 or 8 subjects) taken by all Secondary 4 Students (10th Grade) where every one needs to get as low as points as possible for their best 5 subjects and their English. As low points meaning:
100-75% = A1
74-70% = A2
69-65% = B3
64-60% = B4
59-55% = C5
54%-50% = C6
49-45% = D7
44-40% = E8
39% Under = F9

If a student scored 2 A1s, 1 A2, 3 B3s and a B4 for his English. That means his score is 14. (4+1+1+2+3+3) 14 is not a good score. A good score is 10.

Now, the annoying part of this is that if during the examination of a specific subject, a huge number of people scored above 75 points (A1), the examiners, will increase the A1 criteria from 75 to perhaps 80, to try and cut down the amount of "Winners". This is to keep a clear distinction from the smart and very smart.

So in my educational system. If I get a good grade, somebody must suffer and get a bad grade.

 

[Ecofarm]

Grades should always be curved.

 

[aronnax]

Grades should always be curved.

Not til someone's hard work is discredited.

 

[negZero]

Back in the Philippines there was a heavy (some might say total) emphasis on rote learning. I remember memorizing dates and regurgitating them on tests. Now, I wouldn't say rote learning is completely wrong, especially at lower levels. However, it is often more important to understand what you are learning. I'm finding the high school evaluation system here in Ontario better. That, I think, is one major weakness of the education system in the East as opposed to the West.

With the Ontario system comes down more to the school you go to. Take for instance my elementary school was all about memorizing information, while my high school was more about understanding and using that information.

 

[LightFang]

Speaking of which, what would you guys think is the ideal education system???

I THOUGHT THIS THREAD WAS ONLY ABOUT THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN THE CHINESE AND WESTERN EDUCATION SYSTEMS, IF YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT THE "IDEAL" THEN YOU CAN HEAD OVER HERE.

As far as I am aware in my area, asian students are relatively well-rounded. Of course, most asians I refer to are 2nd generation(or 1.5, pour moi).

Pour vous, what does 1.5 mean????

 

[cybrxkhan]

I think 1.5 means those who were born elsewhere, but came at a very young age, so they're pretty much like 2nd generation.

 

[SS-18 ICBM]

With the Ontario system comes down more to the school you go to. Take for instance my elementary school was all about memorizing information, while my high school was more about understanding and using that information.

I am aware of the importance of memorizing things in elementary. However, my Philippine high school still had a habit of relying heavily on it, not like my high school here.

 

[Sharwood]

Western education systems differ greatly between nations, even individual states and cities.

Also, the idea that bullying is cracked down on in China is a joke. Chinese girls routinely beat the crap out of other girls as part of a 'new' (probably been around for ages, it's just YouTube that's new) gang culture ongoing over there. I know because I watched some of the videos; they can be hot. Don't know if it also goes on with the guys, I'm not interested in searching for such videos. This goes on right in front of teachers, even in the classroom. Sometimes the teachers will even give the girl a good kick themselves.

Rape is also becoming more common as part of this, as I guess it's hard to watch your girlfriend strip and beat another girl with her friends and not join in the fun. There was a major stink about that just last year. This proved that Asian students were just as stupid as American ones, as they videotaped it and put it online for all to see.

 

[Masada]

I think a distinction needs to be drawn between academic competence and real competence in something. The number of University students who come out of University with little or nothing in the way of useful skills - lots of people manage to get a degree without taking anything strenuous. With little in the way of intelligence - anyone care to count the number of academically competent people who only ever gained a shallow knowledge of their subjects and tended to get good marks simply by virtue of being able to write what the teacher wanted? And a whole myriad of other distinctions...

 

[nihilistic]

Bah the Asian education System, or at least the Singaporean and Korean Education System is base on Darwin's Survival of the Fittest Ideal. One matter how hard you study, no matter how well you do, the education system will split the losers who will become janitors and hawker cooks from the winners, who become CEOs and Doctors.

The O level examination is the perfect example. It is a national examination (of usually 7 or 8 subjects) taken by all Secondary 4 Students (10th Grade) where every one needs to get as low as points as possible for their best 5 subjects and their English. As low points meaning:
100-75% = A1
74-70% = A2
69-65% = B3
64-60% = B4
59-55% = C5
54%-50% = C6
49-45% = D7
44-40% = E8
39% Under = F9

If a student scored 2 A1s, 1 A2, 3 B3s and a B4 for his English. That means his score is 14. (4+1+1+2+3+3) 14 is not a good score. A good score is 10.

Now, the annoying part of this is that if during the examination of a specific subject, a huge number of people scored above 75 points (A1), the examiners, will increase the A1 criteria from 75 to perhaps 80, to try and cut down the amount of "Winners". This is to keep a clear distinction from the smart and very smart.

So in my educational system. If I get a good grade, somebody must suffer and get a bad grade.

Rejection is going to come sooner or later. Is it better to fail the kids early and hard or promote them socially anyway and let them find out at 21 that they are worthless? Your call.

Not til someone's hard work is discredited.

So? In the real world effort is always secondary to results.

 

[plarq]

Grades should always be curved.

Now, Chinese higher education entrance examination is administrated on provincial level, and some of the tests curved, some not.

Also the illusion off Chinese students being especially clever is because of a skewed statistics, an iceberg tip of excellent students. For average persons I met, I found most of them do not have the intellectual capacity for high school. And although the university admission rate is about a quarter, after great enlargements of campuses, I only met one tenth that has entered college.

It is only in developed countries (Singapore excluded), that many students get promoted to higher level of education regardless of their intellectual ability. In China, that requires your mom and dad being top social caste of bureaucracy (even a millionaire cannot guarantee admission).

 

[PiMan]

As an Asian student myself, the only thing I really have to say on this matter is that I think although from my experience Asian students do do "better", I am not sure whether this actually makes them more intelligent, more well-rounded, or prepared for the real world. In fact, many of my fellow Asian students were just as stupid and incapable as the other students. From what I know, the only difference between the Asian and non-Asian students was that the Asian students - with great reluctance - forced themselves to take harder classes, waste more time studying, and just really learn how to take tests. They were never innately more intelligent or capable, and I am not sure they were "more" prepared for the real world.

Also, at least where I come from, the stereotype of a science and math obsessed Asian is apparently true. As stated somewhere above, it is true that the American system puts more emphasis on creativity, and Asian students don't really get that. It was kind of funny for me to watch my fellow Asians do great in Physics and Calculus, but completely fall apart when learning history, or when attempting to write an essay (even those that were excellent at English).

This is obvious in my state. Year 12 students have to choose five subjects, and one set of five is known as the "Asian five".
English (compulsory), Maths Methods, Specialist Maths, Physics, Chemistry.

 

[Camikaze]

This is obvious in my state. Year 12 students have to choose five subjects, and one set of five is known as the "Asian five".
English (compulsory), Maths Methods, Specialist Maths, Physics, Chemistry.

In NSW, it's Advanced Maths (2 units), Maths Extension 1 (1U), Maths Extension 2 (1U), Advanced English (compulsory, 2U), Physics (2U) and Chemistry (2U), making for a total of 10 units and a very fun life.

 

[nihilistic]

This is obvious in my state. Year 12 students have to choose five subjects, and one set of five is known as the "Asian five".
English (compulsory), Maths Methods, Specialist Maths, Physics, Chemistry.

In NSW, it's Advanced Maths (2 units), Maths Extension 1 (1U), Maths Extension 2 (1U), Advanced English (compulsory, 2U), Physics (2U) and Chemistry (2U), making for a total of 10 units and a very fun life.

Do you guys realize that to people who are good at math, those are the exact courses to take to minimize work? It goes doubly true if said person also sucks at English. The English class probably requires more effort on the part of the student than the rest of that lineup combined.

 

[Camikaze]

Do you guys realize that to people who are good at math, those are the exact courses to take to minimize work? It goes doubly true if said person also sucks at English. The English class probably requires more effort on the part of the student than the rest of that lineup combined.

Well, English is compulsory, and I can't really talk, 'cause I do for 7 of my required 10 units, 3 units of Maths, Physics and Economics.

Keep in mind, when I say English, I mean piece of crap impressionist BS analysis, with a considerable bias towards reading too deeply into something.