Do you belive animals can be homosexual?

[blackheart]

"What happens, is that a fascist comes along and says that homosexuality is wrong because it *isn't* natural - at which point, it's fair game to point out what happens with animals."

I don't believe homosexuality is natural. Are you calling me a fascist?

You missed the part where this is occuring naturally in animals.

 

[.Shane.]

1. Its not open for debate really. Its a fact that homosexuality occurs in the animal kingdom. Its documented across multiple species.
2. Who cares?
3. Can we have a moratorium on any threads related to this subject matter?

I don't believe homosexuality is natural. Are you calling me a fascist?

Given your penchant for throwing around stereotypes like mardi gras beads, how can you possibly be offended when the rooster comes home to roost?

 

[croxis]

Old argument - quite easy to refute.

Same sex acts have been observed with animals, wild and otherwise. Animals are a part of nature. Therefor same sex acts are natural.

Please note that I avoided the use of the word homosexuality because that comes with a very massive set of preconceived values involving humans -- human sexuality contains biological and emotional desires as well and social constructs and expectations.

Nature is also valueless. Claims which start with "The point of sex" or a similar argument displays misconceptions about reality. There is no 'point' to nature, no value, no goal. It simply is.

As .Shane. said, this topic has been vomited on ad nauseum. Search for an old thread and re read every argument. Sans new research (which there is one just published actually, but I'm not starting that topic), it would behove all of us to search for these old threads, read them, and save our time.

 

[Neonanocyborgasm]

No Flaming, insults, or spam!​

Do you belive they can, I've heard stories of people seeing gay animals "go at it" but I actully belive animals act on uncontrolable urges and have no sexuallaty.

I've seen gay dogs, cats, and even seagulls. Homosexuality appears to be widespread in nature.

 

[garric]

1. Its not open for debate really. Its a fact that homosexuality occurs in the animal kingdom. Its documented across multiple species.
2. Who cares?
3. Can we have a moratorium on any threads related to this subject matter?



Given your penchant for throwing around stereotypes like mardi gras beads, how can you possibly be offended when the rooster comes home to roost?

The worst I've called someone is a "liberal"(it's only an insult if you make it) ... and I doubt someone got really offended. However, calling me a fascist because I don't share a political view is sickening to me, my grandfathers died to destroy fascism and I don't take such things lightly. I am just glad that I was not called one directly.

 

[emzie]

The worst I've called someone is a "liberal"(it's only an insult if you make it) ... and I doubt someone got really offended. However, calling me a fascist because I don't share a political view is sickening to me, my grandfathers died to destroy fascism and I don't take such things lightly. I am just glad that I was not called one directly.

Both of your grandfathers died in WWII?

 

[Eukaryote]

Most of the time someone does this is to say something along the lines of "See, animals do it, so that means that homosexuality is natural". Needless to say, the liberals on these forums will vote "Yes", whether they really believe it or not.

Alas, I quote myself, from post 17:

Nope, that's just your paranoia.

This thread has absoultly nothing to do with politics, it's about nature, please stay on topic.

The worst I've called someone is a "liberal"(it's only an insult if you make it) ... and I doubt someone got really offended. However, calling me a fascist because I don't share a political view is sickening to me, my grandfathers died to destroy fascism and I don't take such things lightly. I am just glad that I was not called one directly.

And I salute them.

 

[boarder]

I think they are just fufilling a urge, they probably dont know if its the same sex just that they see another and want to have sex with it.

 

[garric]

Both of your grandfathers died in WWII?

Yes. They both died in the siege on Leningrad (Now St. Petersburg).

 

[GenMarshall]

I would go with uncontrolable urges. I find that animals cannot reason so I believe animals cant become homosexual.

I vote for uncontrollable urges. When my dog humps my leg he isnt being homosexual, he is just trying to fill his urge.

You dont have the dog nuttered nor have a squirt bottle to squirt the dog if the dog does that?

 

[blackheart]

The worst I've called someone is a "liberal"(it's only an insult if you make it) ... and I doubt someone got really offended.

We now know you do intend the labelling of "liberal" as an insult and it gets tiresom and annoying.

However, calling me a fascist because I don't share a political view is sickening to me, my grandfathers died to destroy fascism and I don't take such things lightly. I am just glad that I was not called one directly.

You do it all the time, what goes around comes around.

 

[croxis]

Wouldn't a dog humping a guy be bestiality =p

 

[King Flevance]

Uncontrollable urges. I had a a cat that would go in heat and the Chihuahua we had at the time would start to play with her as he could smell the scent. Plus, she would be rolling around on the floor and stuff antogonizing him. When this happened we had to seperate them because one thing would lead to another.... So a dog having sex with cat is the same urges that any animals goes off of in a situation like this.

A dog that humps a leg is not particularly attracted to humans like the chihuahua we had didn't really care for cats. It's all urges or instincts with animals.

 

[Insane_Panda]

Using garric's logic about Russia -

You are not a homosexual, you can't say anything. You don't understand! p)

---

I do think homosexuality is present in animals (homosexual acts are proven), but whether it is a sexual preference, I don't know. I am leaning to the belief that they just do it regardless of the sex of the one they are doing it (this being non-procreational sex), or to, as has been said, assert social dominance.

So basically, I think it has more to do with the animal's urges, and not a sexuality or sexual preference, it is simply an act of sex, which happens to involve two animals of the same sex.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

http://www.jrn.columbia.edu/studentwork/cns/2002-06-10/591.asp

They're in love. They're gay. They're penguins... And they're not alone.

Wendell and Cass, two penguins at the New York Aquarium in Coney Island, Brooklyn, live in a soap opera world of seduction and intrigue. Among the 22 male and 10 female African black-footed penguins in the aquarium's exhibit, tales of love, lust and betrayal are the norm. These birds mate for life. But given the disproportionate male-female ratio at the aquarium, some of the females flirt profusely and dump their partners for single males with better nests.

Wendell and Cass, however, take no part in these cunning schemes. They have been completely devoted to each other for the last eight years. In fact, neither one of them has ever been with anyone else, says their keeper, Stephanie Mitchell.

But the partnership of Wendell and Cass adds drama in another way. They're both male. That is to say, they're gay penguins.

This is not unusual. "There are a lot of animals that have same-sex relations, it's just that people don't know about it," Mitchell said. "I mean, Joe Schmoe on the street is not someone who's read all sorts of biology books."

One particular book is helpful in this case. Bruce Bagemihl's "Biological Exuberance," published in 1999, documents homosexual behavior in more than 450 animal species. The list includes grizzly bears, gorillas, flamingos, owls and even several species of salmon.

"The world is, indeed, teeming with homosexual, bisexual and transgendered creatures of every stripe and feather," Bagemihl writes in the first page of his book. "From the Southeastern Blueberry Bee of the United States to more than 130 different bird species worldwide, the 'birds and the bees,' literally, are queer."

In New York, it's the penguins.

At the Central Park Zoo, Silo and Roy, two male Chinstrap penguins, have been in an exclusive relationship for four years. Last mating season, they even fostered an egg together.

"They got all excited when we gave them the egg," said Rob Gramzay, senior keeper for polar birds at the zoo. He took the egg from a young, inexperienced couple that hatched an extra and gave it to Silo and Roy. "And they did a really great job of taking care of the chick and feeding it."

Of the 53 penguins in the Central Park Zoo, Silo and Roy are not the only ones that are gay. In 1997, the park had four pairs of homosexual penguins. In an effort to increase breeding, zookeepers tried to separate them by force. They failed, said Gramzay.

Only one of the eight bonded with a female. The rest went back to same-sex relationships, not necessarily with the same partner. Silo and Roy, long-time homosexuals, got together (or pair-bonded, in official penguin lingo) after that failed experiment.

At the New York Aquarium, no one suspected Wendell and Cass were gay when they first bonded. Penguins don't have external sex organs, so visually there's no surefire way to tell whether they are male or female. But over time, people began to wonder.

In all the years they had been together, neither Wendell nor Cass laid an egg. This was unusual because the keepers knew they copulated regularly. They had often seen Wendell submit to Cass, the more dominating of the two. But one day, a keeper saw Wendell on top.

When penguins have sex, the female lies on her belly and the male climbs on top with his feet and puts his rump around her rump. Then their cloacas (sexual organs) meet, and the sperm is transferred into the female. It's called the cloacal kiss.

Wendell and Cass were clearly kissing both ways. So in 1999, the aquarium did a blood test to determine their gender. It proved they were both male.

Today, they are one of the best couples at the aquarium. "Sometimes they lie on the rocks together," Mitchell said. "They're one of the few couples that like to hang out together outside their nest."

Wendell and Cass have a highly coveted nest. During mating season, several other penguins have tried to steal it. Cass, a fierce fighter, kept them at bay. (Wendell, on the other hand, is "afraid of his own shadow," said Mitchell.)

The appeal of their nest is the location: high up, close to the water and the feeding station. Rumors that they keep the neatest nest at the aquarium because they're gay are not true.

"These are penguins," said Mitchell. "They poop in their nest. Nobody's got a clean nest."

Cute

 

[Eukaryote]

@ZiggyS, Yeah it's cute all right, and it's all the proof I need. I now fully belive in gay animals. I no longer belive in just urges. Ziggy, you may be the only person on this forum to ever change someones mind.

 

[Chukchi Husky]

When my dog humps my leg he isnt being homosexual, he is just trying to fill his urge.

I see plenty of boy-dog-on-boy-dog activity at the dog park

That's a form of dominating behaviour.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

@ZiggyS, Yeah it's cute all right, and it's all the proof I need. I now fully belive in gay animals. I no longer belive in just urges. Ziggy, you may be the only person on this forum to ever change someones mind.

Thanks, but the penguins deserve the credit, I'm just the messenger!

I was searching for another article on them penguins. There was a story about how two of the male penguins in that article found a rock that looked a bit like an egg and they had been breeding on it for months. With it was a picture of two penguins looking puzzled at the rock.

But it's clear it wasn't all about sex with them penguins but also about companionship.

 

[Bozo Erectus]

Do you belive animals can be homosexual?

Sure they can. Last time I checked (I check regularly) humans are animals.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Sure they can. Last time I checked (I check regularly) humans are animals.

We have just been Watsonned